World Cup venues announcement

[Just Browny]

31 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

Ha ha...

Wiganers will be knocked over in the crush as Widnes, Saints and Warrington fans flock past them to get to Bolton. Meantime, Leigh and Salford will be ghost towns.

Wigan will continue to keep on working in the community, creating its own "legacy" and producing players for the England team.

If I was you I would choke back on your thin humour and start wondering where the RFL will fritter away it's dollop of Sport England money. 

Don't forget cheating on the salary cap.

[Angelic Cynic]

15 hours ago, scotchy1 said:

Im not sure that the difference in SL between this season and last is down to money, nor the unambitious return to Bolton for what is now a triple header further cheapening the challenge cup, along with the 1895 cup doing the same for the final, the idiotic PR disaster that was the attempt to charge certain clubs to enter the challenge cup.

Nor do i think you can put the clusterwhoopsie that is the GB tour at the end of this year down to a lack of funds, the lack of any at all whatsoever in any way shape or form happening with the 9s world cup we are entered in at the end of this year cant be put down to money either.

Im also not sure that you can put down the simple fact that the RLWC has managed to announce the stadia three years out but the ashes tour being still a little up in the air can be put down to money either. Im not sure what we have seen from SL or the RLWC team has cost much if anything at all in terms of cash out of the door.

I dont think any of it is really down to money, i'd accept that not all of it is down to competence (Though Ralph Rimmer has does nothing in all his time at the RFL that would make me think he can put his shoes on the right feet without a bit of help) and some of it is down to the governance of the RFL and the different directions it is pulled in, Elstone and Dutton have both benefited from a clear, defined, focus whereas everything in the RFL is a bit woolly and vague and needs to be fudged. But a lot of it is down to competence as well.

Ill throw this out there, the venues for the Ashes series should be Emirates, Bramall Lane, Anfield. Put on great events there in 2020 and we are starting half way up the ladder in 2021. RFL could do that tomorrow at no real cost

   I must disagree.Money is the main driver - as is the Northern Powerhouse instruction on how to allocate the money.

   The RFL are hardly flush at the moment,if recent reports are to be accepted.

   Yesterdays announcement received political plaudits - https://www.gov.uk/government/news/northern-powerhouse-at-the-heart-of-rugby-league-world-cup-2021

[The Hallucinating Goose]

Just noticed on the world cup website that it says tickets will go on sale in late 2020.

[Moove]

27 minutes ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

Just noticed on the world cup website that it says tickets will go on sale in late 2020.

Think they're advertising for a commercial director and ticketing partner at the moment so there are a fair few organisational things to get sorted first. Might be a good opportunity to establish a waiting list for tickets in the meantime though and build up demand.

[thehullram]

37 minutes ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

Just noticed on the world cup website that it says tickets will go on sale in late 2020.

That’s disappointing, hoped it would be 2 years ahead 

[Exiled Wiganer]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

Whilst I agree with your overall point about Wigan supporting the game, and I do like the DW Stadium a lot to watch RL, we can't just ignore the quality of the bids, and we must assume that the bid wasn't strong enough for the QF.

Bottom line is important, and there is no reason to suggest that we won't fill Bolton, but would fill Wigan, and if we get a lot more money for doing so, then that is a compelling reason for Bolton.

Wigan has contributed constantly to the bottom line, year in and year out. We have done more than pretty much any town to support our game internationally. That would not be discounted in any rational decision making process. 

If Bolton is full it will need a lot of Wiganers. Now, they can do what they like, but to deliberately get offside a town which is a bedrock for developing players and supporting the game for, what, an extra 3k of potential tickets, is short sighted. Meanwhile, we flog the dead horse that is Coventry, and fill Wasps’ pockets. 

Any empty seats at Bolton will be a silent testimony to the short sighted stupidity of this decision. 

[Leeds Wire]

17 hours ago, Padge said:

The ground has its own station that is only used on match days, I just hope someone points out that there is a game on to the rail companies.

To get to the ground by train you would have to get to Bolton first, Wiganers going by train would actually go past the ground about the same distance as the ground is from Wigan and then double back.  Car access is easy as the ground is just off an M61 junction, but car parking is very limited.

 

 

I have to disagree with your last comment - I drove there for the cup semi last year (sold-out) and there were hundreds of empty parking spaces in the retail park right next to the stadium, with absolutely no restrictions and free of charge. 

People around us couldn't believe their luck and thought it was too good to be true.

[Exiled Wiganer]

7 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

It’s smaller than the stadiums in Coventry and Middlesbrough, both of which will be used for group games.

Indeed, and will be lucky to get 10k between them. 

[gingerjon]

1 hour ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

Just noticed on the world cup website that it says tickets will go on sale in late 2020.

Oh, that's a bit annoying. I'd hoped it would around the time the draw was confirmed later this year.

[gingerjon]

2 hours ago, Exiled Wiganer said:

My view is that we have earned over many years the right to host a game in the World Cup. 

Clearly not.

[Exiled Wiganer]

Just now, gingerjon said:

Clearly not.

No, that is clearly my view. I just checked.

There are many good things about this draw, and I am sure it will be a great success, but the conspicuously stupid deciosns from where I am sitting are: 

- bothering with Wasps ground; 

- Middlesbrough; and 

- Wigan not getting a game. Incidentally, I would feel the same were Leeds not getting a game. It only takes 2 minutes perusal of internationals played in years gone by to see that Wigan are far ahead of anyone bar Leeds in supporting the game. Plus, of course, we have a thriving junior and achoold set up (I appreciate some readers of this may not realise that league can even be played in schools in your town), all of whom you could easily build a great RLWC story around. 

I am looking forward to the Arsenal game. And think Newcastle is a great choice for the first game.

[gingerjon]

2 minutes ago, Exiled Wiganer said:

No, that is clearly my view. I just checked.

There are many good things about this draw, and I am sure it will be a great success, but the conspicuously stupid deciosns from where I am sitting are: 

- bothering with Wasps ground; 

- Middlesbrough; and 

- Wigan not getting a game. Incidentally, I would feel the same were Leeds not getting a game. It only takes 2 minutes perusal of internationals played in years gone by to see that Wigan are far ahead of anyone bar Leeds in supporting the game. Plus, of course, we have a thriving junior and achoold set up (I appreciate some readers of this may not realise that league can even be played in schools in your town), all of whom you could easily build a great RLWC story around. 

I am looking forward to the Arsenal game. And think Newcastle is a great choice for the first game.

Yes, I was just needling you.

Middlesbrough is the only one I'd point at and need explaining to me so I assume the deal is decent. Coventry is a reasonable choice for the midlands and, as football is a bigger enemy to our popularity with the general public than union, I don't much mind throwing a few quid into the basketcase that is Wasps.

But, clearly, Wigan, for whatever reason, did a really poor job of selling itself. That could be political, or it could be because the bid went something like, "We're Wigan, we are rugby league, so which games do we get?" Or it could be because there have been issues with confirmed rugby league bookings enough to make the organising committee want to avoid an issue - especially when they may have to deal with an issue in Workington.

Either way, it's beyond parochial to decide that having virtually all the games within a 90 minute drive of your town is an insurmountable barrier to attending (which I know you haven't but seems to be the argument from some).

[Dave T]

31 minutes ago, Exiled Wiganer said:

Wigan has contributed constantly to the bottom line, year in and year out. We have done more than pretty much any town to support our game internationally. That would not be discounted in any rational decision making process. 

If Bolton is full it will need a lot of Wiganers. Now, they can do what they like, but to deliberately get offside a town which is a bedrock for developing players and supporting the game for, what, an extra 3k of potential tickets, is short sighted. Meanwhile, we flog the dead horse that is Coventry, and fill Wasps’ pockets. 

Any empty seats at Bolton will be a silent testimony to the short sighted stupidity of this decision. 

If Wiganers take their ball home because the World Cup is not being delivered to their doorstep, then that is a pretty major dummy spit and does not reflect well on this legendary Wigan support.

[Just Browny]

34 minutes ago, Exiled Wiganer said:

Wigan has contributed constantly to the bottom line, year in and year out.

Although sometimes there is a discrepancy between the figure on the bottom line and what is on the lines above.

[Exiled Wiganer]

5 minutes ago, Dave T said:

If Wiganers take their ball home because the World Cup is not being delivered to their doorstep, then that is a pretty major dummy spit and does not reflect well on this legendary Wigan support.

That is a leap, though, from my point.

1) it isn’t legendary, it is a fact. Look it up; 

2) as I am sure you will have experienced first hand, you will find wiganers in numbers at international games wherever they are played;

3) if you have somewhere which you rely on when you are desperate to sell as many tickets as possible, as the RFL have done from time immemorial with Wigan, it is short sighted and stupid not to find a way to show a game at the DW; 

4) with a finite marketing budget and having to try and sell tickets at hard sell places, Wigan was a guaranteed low investment high reward venue; plus 

5) if the game is interested in growing the game and deepening its grass roots, then there is far more to be gained from having Wigan as a host and focal point for its schools and juniors, rather than playing in Bolton, a place as likely to produce players as the moon. 

[Padge]

26 minutes ago, Leeds Wire said:

I have to disagree with your last comment - I drove there for the cup semi last year (sold-out) and there were hundreds of empty parking spaces in the retail park right next to the stadium, with absolutely no restrictions and free of charge. 

People around us couldn't believe their luck and thought it was too good to be true.

I would be wary of using the retail park, they use ANPR to make sure you don't outstay your welcome and have 'zealous' parking attendants. Other car parks nearby, leisure centre for example who use ANPR, will certainly ticket unwelcome guests.

[RP London]

46 minutes ago, Exiled Wiganer said:

1.Wigan has contributed constantly to the bottom line, year in and year out. We have done more than pretty much any town to support our game internationally. That would not be discounted in any rational decision making process. 

2. If Bolton is full it will need a lot of Wiganers. Now, they can do what they like, but to deliberately get offside a town which is a bedrock for developing players and supporting the game for, what, an extra 3k of potential tickets, is short sighted. Meanwhile, we flog the dead horse that is Coventry, and fill Wasps’ pockets. 

3. Any empty seats at Bolton will be a silent testimony to the short sighted stupidity of this decision. 

1. It could well be what would have swung it your way if the bids were close but there is no way the "what we have done for you in the past" should have anything to do with it if you are not prepared to help/prepare a good enough bid in the present

2. excellent, in that case they are not losing anything by having it at Bolton because those people are still going, but what they do gain is whatever extra Bolton have bid for the match and the extra ticket sales.. sounds like a very sound decision in that case. Coventry is a city with a league one team that is growing quite nicely, there is also potential (and has been for a while) for Wasps to look to expand their empire so keeping them "onside" may not be the worst choice.. some RU clubs are supportive or RL and Wasps look to be trying to grow in a Barcelona/Real Madrid style of multpisports.. not necessarily a bad thing.

3. Lets hope not that many people snub a perfectly good world cup match just because they are cheesed off that their club and council cannot put together a good enough bid that they think they are somehow better than anyone else.. Lets all hope that they just go to watch a great game of RL which is what it is actually all about. If not then fine, lets not take any further games to Wigan as they are just a bunch of spoilt brats. there are plenty of other stadias that we can use. 

[Exiled Wiganer]

Rather than quote a long quote, I do not know what was in the bids, so perhaps Bolton have guaranteed a huge amount of additional income, regardless of relative crowd figures. 

The point about the past is simple enough - when the RFL have needed full houses in hard sell series, time and again Wigan have delivered. That is not an opinion, it is a fact. 

If you think a better case on any basis can be made for giving money to Wasps over wigan, then it is hard to know how to reply. 

As to Wiganers being spoilt brats, again, have a look at which towns have turned up to watch internationals over the last 4 decades. When the game has needed us, we have been there time and again. 

[RP London]

9 minutes ago, Exiled Wiganer said:

1. Rather than quote a long quote, I do not know what was in the bids, so perhaps Bolton have guaranteed a huge amount of additional income, regardless of relative crowd figures. 

2. The point about the past is simple enough - when the RFL have needed full houses in hard sell series, time and again Wigan have delivered. That is not an opinion, it is a fact. 

3. If you think a better case on any basis can be made for giving money to Wasps over wigan, then it is hard to know how to reply. 

4 As to Wiganers being spoilt brats, again, have a look at which towns have turned up to watch internationals over the last 4 decades. When the game has needed us, we have been there time and again. 

1. the operative phrase being "i do not know what was in the bids".. however, the people that did have chosen Bolton over Wigan so I thinks it fair to assume (unless we are going to be overly snidey and call them corrupt in one shape or another) that the Bolton bid is significantly better.

2. not done out of the goodness of their hearts though, they will have got a nice rent for the stadium etc.. lets not be going down the road of "we helped you" rubbish.. they got a nice payment out of it and the RFL wanted it in a nice stadium, which is understandable.. and they may well go back but this time around you have missed out by putting a poor bid in, in the same way as you may well have gained in the past by putting good offers together.. swings and roundabouts

3. I doubt it was ever Wigan vs Wasps it was Wigan vs Leigh or Wigan vs Bolton so why not stop arguing an argument that most likely never existed.. more likely Wasps v Cardiff or Bristol (if they bid) or a second london game (if they bid)

4. but yet you are saying "wah we want a game why didnt you give us a game, look what we have done for you in the past wah" which is the definition of being a spoilt brat. You didnt give a good enough bid, you lost, you will possibly/probably get an international in the next year or so (if we have any home one) if you bid for it.. but this time around you ballsed it up.. 

again it doesnt matter what you have done in the past it is about what is happening right now that is important for this world cup.

[Rupert Prince]

2 hours ago, RP London said:

sorry but in a bidding process you haven't "earned" anything. if the bid is not strong enough then it is not strong enough.. if anyone in Wigan was feeling "entitled" to the game, so bidding less, then they are idiots. The person doing the game in your town a disservice is whoever thought that being in Wigan was worth more than being anywhere else just because it is Wigan.

The bottom line for a world cup is hugely important and is key for the success of a world cup.. post season international matches are a slightly different matter, but equally if Bolton or anywhere else is a success, then maybe they wont need to "go crawling back" to Wigan in the future. The international game can grown from something like this and Wigan may well be way down on the list in the coming years as the international game has to go to bigger venues... that is the hope of everyone surely.. (certainly I dont want international matches in small stadiums, I want them to be banging the door down of 30k+ stadiums in the next few years because of the success of the world cup) 

Those who feel entitled to things often see the world zoom past them as they dont move with the times.. there are plenty of example in sport and life of that happening. 

That's rubbish.

[RP London]

9 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

That's rubbish.

thanks for the reasoned response.. always a pleasure debating with you Donald.

[Exiled Wiganer]

46 minutes ago, RP London said:

1. the operative phrase being "i do not know what was in the bids".. however, the people that did have chosen Bolton over Wigan so I thinks it fair to assume (unless we are going to be overly snidey and call them corrupt in one shape or another) that the Bolton bid is significantly better.

2. not done out of the goodness of their hearts though, they will have got a nice rent for the stadium etc.. lets not be going down the road of "we helped you" rubbish.. they got a nice payment out of it and the RFL wanted it in a nice stadium, which is understandable.. and they may well go back but this time around you have missed out by putting a poor bid in, in the same way as you may well have gained in the past by putting good offers together.. swings and roundabouts

3. I doubt it was ever Wigan vs Wasps it was Wigan vs Leigh or Wigan vs Bolton so why not stop arguing an argument that most likely never existed.. more likely Wasps v Cardiff or Bristol (if they bid) or a second london game (if they bid)

4. but yet you are saying "wah we want a game why didnt you give us a game, look what we have done for you in the past wah" which is the definition of being a spoilt brat. You didnt give a good enough bid, you lost, you will possibly/probably get an international in the next year or so (if we have any home one) if you bid for it.. but this time around you ballsed it up.. 

again it doesnt matter what you have done in the past it is about what is happening right now that is important for this world cup.

1) we don’t know. All we know is Wigan bid. If I was running the World Cup, I would give considerable weight to factors such as likely legacy, loyalty to the game in the past, ease of marketing, and likely relationship going forward. I have no idea how much weight were given to these factors, but am conjecting that a way could and should have been found to put a game on at the Piedome. If we want to inspire the next generation, then making it easier for that generation to watch the game has a benefit beyond cash. I accept it is a judgement call. And our views differ on the call taken; 

2) Wigan do help the game. Not always the club, but the town. It is not rubbish, look at where the players we all watch come from. The arrangement was valuable to the RFL in hard sell series, and could well be again, and that should have a value to any sensible business. Of course, as someone suggested, it would be great if England never had to play in a ground as small as Wigan’s again, and I look forward to that day. Bolton is only 1000 bigger, though, so that is not the point here.

3) I don’t want to conflate the arguments, but I have argued for years that paying Wasps is self defeating madness. I had hoped that we learnt from the dire double header debacle a few years ago, but clearly not. I take your point though that it would have been better to have another game in London, a genuine heartland, and much closer to me. 

4) this is covered elsewhere. Our opinions differ. 

Now, I have written far more words explaining why the decision not to award Wigan a game is short sighted, but far too few on the good points... clarity, logic, visibility, very few logistical challenges, a lovely showpiece semi final for the main supporters of the international game, a sense of planning and measured control. Dutton knows what he is doing, and I for one am delighted with the emphasis on the major northern cities - Liverpool and Newcastle - which offer great potential growth for us. Plus, of course, having the 3 world cups simultaneously, with the wonderful city of York prominent.

After 2017 fell so far short of its potential, all the signs are good for 2021 to be the natural successor to 2013. 

 

[Just Browny]

EW is going to feel so much better when he realises how far the Uni of Bolton Stadium (6 miles), Leigh Sports Village (7 miles), Totally Wicked Stadium (10 miles) and Halliwell Jones (12 miles) are from Wigan.

[AB Knight]

A bit disappointed York haven't been selected to host a men's game but overall a good selection of stadiums. I just feel it would have been just reward for the work put into the club over the past few years. I'm all for matches in Cumbria but find it strange they've chosen to stage 3 matches at a ground which has yet to be built. Not a dig at Workington, passionate fans plus they have a beach which might've swung it! Maybe York are on a 'waiting list' if the stadium at Workington doesn't happen in time.

But just like the last few years I'm sure the staff at York will make the most of what they have been awarded - 2 women's semi finals which will be sellouts as we showcase the new stadium and our wonderful city to the world. 

I'd also be surprised if the training facilities here aren't used by one of the men's teams too.

Plenty to look forward to.

[Exiled Wiganer]

14 minutes ago, Just Browny said:

EW is going to feel so much better when he realises how far the Uni of Bolton Stadium (6 miles), Leigh Sports Village (7 miles), Totally Wicked Stadium (10 miles) and Halliwell Jones (12 miles) are from Wigan.

Now, I know the pre season is always the best time of year for a Wire. The chance to make a collage of all those It’s Our Year predictions. If only they printed them on tissue paper, they could come in handy in the autumn. But you need not be concerned about my morale when it comes to any World Cup. It was an impossible dream in my pre exile days to have a multi World Cup with any more than 5 nations. I won’t lose sight of how lucky we are to be watching our great game’s biggest event over here in 2 years time.