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Herbie had another good performance against the knights capped off with a last min try - however the 2 huge blunders by Dom Young gave the Broncos a leg up - made some good metres bringing  the ball away but would like to see him break a tackle and get in the clear just for once

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did the bloke who invented the phrase "one hit wonder" invent anything else?

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4 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

Herbie had another good performance against the knights capped off with a last min try - however the 2 huge blunders by Dom Young gave the Broncos a leg up - made some good metres bringing  the ball away but would like to see him break a tackle and get in the clear just for once

That's fair.

Young was good in the first half and carried the ball really well... also forced the Broncos to concede 2 or 3 penalties stopping him getting a quick play the ball.

But two dropped bombs in the second half was part of the reason the Broncos got well on top.

Farnworth was good again in what is becoming a very difficult to beat Broncos team (haven't said that in a while).

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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7 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Peripheral performance from Thompson .

This season is just passing him by. He's not playing badly but if he wasn't a Brit he wouldn't be catching my eye.  You can see he is able to be more effective but it isn't happening. 

Wests are not a good team but the Bulldogs didn't show any sort of bounce you get with a new coach and that is worrying for the rest of the year.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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Just now, Dunbar said:

This season is just passing him by. He's not playing badly but if he wasn't a Brit he wouldn't be catching my eye.  You can see he is able to be more effective but it isn't happening. 

Wests are not a good team but the Bulldogs didn't show any sort of bounce you get with a new coach and that is worrying for the rest of the year.

Indeed . The first half there was just nothing at all . There was players with literally no involvement

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29 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

That's fair.

Young was good in the first half and carried the ball really well... also forced the Broncos to concede 2 or 3 penalties stopping him getting a quick play the ball.

But two dropped bombs in the second half was part of the reason the Broncos got well on top.

Farnworth was good again in what is becoming a very difficult to beat Broncos team (haven't said that in a while).

Young is playing in a very poor knights team but with a centre partner like Gagai we should be seeing him get in the clear and see some of that pace we have all heard about 

did the bloke who invented the phrase "one hit wonder" invent anything else?

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1 minute ago, graveyard johnny said:

Young is playing in a very poor knights team but with a centre partner like Gagai we should be seeing him get in the clear and see some of that pace we have all heard about 

To be fair, you wouldn't class Gagai as a classic wingers centre as his strength is his own running threat... but yes, it would be nice to see Young in space with some grass in front of him to test out his pace.  

The speed he was moving to chop down Cobbo was impressive but you want to see it in attack.

I remain convinced that Young will end but being a quality right centre rather than wing.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Dunbar said:

That's fair.

Young was good in the first half and carried the ball really well... also forced the Broncos to concede 2 or 3 penalties stopping him getting a quick play the ball.

But two dropped bombs in the second half was part of the reason the Broncos got well on top.

Farnworth was good again in what is becoming a very difficult to beat Broncos team (haven't said that in a while).

I was particularly impressed with how he carried the ball coming out of his own end. The way he careened into the line and fought to get up brought a penalty.

I only remember one of the knock-ons (I might have been away from my TV and missed the other) and it was an error, but not a glaring, awful one. Just one of those contests where the ball came free...

That first half was up there with the best I've seen from him. Newcastle were on the end of one or two questionable calls (I thought the try in the corner was fine) and seemed off in the second half, but really promising signs from Young.

Herbie solid and classy on the other side. Nothing spectacular but he turned in another assured performance. Him and Percival for England's centres, as far as I'm concerned.

Edited by StandOffHalf
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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

I was particularly impressed with how he carried the ball coming out of his own end. The way he careened into the line and fought to get up brought a penalty.

I only remember one of the knock-ons (I might have been away from my TV and missed the other) and it was an error, but not a glaring, awful one. Just one of those contests where the ball came free...

That first half was up there with the best I've seen from him. Newcastle were on the end of one or two questionable calls and seemed off in the second half, but really promisings signs from Young.

Herbie solid and classy on the other side. Nothing spectacular but he turned in another assured performance. Him and Percival for England's centres, as far as I'm concerned.

He was favourite to take both high balls and should have done.  I thought he had a strong game other than that but we have to say those two dropped balls were mistakes.  As you say, he was very good in the first half but I am conscious we can't give Brits a pass on the poor stuff.

Edited by Dunbar
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"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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Was largely impressed by Young, especially in yardage. Fix up on the high balls and improve his defensive reads/support play and he really could be anything.

I do think he's in contention for the world cup but the improvements needed above currently leave him behind Tom Davies for me.

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Harry Rushton got a fair bit of game time this morning for the Raiders in their win over Souths.  He did well enough and mixed it up with the big boys in the middle.

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"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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7 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

Harry Rushton got a fair bit of game time this morning for the Raiders in their win over Souths.  He did well enough and mixed it up with the big boys in the middle.

He looks like he’s got something about him . Athletic build , strong runner and a bit of skill . Comfortable linking the play and very busy in attack and defence . Be interesting seeing him develop 

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8 minutes ago, DavidM said:

He looks like he’s got something about him . Athletic build , strong runner and a bit of skill . Comfortable linking the play and very busy in attack and defence . Be interesting seeing him develop 

I would like to have seen him play on the edge as he did in his junior days before the Raiders moved him to the middle... to compare his potential in both.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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On 20/05/2022 at 22:25, Dunbar said:

He was favourite to take both high balls and should have done.  I thought he had a strong game other than that but we have to say those two dropped balls were mistakes.  As you say, he was very good in the first half but I am conscious we can't give Brits a pass on the poor stuff.

I seriously don't get this obsession with Young -I've seen nothing to indicate he's going to be anything special. If you class driving the ball in and making metres a good performance from a winger then you & I have very different expectations of what a winger is on the field to do.

If his size & strength are his main attribute then he should be judged on how many times he actually comes out the other side of one of those drives and makes the break. If you look at the other big powerful wingers in the NRL they consistently make tackle busts & breaks - Young doesn't.

If its speed as his asset then I'd judge how good a winger is on how well he can use that speed to burn his opposite on the outside and round the FB - Can't say i've seen Young do this either.

If people want to talk about an inexperienced teenage winger who's actually making an impression then it should be someone like QareQare at Cas. His performances are what i'd want to see from a young winger.

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1 minute ago, Saint Toppy said:

I seriously don't get this obsession with Young -I've seen nothing to indicate he's going to be anything special.

Yes, I know you don't, you have made that very clear over the last couple of years.  Even going so far as to make up some stuff about his performance on his debut to try and rubbish him.

1 minute ago, Saint Toppy said:

If you class driving the ball in and making metres a good performance from a winger then you & I have very different expectations of what a winger is on the field to do.

I class this as one of the indicators of a good winger in the modern game.  I am amazed that a fan of Saints who have a game plan that involves the strong carries from their outside backs as one of the building blocks of success would not see this.  Although, I suspect you do recognise it is as key quality in a Saints winger (Makinson?) just not one who you have decided to dislike.

1 minute ago, Saint Toppy said:

If its speed as his asset then I'd judge how good a winger is on how well he can use that speed to burn his opposite on the outside and round the FB - Can't say i've seen Young do this either.

As I said earlier in this thread that I would like to see Young with the ball and some grass in front of him to test his attacking speed/ability.  He has shown good finishing so far but I would like to see him test his speed in the open.

2 minutes ago, Saint Toppy said:

If people want to talk about an inexperienced teenage winger who's actually making an impression then it should be someone like QareQare at Cas. His performances are what i'd want to see from a young winger.

Yes, he looks like a good prospect.  He has bagged 4 tries in his 7 appearances in the Super League and Young has 8 tries from 14 NRL games.

I think they are both quality young wingers and I can't wait to see how they develop.

And finally back to the first point.  I am happy to have a discussion about the abilities and performances of any player but I won't engage with someone who just makes things up to score points - particularly over a young player who has managed to crack an NRL spot so early in his career.  I cannot stand this level of intellectual dishonesty and so I won't be discussing this topic any more with you.

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"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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For me, Johnstone and Makinson should be the starting England wingers this time but would be happy to see Young in the squad. His time might come in the 2025 WC but it is obvious where his trajectory is going. Farnworth of 2 years ago (20) to now is chalk and cheese.

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25 minutes ago, Scubby said:

For me, Johnstone and Makinson should be the starting England wingers this time but would be happy to see Young in the squad. His time might come in the 2025 WC but it is obvious where his trajectory is going. Farnworth of 2 years ago (20) to now is chalk and cheese.

Agreed. But unfortunately, one of those players is a bit like a Rich Tea biscuit after a dunking… 

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1 minute ago, GeordieSaint said:

Agreed. But unfortunately, one of those players is a bit like a Rich Tea biscuit after a dunking… 

Yep, that is always a risk. They need to bring back the magic sponge!

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Posted (edited)
45 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

Yes, I know you don't, you have made that very clear over the last couple of years.  Even going so far as to make up some stuff about his performance on his debut to try and rubbish him.

I class this as one of the indicators of a good winger in the modern game.  I am amazed that a fan of Saints who have a game plan that involves the strong carries from their outside backs as one of the building blocks of success would not see this.  Although, I suspect you do recognise it is as key quality in a Saints winger (Makinson?) just not one who you have decided to dislike.

As I said earlier in this thread that I would like to see Young with the ball and some grass in front of him to test his attacking speed/ability.  He has shown good finishing so far but I would like to see him test his speed in the open.

Yes, he looks like a good prospect.  He has bagged 4 tries in his 7 appearances in the Super League and Young has 8 tries from 14 NRL games.

I think they are both quality young wingers and I can't wait to see how they develop.

And finally back to the first point.  I am happy to have a discussion about the abilities and performances of any player but I won't engage with someone who just makes things up to score points - particularly over a young player who has managed to crack an NRL spot so early in his career.  I cannot stand this level of intellectual dishonesty and so I won't be discussing this topic any more with you.

Good wingers are more than just 'battering rams'. If you want to compare him to Makinson, he puts in the work to try and make yards & help out the forwards, almost every winger does these days, difference is he regularly makes breaks from it, as do the likes of Johnson, Davies, Marshall etc. - Young doesn't.

As for the reply about speed - good wingers can create their own space to then use their pace to beat their opposite - never seen young do this. If he needs someone else to be able to create the space for him then that isn't the sign of a good winger. No point having pace of you can't use it. Many of those try's QareQuare scored he made for himself, using his pace to beat the opposition players - to me that's the sign of a good winger.

You really need to get over this whole "he plays in the NRL so he must be fantastic" obsession. Young isn't fantastic and hasn't shown much to suggest he ever will be. There's young wingers in SL who have already shown much more promise and natural wingers ability than Young has - QareQuare at Cas, Murphy at Wakey & Wrench at Wire to name but 3. If I had the option to pick a young promising winger to join an international squad i'd pick any of those 3 before Young

Edited by Saint Toppy

St.Helens - The Home of Rugby Champions

Saints Men's team - Triple Champions & Double Winners ; Saints Women's team - Treble Winners ; Thatto Heath - National Conference Champions

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Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, DavidM said:

Could Dom Young be a centre option , he has the attributes to play there 

He will be a right centre I think... Good hands and running.

Edited by Dunbar

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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Just now, Dunbar said:

He will be a right centre I think... Good hands and running.

He’s strong in contact as well defensively and offensively , and could certainly give an opposite number problems . 

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