ckn Posted February 21, 2019 Author Share Posted February 21, 2019 56 minutes ago, RidingPie said: She's coming across very well. One thing about the new party is it has some people in it who are very good at talking to the public. She's not doing what Emily Thornberry did on Tuesday of refusing to discuss the elephant in the room. She's taking it right to the very Kipper-heavy call-in list and going point-to-point with them making them look utterly stupid. James O'Brien would be proud of how she's taking it to them... "When in deadly danger, when beset by doubt; run in little circles, wave your arms and shout" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RidingPie Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 8 minutes ago, ckn said: She's not doing what Emily Thornberry did on Tuesday of refusing to discuss the elephant in the room. She's taking it right to the very Kipper-heavy call-in list and going point-to-point with them making them look utterly stupid. James O'Brien would be proud of how she's taking it to them... She's not shying from the tough questions. Kudos for that regardless of whether you agree with her or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff9of13 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 18 minutes ago, ckn said: She's not doing what Emily Thornberry did on Tuesday of refusing to discuss the elephant in the room. She's taking it right to the very Kipper-heavy call-in list and going point-to-point with them making them look utterly stupid. James O'Brien would be proud of how she's taking it to them... She is something of a 'KIPer magnet this morning isn't she? All very shouty with obviously closed ears and minds and refusing to engage with her whatsoever. "it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tim2 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Some of my Labour supporting friends are definitely overdoing the sharing of stuff from Momentum/Canary type sites attacking the 8 "traitors". It's not endearing me to the party in the slightest. It reminds me of Christians taking on atheists or Muslims wishing death on people who renounce Islam. What's the problem? If your message is so great and they're a relatively small number of idiots who are "wrong" then just ignore them. "I am the avenging angel; I come with wings unfurled, I come with claws extended from halfway round the world. I am the God Almighty, I am the howling wind. I care not for your family; I care not for your kin. I come in search of terror, though terror is my own; I come in search of vengeance for crimes and crimes unknown. I care not for your children, I care not for your wives, I care not for your country, I care not for your lives." - (c) Jim Boyes - "The Avenging Angel" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RidingPie Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 I've had to stop listening but I don't think Sourby has done herself any harm by hosting the show, and may have won a few people over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckn Posted February 21, 2019 Author Share Posted February 21, 2019 9 minutes ago, tim2 said: Some of my Labour supporting friends are definitely overdoing the sharing of stuff from Momentum/Canary type sites attacking the 8 "traitors". It's not endearing me to the party in the slightest. It reminds me of Christians taking on atheists or Muslims wishing death on people who renounce Islam. What's the problem? If your message is so great and they're a relatively small number of idiots who are "wrong" then just ignore them. I've been de-friended by a couple for saying "Surely that means Corbyn is a traitor given he's voted with the Tories more than almost any other Labour MP in history when he was a back bench MP?" "When in deadly danger, when beset by doubt; run in little circles, wave your arms and shout" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RidingPie Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 minute ago, ckn said: I've been de-friended by a couple for saying "Surely that means Corbyn is a traitor given he's voted with the Tories more than almost any other Labour MP in history when he was a back bench MP?" That may be part of the reason I've left facebook... that and my brother being captain UKIP and posting nonesense like "the Irish boarder is only being made a problem by the EU, Switzerland boarders 5 EU countries and doesn't have boarders" and his next post saying we can't remain part of the single market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff9of13 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 18 minutes ago, tim2 said: Some of my Labour supporting friends are definitely overdoing the sharing of stuff from Momentum/Canary type sites attacking the 8 "traitors". It's not endearing me to the party in the slightest. It reminds me of Christians taking on atheists or Muslims wishing death on people who renounce Islam. What's the problem? If your message is so great and they're a relatively small number of idiots who are "wrong" then just ignore them. And when they say that they are "non entities" and that no one is bothered about them and that they don't matter you have to ask yourself why have the Corbyn fluffers being pouring so much energy into trying to smear them over the last four days; it's like the Tories have been completely supplanted as the "enemy" by the TIG. They doth protest too much, methinks. "it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RidingPie Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Neither of the big two parties wants a breakthrough or a change in politics. Turkeys and Christmas spring to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff9of13 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 minute ago, RidingPie said: Neither of the big two parties wants a breakthrough or a change in politics. Turkeys and Christmas spring to mind. Absolutely. It's also why they have always avoided electoral reform and PR like the plague as that would break their monopoly. "it is a well known fact that those people who most want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrone Shoelaces Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 3 hours ago, Martyn Sadler said: One slightly curious thing about Heidi Allen is that she appears to be the only MP who doesn't reveal details about where she went to school. I took an interest in this because her CV does say she grew up in Notton, which is a very pleasant village near Wakefield, so I was curious about whether she attended the same school as my kids. But she seems to have blanked all information about which school she attended. It seems a little odd to do that when most other MPs are only too happy to give out that information. Another curious thing is although she's a Europhile her knowledge of foreign languages must be minimal. Even with my rudimentary knowledge of the Spanish language I know that the the three woman should be known as " amigas " not " amigos ". Maybe she was home schooled, it would explain a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrone Shoelaces Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 32 minutes ago, RidingPie said: That may be part of the reason I've left facebook... that and my brother being captain UKIP and posting nonesense like "the Irish boarder is only being made a problem by the EU, Switzerland boarders 5 EU countries and doesn't have boarders" and his next post saying we can't remain part of the single market. You can chose most things in life but not your family unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Homer Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 46 minutes ago, tim2 said: Some of my Labour supporting friends are definitely overdoing the sharing of stuff from Momentum/Canary type sites attacking the 8 "traitors". It's not endearing me to the party in the slightest. It reminds me of Christians taking on atheists or Muslims wishing death on people who renounce Islam. What's the problem? If your message is so great and they're a relatively small number of idiots who are "wrong" then just ignore them. Not really, both the Labour and Tory breakaway MPs are currently holding seats under false pretenses, which needs to be addressed but won't be because of the apparent cowardice of those involved. The comparison with religious zealots isn't remotely accurate as none of them have renounced their ideology, they have just left their parties based either on a single policy issue in the case of the Tories or seemingly very little tangible in the case of the ex-Labour MPs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrone Shoelaces Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 45 minutes ago, ckn said: I've been de-friended by a couple for saying "Surely that means Corbyn is a traitor given he's voted with the Tories more than almost any other Labour MP in history when he was a back bench MP?" I wouldn't be throwing " traitor " around too lightly. Save that for real traitors. My views on the Labour MP's who have just left is they can't really be traitors because they weren't Socialists in the first place. I knew exactly how they'd behave when the going got tough and they've not let me down so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tim2 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, Evil Homer said: Not really, both the Labour and Tory breakaway MPs are currently holding seats under false pretenses, which needs to be addressed but won't be because of the apparent cowardice of those involved. The comparison with religious zealots isn't remotely accurate as none of them have renounced their ideology, they have just left their parties based either on a single policy issue in the case of the Tories or seemingly very little tangible in the case of the ex-Labour MPs. Just keep digging, those votes won't lose themselves. "I am the avenging angel; I come with wings unfurled, I come with claws extended from halfway round the world. I am the God Almighty, I am the howling wind. I care not for your family; I care not for your kin. I come in search of terror, though terror is my own; I come in search of vengeance for crimes and crimes unknown. I care not for your children, I care not for your wives, I care not for your country, I care not for your lives." - (c) Jim Boyes - "The Avenging Angel" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckn Posted February 21, 2019 Author Share Posted February 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said: I wouldn't be throwing " traitor " around too lightly. Save that for real traitors. My views on the Labour MP's who have just left is they can't really be traitors because they weren't Socialists in the first place. I knew exactly how they'd behave when the going got tough and they've not let me down so far. I agree entirely. It's a vile word, I'm just losing patience with seeing intolerant dross like this and have been known to send it back to them reworded to see them get all upset. The sort of stuff I'd be really unhappy with as a moderator if I saw someone else doing it "When in deadly danger, when beset by doubt; run in little circles, wave your arms and shout" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Decimus Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 3 hours ago, RidingPie said: She's coming across very well. One thing about the new party is it has some people in it who are very good at talking to the public. I was amazed how she was able to be so reasonable. There were at least two callers where I'd have lost it (the woman claiming we've voted Brexit 3 times and the guy who kept insisting it was a sinister plot) and I'm a rather mild-mannered person. A Widnesian in Ireland blog What is the best system for Super League? An honest appraisal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Decimus Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 3 hours ago, Tommygilf said: IMO I completely understand where these MPs are coming from, particularly those in labour highlighting the anti-Semitism around the party. This is from a Leave supporting Labour member by the way. The issue I have with the group in general is that they should have done this before the GE in 2017. Labour's problems are well documented but splits are on a variety of lines rather than the tories who seem mostly to be split on just Brexit. Anyone who thinks these MPs opinions on Brexit, the Left of the Labour Party, the ERG etc have changed in the past 18 months is being a little disingenuous imo. Integrity would have meant that as an MP I could not have stood on the two parties manifestoes' at the last election and would have stood independently or for the Lib Dems, who for all they're flaws, are at least open in their intention to stop Brexit. I agree that the timing is a little strange. It is probably too late to do anything about Brexit but I'm not sure before the last election was the right time either. Corbyn's success was out of the blue and had he got the expected pummeling, it could've been the end of the far left for a while. The somewhat inevitable march towards a no-deal Brexit is what I think has forced the issue. A number of them can't just sit back and be part of it. A Widnesian in Ireland blog What is the best system for Super League? An honest appraisal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrone Shoelaces Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 22 minutes ago, ckn said: I agree entirely. It's a vile word, I'm just losing patience with seeing intolerant dross like this and have been known to send it back to them reworded to see them get all upset. The sort of stuff I'd be really unhappy with as a moderator if I saw someone else doing it I'm not on Facebook or Twitter, I waste enough time on here to be honest. If I was I think you've got to be able to take the rough with the smooth in debates. You've also got to realise that things can get heated and some of the time people get a bit over excited and say things or use words they don't really mean. It'd take more than that for me to " un-friend " a pal or workmate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Decimus Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 hour ago, RidingPie said: Neither of the big two parties wants a breakthrough or a change in politics. Turkeys and Christmas spring to mind. This is of course true. Electoral reform isn't a right vs left issues, but a self-interest issue. It's not surprise that Labour and the Tories don't want reform but that the Lib Dems and UKIP did. A Widnesian in Ireland blog What is the best system for Super League? An honest appraisal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ckn Posted February 21, 2019 Author Share Posted February 21, 2019 1 minute ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said: I'm not on Facebook or Twitter, I waste enough time on here to be honest. If I was I think you've got to be able to take the rough with the smooth in debates. You've also got to realise that things can get heated and some of the time people get a bit over excited and say things or use words they don't really mean. It'd take more than that for me to " un-friend " a pal or workmate. In modern "snowflake" terminology, Facebook is my "safe space". I say neither quoted points in any derogatory term. I like Facebook as it is with my friends and family as it's a place I can go without seeing lots of politics, nasty stuff and so on. I quite like seeing friends' photos of what they're up to, family updates and so on. I'd like at least one space I can do that sort of stuff and have put a few people on the "ignore" list on there to achieve that, the thing where they're still marked as friends but I don't see their content, that way they don't get huffy I've unfriended them "When in deadly danger, when beset by doubt; run in little circles, wave your arms and shout" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bedford Roughyed Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 36 minutes ago, Evil Homer said: Not really, both the Labour and Tory breakaway MPs are currently holding seats under false pretenses, which needs to be addressed but won't be because of the apparent cowardice of those involved. And how's your nearly year long campaign against Jared O'Mara going? I must of missed your outrage on that one. With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus Decimus Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 37 minutes ago, Evil Homer said: Not really, both the Labour and Tory breakaway MPs are currently holding seats under false pretenses, which needs to be addressed but won't be because of the apparent cowardice of those involved. The comparison with religious zealots isn't remotely accurate as none of them have renounced their ideology, they have just left their parties based either on a single policy issue in the case of the Tories or seemingly very little tangible in the case of the ex-Labour MPs. How many times does it need pointing out that we vote for a person not a party? The two main parties are more than happy to push this agenda because it allows them to bully any new party out of existence and maintain their monopoly on power. If they want to change to a system where we vote for a party and then distribute seats accordingly, I'm sure the IG would be more than happy to oblige. The fact that you are unable to see why they left Labour says a great deal. A Widnesian in Ireland blog What is the best system for Super League? An honest appraisal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Homer Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 46 minutes ago, tim2 said: Just keep digging, those votes won't lose themselves. For about the 5th time on here, I'm not a Labour candidate or even a Labour member. I have no affiliation to the Labour party at all so I'm not sure why you think I'm representing them in some way or should be trying to win them votes. And I'd really love to know what part of my post you think was 'digging' or would lose anyone any votes. Apart from that I maybe said some things that were truthful that you didn't like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Private Baldrick Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 10 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said: How many times does it need pointing out that we vote for a person not a party? The two main parties are more than happy to push this agenda because it allows them to bully any new party out of existence and maintain their monopoly on power. If they want to change to a system where we vote for a party and then distribute seats accordingly, I'm sure the IG would be more than happy to oblige. The fact that you are unable to see why they left Labour says a great deal. But for which party that person represents is a real issue and a reason for voting for that person in the first place, otherwise every candidate would be independent. People vote for the candidate of a party because they align themselves to that particular party more so than the individual representing that party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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