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Ben Flower and why he hasn’t played for Wales in 5 years.


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I'm disappointed in Ben Flower, for not turning out for Wales, but you can't ''force'' him to play.

As a Nation, we have to pick the best blokes we've got (that make themselves available) and put our best foot forward.

The blokes involved here deserve the right to represent Wales, if they are our best players, even if we can't compete with tier one nations.

I like the idea of an international ''squash ladder'' where teams play others of a similar standard, (above and below them in the ladder) as a means of establishing their rankings in the world. It would make for competitive matches and all that that offers as a means of building the game in Wales.

Then, I think it's a mistake to reward a player with a GB cap, if he refuses to represent his home Nation.

To do so, insults everyone else here in Wales and officially undermines the credibility of any new National teams, the world over. 

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3 hours ago, deluded pom? said:

I was just going by what someone posted in the GB & I thread.

Yes I know I wasn’t having a dig at you DP, I was criticising the mentality of the not playing for GB thing! ?

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19 hours ago, 17 stone giant said:

You can't expect them to slog away playing for Wales in ###### matches in front of one man and his sheepdog

Edited, etc.

                                                                     Hull FC....The Sons of God...
                                                                     (Well, we are about to be crucified on Good Friday)
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3 hours ago, scotchy1 said:

People wouldn't really watch and players wouldn't really play.

A big problem that RL has is that we are trying to put in place structures mirroring those which other sports put in place in the Victorian era. Just as those sports start moving away from those structures toward a more holistic structure.

We need to be more imaginative and not be afraid of something uniquely Rugby League. 

The euros/world cup now nations league cycle is uniquely football. You dont find a 6 nations concept outside RU, the Ryder Cup is uniquely golf. We should create and international cycle that is imaginative and unique and recognisable as Rugby League.

 

I’m curious, what would you suggest? 

Maybe groups of 5 - 4 fixtures per year (2 mid season, 2 post season). Relegation between each group?

Who knows? Just curious how RL can be different.

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10 hours ago, welshmagpie said:

I’m curious, what would you suggest? 

Maybe groups of 5 - 4 fixtures per year (2 mid season, 2 post season). Relegation between each group?

Who knows? Just curious how RL can be different.

I suggested similar years ago (honest) but it’s just like Davis Cup tennis. How far could you take P & R? If Tonga were relegated from the top group into one that possibly contains Wales, Ireland or France etc. how would those games be financed? It would have to be regionalised up to a point.

rldfsignature.jpg

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What do you mean by something uniquely Rugby League? Like not playing international matches? Either we want international matches or we don't. You can't say we want them but better not do it, because no-one will play in them or watch them. How do you propose to incentivise young players if Wales doesn't play International matches.

What makes you think players won't play in them? We had a squad in the world cup and most recently we qualified for the next one. Most Welsh RL players (like the Tongans) would give their eye teeth to represent Wales.

How do you know people won't watch?

It would help if we let people know they are playing for a start, (marketing) instead of keeping it a secret.

The Jamaican's funded their own travel to the West Indies, Wales Students funded their own travel to Student World Cups. How do you think the Greeks and the Serbs are doing it? You are sucking the energy out of these people's development efforts.

Its a good job we have people who don't believe its a lost cause or Rugby League would be dead already. If you can't assist in the development, if you can't respect and support the people struggling to grow the thing, get out of the way, instead of pontificating about why it won't work.

Its bad enough having to put up with the Ra Ra establishment putting the boot in, without having to overcome, our own fifth column killers on the inside.

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4 hours ago, scotchy1 said:

People wouldn't really watch and players wouldn't really play.

A big problem that RL has is that we are trying to put in place structures mirroring those which other sports put in place in the Victorian era. Just as those sports start moving away from those structures toward a more holistic structure.

We need to be more imaginative and not be afraid of something uniquely Rugby League. 

The euros/world cup now nations league cycle is uniquely football. You dont find a 6 nations concept outside RU, the Ryder Cup is uniquely golf. We should create and international cycle that is imaginative and unique and recognisable as Rugby League.

 

see the post above! Whose afraid of doing something imaginative or uniquely Rugby League? 

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6 minutes ago, Wolford6 said:

I'm 64 and Welsh. As a player, I was never much cop.

However, if John Kear is reading, I haven't yet anounced my official retirement.

??

 

 

In the words of Steve McNamara when he was England coach and my mate said similar - I've got your number, don't wait by the phone

100% League 0% Union

Just because I don't know doesn't mean I don't understand

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13 minutes ago, Cumbrian Fanatic said:

In the words of Steve McNamara when he was England coach and my mate said similar - I've got your number, don't wait by the phone

Obviously, as a Welshman, I'm culturally-bound to say that I could have played for England.

???

Under Scrutiny by the Right-On Thought Police

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On 3/14/2019 at 6:59 AM, ghost crayfish said:

I think in amongst all the judgement here, it's worth remembering this guy is a reasonably injury prone prop forward playing in a club competition that asks top clubs to play upwards of 40 games a year. 

So with respect to the honour of it all, I think it's understandable a guy in that position might want to spend the little time off he has refreshing his body, rather than slogging it out in disrespectfully low profile 'internationals' playing with and against part timers. If the RFL was competent enough to give Wales televised tests against professional opposition in decent stadiums with reasonable crowds, he might feel different. It doesn't have to be Australia at the Millennium - England in Warrington would probably do!

It’s nothing to do with the RFL

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16 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

It’s nothing to do with the RFL

Sure. Except it's their players who Wales need to pick, their sponsors who usually end up sponsoring test footy too, their TV broadcasters, their England team I suggested Wales should be playing, their organisation which is the leading regional body, their former CEO who is head of the RLIF, and their GB team that Ben Flower is talking about representing. Other than all that, I suppose I agree. Nothing to do with them at all.

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13 minutes ago, ghost crayfish said:

Sure. Except it's their players who Wales need to pick

None of the players are contracted to RFL

14 minutes ago, ghost crayfish said:

 their sponsors who usually end up sponsoring test footy too, their TV broadcasters, 

WRL have their own sponsors. They or RLIF can arrange TV broadcasting deals, RFL have nothing to do with it for Wales

 

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On 3/14/2019 at 8:51 AM, Cumbrian Fanatic said:

Wayne Bennett won't pick him because there's probably about 10 props better than him that would be picked first

True but he is Wigan’s top try scorer maybe Wayne could find a spot for him on the wing. 

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In my ideal world, I would have a Euro championships every Summer, which could act as a shop window for players to get selected for the Autumn internationals.

In the Autumn, I have would have GB&I Lions play every other year, and then the World Cup and another 8-team Inter-Continental Cup every other year, making a 4-year cycle.

The would guarantee home nations players with a big event every year that they would hopefully want to be a part of, so the likes of Ben Flower would have an incentive to play for Wales in the Summer, in order to put himself in the frame for Lions or World Cup selection in the Autumn. This would consequently improve the quality of the home nations teams and raise the profile.

If a Summer Euro champs also involved World Cup and Inter-Continental Cup qualification points, then this would also increase the importance and raise the profile further.

Unfortunately, until the Super League season reduces the number of fixtures, this is just a pipedream.

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Going back to the topic title I would just point out that Flower couldn't have played in 3 of those years as he was suspended in 2014, had not played since June in one year with a ruptured achilles and played in a Grand Final with a hand heavily strapped which was operated on immediately afterwards. It doesn't negate any of the points made previously but perhaps gives a bit of background.

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