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YCKonstantine

Is this what Super League could like with a conference system?

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I fully expect to get ripped to shreds but it's fun to imagine what could be. 

Each team would play everyone in their own conference home and away and every team cross conference of the same number ie St Helens v Castleford home and away or Widnes v Halifax home and away. Totalling 20 games over the season, I understand it's 29 in Super League this season so perhaps a few more cross conference games could be added.

Tried to keep teams together geographically (kind of) and keep all the major derbies in.

Also a relegation playoff system like in the German Bundesliga or Scottish Premiership. 

 

Super League Conference.PNG

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No, that looks pretty terrible. The quality will be awful and the game certainly can't afford 28 top flight clubs.

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"Tried to keep teams together geographically (kind of) and keep all the major derbies in. " Yet Hull FC and KR are in different conferences.

We're a long way off of conferences yet. We don't have enough professional teams and the only advantage I see is to cut down on travelling but that's kinda pointless if you're going to have Toronto and Ottawa in different conferences. Also, I don't know why you'd want to limit yourself to playing less teams if you don't have to.

If we ever did have two conferences, it would only be when we have enough North American teams. I'd prefer us to aim for having two fully professional divisions first.

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6 minutes ago, fevtom said:

"Tried to keep teams together geographically (kind of) and keep all the major derbies in. " Yet Hull FC and KR are in different conferences.

We're a long way off of conferences yet. We don't have enough professional teams and the only advantage I see is to cut down on travelling but that's kinda pointless if you're going to have Toronto and Ottawa in different conferences. Also, I don't know why you'd want to limit yourself to playing less teams if you don't have to.

If we ever did have two conferences, it would only be when we have enough North American teams. I'd prefer us to aim for having two fully professional divisions first.

Under YCK's system Toronto, Ottawa and New York would be playing each other home and away if I've read it right. Same with Hull and Hull KR. Although I only make the regular season number of games 18. 12 when you play your own conference and 6 when they play the cross conference games.

Edited by deluded pom?

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I am as pro-expansion as they come, but any Conference system has to be supported by franchising rather than P&R.

There also has to be a justifiable business case for entry.

For me the floor has to be set at an ability to draw average crowds of 5k plus, longer term that needs to rise to 10k, which is obviously a challenge for quite a few existing sides.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, deluded pom? said:

Under YCK's system Toronto, Ottawa and New York would be playing each other home and away if I've read it right. Same with Hull and Hull KR. Although I only make the regular season number of games 18. 12 when you play your own conference and 6 when they play the cross conference games.

All seems a bit unbalanced and complicated. Salford having to play Cas, Saints and Warrington more but others not. I don't really understand what the advantage to this would be. Conferences are okay to deal with geography or too many teams but I don't really get the point in having them just for the sake of it.

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4 minutes ago, fevtom said:

All seems a bit unbalanced and complicated. Salford having to play Cas, Saints and Warrington more but others not. I don't really understand what the advantage to this would be. Conferences are okay to deal with geography or too many teams but I don't really get the point in having them just for the sake of it.

I only based it off current league positions. And in response to your other comment about the Hull derby, that would be played as they are the "2nd seed" in their conferences so they play each other home and away. Also thought it'd be unfair to lump all the NA teams in one conference than have some poor UK teams have to go over there 3 times but made up for it with 2 french trips. 

Like I say this is all purely hypothetical and a bit of fun as I enjoy creating fantasy leagues.

Edited by YCKonstantine
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1 hour ago, YCKonstantine said:

I fully expect to get ripped to shreds but it's fun to imagine what could be. 

Each team would play everyone in their own conference home and away and every team cross conference of the same number ie St Helens v Castleford home and away or Widnes v Halifax home and away. Totalling 20 games over the season, I understand it's 29 in Super League this season so perhaps a few more cross conference games could be added.

Tried to keep teams together geographically (kind of) and keep all the major derbies in.

Also a relegation playoff system like in the German Bundesliga or Scottish Premiership. 

 

Super League Conference.PNG

Those aren't conferences, they're divisions, and you need Toronto, Ottawa and New York all in the same division, not different divisions.  That's how geographic alignment works.

Edited by Big Picture
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Just now, YCKonstantine said:

Why?

Because the way geographic alignment works is to put teams which are geographically close to each other in the same division, not in different divisions.

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2 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

Because the way geographic alignment works is to put teams which are geographically close to each other in the same division, not in different divisions.

If you read my original post they would all play each other home and away as they are seeded the same in their respective divisions. And having them in seperate ones would relieve the strain of a UK team being put in the same division as 3 NA teams and having to go across there 3 times when other teams won't have to at all.

Edited by YCKonstantine

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Just now, YCKonstantine said:

If you read my original post they would all play each other home and away as they are seeded the same in their respective divisions. And having them in seperate ones would relieve the strain of a UK team being put in the same division as 3 NA teams and having to across their 3 times when other teams won't have to at all.

On the other hand it would burden the latter three with far more transatlantic travel than any of the others, which if I were a potential investor in such a league would be an immediate deal breaker.

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Just now, Big Picture said:

On the other hand it would burden the latter three with far more transatlantic travel than any of the others, which if I were a potential investor in such a league would be an immediate deal breaker.

Well it'd require less travel than they do now.

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Conferences wont really work with P+R due to the inherent inequality of the fixture lists. 28 is also a few too many teams.

We could, possibly, with a fair wind and wet sail, and Toronto, Toulouse, NYC and Ottowa being ready get to 16 but beyond that we are struggling a lot and quickly

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If we are playing fantasy structure then this would be my thoughts.

3 conferences of 8.  Home and away within your conference and 1 game against all the others. 30 games.  Top 2 in each conference plus 2 best third places.

UK 1: Saints, Wigan, Warrington, Salford, Widnes, Cumbria, Crusaders, Manchester.

UK 2: Leeds, Bradford, Hull, Hull KR, Castleford, Wakefield, Newcastle, London.

Expansion: Catalan, Toulouse, France 3, Toronto, Ottawa, Canada 3, New York, USA 2. 

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Before I start, I will say that I don’t think we have a strong enough Super League at present let alone, a strong enough second tier, before anyone wants to start slating the top end of the game. 

There’s a disparity in the Championship at present. Last season’s table is testament to that. Six teams were separated by eight points from bottom to sixth and the gap between 6th and 5th was 16pts, in 2017 five teams were separated by four points (on the basis of giving Bradford their points back) and there was a large gap of eight points between Toulouse and Batley and in 2016, 11pts separated Halifax in 6th and Sheffield in 7th. It’s clear there’s a gulf in class, finances and resources, so I’d make the Championship a ten team competition, with the intention of it being the strongest second tier possible  

I would have sixteen teams in League One, currently we have 11 L1 teams, so I’d relegated the bottom four of the Championship and would add another team, with the intentions of creating four conferences of four teams, which would see teams placed in the same conference as other teams who are, where possible, local and who are of a similar level (this can be judged on a points per game average over a set period for example) on the field. 

Conference A would be the perceived best conference in terms of quality, then Conference B, C then D. 

I would have teams playing each team from their respective conference Home and Away (6 games). 

I would have teams from Conference A playing all the teams from Conference B home and away (8 games) as these are the closest in terms of quality and standard. I would do the same with Confernece C and D for the same reasons (8 games). 

I would then have the teams from each Conference playing the teams from the two conferences they are not paired with either home or away. So for example, the teams from Conference A would play the teams from C and D either home or away. (8 games). 

That equates to a 22 game regular season.

At this point, the play-off’s would begin. The top two teams from Conference A and B would automatically qualify for the play-off’s. The winners of Conference C and D would play-off to be the Fifth Team in the Play-off’s and we would have a five team play-off system to decide an overall winner. 

You could review the classification of each Conference every year with worthy teams going up a grade and others dropping a conference, if needed. 

Edited by Oliver Clothesoff

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The only sensible conference system would be a European Conference and North America Conference. None of this Yorkshire and Lancashire conferences sending the game back 40 years

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A different Conference System:

  • 12 team European SL as usual 
  • 4 North American teams in a conference.

NA teams play each other home and away twice, and either home or away once against the SL teams. Total of 24 games (starting season a little later than SL).

SL teams play each other home and away, and play NA teams either home or away once. Total of 26 games. This way they would only have to make one two-week trip to NA each season. Additionally, they would only have to suffer two home games against NA teams (with their lack of travelling fans). Essentially this just gets rid of the loop fixtures for them.

Play offs are made up of top 4 in SL plus the top NA team, this is using the currant five team play off system.

No relegation from NA conference, however they must use a certain number of North American players. This will give them time to invest and develop, even though it would take a while for them to be competitive.

The NA conference has to find it's own TV deal.

Best case scenario, it is a big success. Worst case it goes #### up and the SL is left with 12 teams and continues as usual.

Edited by ojx

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The trouble with conferences is that it instantly reminds people of some boring business conference they were forced to go to when all the sandwiches were stale and the free pens were rubbish.

Edited by Gerrumonside ref

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I do believe that an achievable target for SL could be 3 x 6 team Conferences within 5 years. Two Conferences in fhe traditional areas and one expansionist.

Expansion - Catalan, Toulouse, London, Toronto, NY, Ottowa

Traditional East - Hull, HKR, Cas, Leeds, Wakefield, Bradford/Newcastle 

Traditional West - Wigan, Saints, Wire, Salford, Giants, Widnes/Leigh/Cumbria

Tbh, and yes, funding is an issue, we could be only two clubs away from it already.

I do believe it could be a massive sell for the sport. 

A dream. Probably. An idea thrown onto a message board during a hypothetical discussion. Definitely!

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1 hour ago, ojx said:

A different Conference System:

  • 12 team European SL as usual 
  • 4 North American teams in a conference.

NA teams play each other home and away twice, and either home or away once against the SL teams. Total of 24 games (starting season a little later than SL).

SL teams play each other home and away, and play NA teams either home or away once. Total of 26 games. This way they would only have to make one two-week trip to NA each season. Additionally, they would only have to suffer two home games against NA teams (with their lack of travelling fans). Essentially this just gets rid of the loop fixtures for them.

Play offs are made up of top 4 in SL plus the top NA team, this is using the currant five team play off system.

No relegation from NA conference, however they must use a certain number of North American players. This will give them time to invest and develop, even though it would take a while for them to be competitive.

The NA conference has to find it's own TV deal.

Best case scenario, it is a big success. Worst case it goes #### up and the SL is left with 12 teams and continues as usual.

Which team would be classed as finishing fifth if your play offs are like the current top five?


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17 minutes ago, deluded pom? said:

Which team would be classed as finishing fifth if your play offs are like the current top five?

To give them a chance (and a home game), I would put the NA team in at 4th.

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6 hours ago, YCKonstantine said:

I fully expect to get ripped to shreds but it's fun to imagine what could be. 

Each team would play everyone in their own conference home and away and every team cross conference of the same number ie St Helens v Castleford home and away or Widnes v Halifax home and away. Totalling 20 games over the season, I understand it's 29 in Super League this season so perhaps a few more cross conference games could be added.

Tried to keep teams together geographically (kind of) and keep all the major derbies in.

Also a relegation playoff system like in the German Bundesliga or Scottish Premiership. 

 

Super League Conference.PNG

That looks like 18 Games to me, not 20!

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