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Furner Sacked


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1 hour ago, Denton Rovers RLFC said:

Maybe Sinfield is interfering/toxic, he's just as culpable if not more so, he should be sacked as clearly not able to do a good job for the club thus far. 

hetherington's have been making a mockery of the Leeds club in the last few years, both ended up making Hull go backwards with lack of investment, slung James Rule under the bus as well. 

With respect it looks like you don't have much clue about the internal workings of Leeds.

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2 minutes ago, M j M said:

With respect it looks like you don't have much clue about the internal workings of Leeds.

With respect, as DoR it's his responsibility for the running of the rugby side of things, in this he has failed miserably unless you are ignoring how things have panned out? "I'm not the coach" Sinfield seems to be coated in teflon.

Maybe you are close to Sinfield and know exactly what the workings are, but it still doesn't change the fact that he hasn't produced, how do you know that he isn't part of the problem?

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8 hours ago, Denton Rovers RLFC said:

With respect, as DoR it's his responsibility for the running of the rugby side of things, in this he has failed miserably unless you are ignoring how things have panned out? "I'm not the coach" Sinfield seems to be coated in teflon.

Maybe you are close to Sinfield and know exactly what the workings are, but it still doesn't change the fact that he hasn't produced, how do you know that he isn't part of the problem?

Sinfield has held his hands up and said appointing Furner was his call played and won SL with him he was an influential member in the 2004 team and he was a friend.  There is things we dont know about what's gone on ,but recruitment since the golden generation broke up has been poor. Sinfield has also Intimated that Agar could  be in Situ for rest of season 

 Soon we will be dancing the fandango
FROM 2004,TO DO WHAT THIS CLUB HAS DONE,IF THATS NOT GREATNESSTHEN i DONT KNOW WHAT IS.

JAMIE PEACOCK

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9 hours ago, Denton Rovers RLFC said:

With respect, as DoR it's his responsibility for the running of the rugby side of things, in this he has failed miserably unless you are ignoring how things have panned out? "I'm not the coach" Sinfield seems to be coated in teflon.

Maybe you are close to Sinfield and know exactly what the workings are, but it still doesn't change the fact that he hasn't produced, how do you know that he isn't part of the problem?

Yes its Sinfields responsibility and he has taken responsibility and admitted it was the wrong appointment  and made a decision to rectify it rather than just letting things carry on as they are.

If he gets the next one wrong you would have more of a point.

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On 07/05/2019 at 12:50, hunsletgreenandgold said:

I get your overall point, but 2 golden generations isn't really 'luck' though......

I emphasise that because whilst the current on field squad is obviously struggling, behind the scenes the next generation is coming through - just a bigger gap than previously it seems. 

They churn out talent like no one else from the youth system. 

I'd argue the anomalous result is now and the norm is an abundance of talent

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9 minutes ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

Latest odds 

image.thumb.png.80637496490d8b30082ca3ee7990cb19.png

I think they'll keep Agar there for the remainder of the season but announce next years coach well before the end of this season - soften the blow of such an awful season. Maybe a half back announcement too by then. 

Ok, thanks.  Must be money going on for Flanagan, Marshall and Wane.  But if your thoughts of keeping Agar in for the season are right, why is Flanagan leading in the betting?  He’s ready to go, if suitable, and half a season in charge would place a coach in perfect position for 2020.

IMO Agar won’t be considered in the final shake up.

 

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2 minutes ago, Lowdesert said:

Ok, thanks.  Must be money going on for Flanagan, Marshall and Wane.  But if your thoughts of keeping Agar in for the season are right, why is Flanagan leading in the betting?  He’s ready to go, if suitable, and half a season in charge would place a coach in perfect position for 2020.

IMO Agar won’t be considered in the final shake up.

 

Both Agar and Powell have ruled themselves out

 

My Money would be on Flannagan and to come in before the end of the season.

I don't know much about him, aside from him breaking the doping rules is he well respected? and what type of coach is he, we need a tough no nonsense type of coach with no ties to the club in any way IMO.

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5 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

Both Agar and Powell have ruled themselves out

 

My Money would be on Flannagan and to come in before the end of the season.

I don't know much about him, aside from him breaking the doping rules is he well respected? and what type of coach is he, we need a tough no nonsense type of coach with no ties to the club in any way IMO.

That type of coach. He would be a good appointment, good record at the Sharks.

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5 hours ago, Monkey Lover said:

He isn't even the best backrow in Halifax.

There is a good reason Halifax have had an upturn in performance in recent weeks and it certainly aint down to QLT or French Kev.

The most overrated backrower in the game. I've never seen him play well, although I have heard him moaning about how the game owes him a living when he got relegated. Terrible player.

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49 minutes ago, Tex Evans Thigh said:

The most overrated backrower in the game. I've never seen him play well, although I have heard him moaning about how the game owes him a living when he got relegated. Terrible player.

To be fair to him he has probably been the best of a bad bunch of signings for us. That probably highlights the reason we are where we are though. I dread to think the type of signings that would happen if he were to be given Leeds spending power. It says a lot for Marshall's when we are very reliant on the core of Karl Harrison's team.

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Is Barry Eaton still there? He has a very useful coaching record. Obviously, he wouldn't get the top job but he could be an important cog till the end of this season.

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I'm slightly worried that what this is showing is that the club is becoming a bit too reactionary. If you're giving a coach a 3 year deal you have to back the guy. If you don't back him and his squad decisions don't sign him for 3 years!

Our signings have on the whole been poor. Yes we've gone into the Marquee market for the first time this season but if I'm honest I don't think that its been spent well. Yes Hurrell is probably our best player, but with Keinhorst in the squad last year we didn't need to spend loads of money on a world class centre as that wasn't where our biggest problems were. Hurrell is by far our best player this season but is that saying much? Lolohea is a quandry of a signing, clearly much better at FB, or at least anywhere thats not stand off, it does make you wonder what vision had him signed if we already had Walker and Golding. Even with Merrin I'm somewhat underwhelmed. We are better with him on the pitch but I really don't see him and think "Marquee Money" in the way that Austin is at Wire for example. I think its clear the club has spent money, I'm not convinced it's been spent in the right way.

The balance of the squad at Leeds just seems off. We're lightweight up front and soft in defence not to mention we still haven't recruited a proper 6 since Sinfield retired. Suddenly we're connected with a 500k bid for Jake Connor, brought in 2 forwards mid season from a collapsed Widnes and the NRL and our Coach is sacked after 14 games. I don't know about anyone else but it just seems a bit chaotic for Leeds?

Finally, I'm surprised McLelland hasn't been given more game time or at least a chance considering our problems in the halves. Maybe that was Furner's decision. 

Regardless, sacking the coach, poor planning with signings, poor squad balance, I'm seeing this all this as the signs of a club acting reactionary. 

 

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33 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

I'm slightly worried that what this is showing is that the club is becoming a bit too reactionary. If you're giving a coach a 3 year deal you have to back the guy. If you don't back him and his squad decisions don't sign him for 3 years!

Our signings have on the whole been poor. Yes we've gone into the Marquee market for the first time this season but if I'm honest I don't think that its been spent well. Yes Hurrell is probably our best player, but with Keinhorst in the squad last year we didn't need to spend loads of money on a world class centre as that wasn't where our biggest problems were. Hurrell is by far our best player this season but is that saying much? Lolohea is a quandry of a signing, clearly much better at FB, or at least anywhere thats not stand off, it does make you wonder what vision had him signed if we already had Walker and Golding. Even with Merrin I'm somewhat underwhelmed. We are better with him on the pitch but I really don't see him and think "Marquee Money" in the way that Austin is at Wire for example. I think its clear the club has spent money, I'm not convinced it's been spent in the right way.

The balance of the squad at Leeds just seems off. We're lightweight up front and soft in defence not to mention we still haven't recruited a proper 6 since Sinfield retired. Suddenly we're connected with a 500k bid for Jake Connor, brought in 2 forwards mid season from a collapsed Widnes and the NRL and our Coach is sacked after 14 games. I don't know about anyone else but it just seems a bit chaotic for Leeds?

Finally, I'm surprised McLelland hasn't been given more game time or at least a chance considering our problems in the halves. Maybe that was Furner's decision. 

Regardless, sacking the coach, poor planning with signings, poor squad balance, I'm seeing this all this as the signs of a club acting reactionary. 

 

I kind of see what you’re saying but the problem with straight relegation in the league there’s not always the time to not be reactionary. If there’s no threat of relegation its ‘easier’ to give people time. Something wasn’t right within the group at all I just hope that it was Furner that was the issue.

I do disagree on Hurrell and Merrin who have been far and away our best players, with Hall leaving we did need a player who makes metres snd gets us on the front foot, Keinhorst was a solid player but not in the same ballpark as Hurrell, Merrin is a very very good player, I would make him captain and let Watkins concentrate on getting his fitness and confidence back after a career threatening injury.

Where I do agree is on the halfback Tui is not the answer at all, Hastings would have been the player I would have gone for (we apparently tried to get Austin)

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2 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

To be fair to him he has probably been the best of a bad bunch of signings for us. That probably highlights the reason we are where we are though. I dread to think the type of signings that would happen if he were to be given Leeds spending power. It says a lot for Marshall's when we are very reliant on the core of Karl Harrison's team.

Fair enough. I always thought Marshall did well with what he had and his record of making the top four is hard to argue with. You're in a better position to comment on signings than me but from the outside some of them look quite odd. Is Shaun Robinson not doing well? He was very good at Fev.

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3 hours ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

Latest odds 

image.thumb.png.80637496490d8b30082ca3ee7990cb19.png

I think they'll keep Agar there for the remainder of the season but announce next years coach well before the end of this season - soften the blow of such an awful season. Maybe a half back announcement too by then. 

There might be a Ole type revival!

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9 hours ago, Monkey Lover said:

He isn't even the best backrow in Halifax.

There is a good reason Halifax have had an upturn in performance in recent weeks and it certainly aint down to QLT or French Kev.

Has missed large parts of the season like many of the more established players. But returned at the weekend with 2 tries. Not too bad for a rubbish backrower. Probably OTT with one of the best backrowers, but certainly for a part time team like Fax, a handy player to have. No doubt other PT teams would not mind having him.

The recent upturn as you put it, helps when playing teams that are struggling to put a team out like Barrow and the return of an experiemced half in Murrell who has been missing and carrying injuries. Also having star player Chester Butler finally play has also helped with 3 tries in 2 games. He should be in SL.

Marshall has allegedly had no contact with Sinfield or Leeds since the last game. I dont think Leeds (Sinfield) have a clue themselves who they really want. If they did, you would think they would have made an announcement, rather than just throw Agar in to the Temp Role. You would think they would have talked to one or two possible next Coaches, before sacking Furner. That doesnt seem to be the case. The lack of leadership and clear understanding that the Leeds of old had both on and off the field has seemingly vanished.

The way the whole this and other things have been handled by Leeds (Sinfield) has been poor. To sack somebody you appointed after 14 Games is a strange one.It seems Sinfield-a great player- has liitle idea in his role away from the field. He risks being a Kieron Cunningham. Great player, but clueless off it! Leeds are in the position they are is more down to Sinfield than Furner and I am not sure what he was expecting from Furner with that Squad and the problems Leeds have had for years, not just 14 Games.

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On 08/05/2019 at 19:26, GeordieSaint said:

The players by all accounts were struggling to adapt to Furner’s ideas and style of play. That’s straight from one of the current squad who briefed at my unit a couple of months ago.

If your changing idea's and style of play best to have your own coaching support team to help cement those changes.  Problem for Furner he come into a setup that was put together by Sinfields changes.  Surely the setup should have been done with Furner when he got here, that way all pulling in same direction and support staff totally brought in to changes.

In addition I remember many events  were Sinfield spoke plus press conferences were he constantly commented on the many changes needed with some of the off field aspects.  I guess they haven't made significant difference.

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16 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

I kind of see what you’re saying but the problem with straight relegation in the league there’s not always the time to not be reactionary. If there’s no threat of relegation its ‘easier’ to give people time. Something wasn’t right within the group at all I just hope that it was Furner that was the issue.

I do disagree on Hurrell and Merrin who have been far and away our best players, with Hall leaving we did need a player who makes metres snd gets us on the front foot, Keinhorst was a solid player but not in the same ballpark as Hurrell, Merrin is a very very good player, I would make him captain and let Watkins concentrate on getting his fitness and confidence back after a career threatening injury.

Where I do agree is on the halfback Tui is not the answer at all, Hastings would have been the player I would have gone for (we apparently tried to get Austin)

I think its hard with their only being 12 teams, we've also lost a few games by very close margins. The problem has been that we have still had total collapses in games which is unacceptable frankly.

I do agree they've been our best players, however I don't think that's saying much! I think our recruitment has just been a bit off generally. 

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15 hours ago, scotchy1 said:

I think the question of 'sticking with' or 'too reactionary' is often just a question of being right. 

The club gained a reputation for 'sticking with' simply because more often than not it was right. When we weren't, we moved on quickly. Ben Cross got about 10 games, 

Nor has the club ever really been scared of shelling out when it though decent players were available. Harris, Lauitiiti, Ellis, JP.

I think the balance of the squad is a problem (though its better than it was) but there is slightly a case of being stuck. Where do you buy for?

Is it the backs? Well not really, We have two wingers, we have Golding in reserve aswell as now lolohea able to play FB. Harry Newman is very close to getting a shirt on form over two very very good players. 

Is it in the pack? Well where? Oledski and Smith are deserving first team now, Trout, Mustapha, Holroyd, McConnell will all probably get games next year and you certainly wouldn't want to bring anyone big on a 3 or 4 year contract that might keep them out. Merrin is a fantastic player, Ward (when we can get him on the field) would get in any side. Then we have a stack of marginal players in the pack, we certainly aren't lacking for numbers there. 

Hooker? Well Dwyer has been one of the best for us, Parcell has been a bit hit and miss but probably as good as you are going to bring over and Johnson, again, is probably ready to start making that step up.

Halves, this is obviously a problem the club clearly have high-hopes for Mclellan to come in but he will need time. Lolohea has struggled but we can't both argue to sack him off already and that the club is being too reactionary, Myler for me has often looked a good player in a poor team, but hasn't really ever looked like he would be the man to turn it around. 

Leeds don't need to be looking now but to next year and more to the year after. If Sinfield doesn't feel that Furner is the man for year 3 of this plan he was right to get rid. There are still players like JJB and Watkins and Ablett and Sinfield himself who remember what was needed in the glory years, and if Furner wasn't there then you have to move quickly.

Its a strange problem leeds have in that the squad needs a massive overhaul but they don't really want to bring too many players in and as such can't really ship too many players out.  

I do think our pack is a big problem. Its fundamentally light and its shown in almost every game we've played this year in attack and defence. Singleton for whatever reason hasn't seemed to have kicked on, Cuthbo looks on his last legs every week and its not fair to put pressure on Oledzki or any of the other young players just yet. 

Peteru and JJB are back rowers not props. Same for Albert. I don't know enough about Seumanafagai? Merrin is quality, but we already had decent backrowers. Along with the above there's Ablett, Ward, Smith and even Sutcliffe. 

The hookers are great. Parcell rarely has a game less than 7/10 and Dwyer has been one of our best this year.

I think what you see in that pack as well (aside from the two new recruits who I'm yet to see enough of), is that its all very workhorse-like. By that I mean there's no explosive or impact players. That's not a discredit to the players as you need workhorses in any good team, its just lacking somewhat. Perhaps that's a long term thing we haven't had since maybe Lauititi, but realistically you look at our pack and who are the opposition looking at a bit worried thinking 'he's going to be a handful'? Maybe our player for that is Hurrell, but he's a centre and he's been carrying the whole team.

Our halves are average and in many ways far too similar, yet surely you'd have thought Sinfield would have been the precise person to identify that and bring in players who could compliment each other. 

The rumoured response from Furner that he's going to sue the club is what worries me the most. We've brought in a coach and then not backed him doesn't send out a good message.

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Mr Lizzard...   Given that they only gave Furner 14 games it's hard to criticize them for not spending time to look for a replacement in tbat time.

It strikes me of being some player power in the background.  But the other issue might well be a sort of Perfect Storm where events ruled everything.  

But the haunting spectre of relegation was the perhaps the driver.  The sooner relegation is dropped and dropped for good the better. 

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3 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

I do think our pack is a big problem. Its fundamentally light and its shown in almost every game we've played this year in attack and defence. Singleton for whatever reason hasn't seemed to have kicked on, Cuthbo looks on his last legs every week and its not fair to put pressure on Oledzki or any of the other young players just yet. 

Peteru and JJB are back rowers not props. Same for Albert. I don't know enough about Seumanafagai? Merrin is quality, but we already had decent backrowers. Along with the above there's Ablett, Ward, Smith and even Sutcliffe. 

The hookers are great. Parcell rarely has a game less than 7/10 and Dwyer has been one of our best this year.

I think what you see in that pack as well (aside from the two new recruits who I'm yet to see enough of), is that its all very workhorse-like. By that I mean there's no explosive or impact players. That's not a discredit to the players as you need workhorses in any good team, its just lacking somewhat. Perhaps that's a long term thing we haven't had since maybe Lauititi, but realistically you look at our pack and who are the opposition looking at a bit worried thinking 'he's going to be a handful'? Maybe our player for that is Hurrell, but he's a centre and he's been carrying the whole team.

Our halves are average and in many ways far too similar, yet surely you'd have thought Sinfield would have been the precise person to identify that and bring in players who could compliment each other. 

The rumoured response from Furner that he's going to sue the club is what worries me the most. We've brought in a coach and then not backed him doesn't send out a good message.

Last time someone tried to sue the club it didn't go well for them (and he was a solicitor!) , Hetherington is no idiot.

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