tim2 Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 49 minutes ago, Niels said: Even he accepted that the use of a chimpanzee to depict a child of mixed race was racist. Therefore I can't see how it could be understandable and non racist in any context, including his show. At the point he did it, he was referencing a running gag in the show. I can believe that he didn't recognise the race implication then, but after it was pointed out his reaction was poor. "I am the avenging angel; I come with wings unfurled, I come with claws extended from halfway round the world. I am the God Almighty, I am the howling wind. I care not for your family; I care not for your kin. I come in search of terror, though terror is my own; I come in search of vengeance for crimes and crimes unknown. I care not for your children, I care not for your wives, I care not for your country, I care not for your lives." - (c) Jim Boyes - "The Avenging Angel" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob8 Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 8 hours ago, Martyn Sadler said: Jokes on extreme subjects are funny if they appeal to your prejudices, but not funny if they don't. I'm afraid that in that sense it is directly comparable to racist jokes from the 1970s. You make the point more eloquently than me, which is why you are a very successful journalist and I am not. I disagreed with @gingerjon in condemning the milkshake incidents, as violence leads to more violence and I am gratified we agree. We have seen dreadful incidents including; murder and conspiracy to murder feigning that there was a murder attempt in order to ratchet up tension jokes about acid throwing milkskake throwing Perhaps what makes me a lefty is seeing all those as wrong, but in decreasing order. Those on the modern populist right see them as all equal or in ascending order of enormity. "You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrek Posted June 14, 2019 Share Posted June 14, 2019 12 hours ago, JohnM said: Now that it's OK on live radio to call for acid to be thrown at Nigel Farage, maybe Baker will be allowed back. It wasn't live radio, it was pre-recorded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyn Sadler Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 12 hours ago, Bob8 said: You make the point more eloquently than me, which is why you are a very successful journalist and I am not. I disagreed with @gingerjon in condemning the milkshake incidents, as violence leads to more violence and I am gratified we agree. We have seen dreadful incidents including; murder and conspiracy to murder feigning that there was a murder attempt in order to ratchet up tension jokes about acid throwing milkskake throwing Perhaps what makes me a lefty is seeing all those as wrong, but in decreasing order. Those on the modern populist right see them as all equal or in ascending order of enormity. The problem with making a 'joke' about acid-throwing is that it is currently a live issue, with several recent examples of people being disfigured by this horrible practice. It would have been the same, or perhaps more so, if she had 'joked' about knifing politicians she 'hated'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrispmartha Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 On 14/06/2019 at 12:55, Dave T said: That may be true for you, but you cant make that statement about others as fact. I have listened to many comedians make jokes about things I care about and can appreciate the humour. Indeed, go see Jerry Sadowitz, many of his jokes are totally against my actual opinion on stuff but he’s incredibly funny and I think people forget that most if not all comedians are playing a character. I remember the outrage at Stuart Lees Top Gear routine (one of the finest bits of stand up I’ve ever seen) but the outraged didn’t seem to understand the joke or the context even though Lee actually broke character during it to explain what he was doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrispmartha Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 3 hours ago, Martyn Sadler said: The problem with making a 'joke' about acid-throwing is that it is currently a live issue, with several recent examples of people being disfigured by this horrible practice. It would have been the same, or perhaps more so, if she had 'joked' about knifing politicians she 'hated'. What you’re doing their though is saying we shouldn’t be able to joke about things that are current and bad, why? Many forms of comedy come from joking about things that are ‘bad’ A child going missing with ni idea what has happened to her is pretty bad isn’t it, should jokes about Madeline McCann be a no go? Where do you draw the line? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyn Sadler Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 7 hours ago, Chrispmartha said: What you’re doing their though is saying we shouldn’t be able to joke about things that are current and bad, why? Many forms of comedy come from joking about things that are ‘bad’ A child going missing with ni idea what has happened to her is pretty bad isn’t it, should jokes about Madeline McCann be a no go? Where do you draw the line? I actually think we should be allowed to joke about anything. But we should also be allowed to criticise jokes that stray into being offensive rather than funny. I have no desire to stop Jo Brand telling jokes on any subject she wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrispmartha Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 4 minutes ago, Martyn Sadler said: I actually think we should be allowed to joke about anything. But we should also be allowed to criticise jokes that stray into being offensive rather than funny. I have no desire to stop Jo Brand telling jokes on any subject she wants. Well on that we agree. Nothing is off limits with regards jokes IMO, time and place and context is the key Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiltshire Rhino Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 Time to post this again 2014 Challenged Cup Winner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparse Attendance Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 I’d love Baker & Kelly to do a football show either on the radio or tv. Or even both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niels Posted June 15, 2019 Share Posted June 15, 2019 16 minutes ago, TheConductor said: Thing is Jo Brand is a nothing as she knows she is a ###### un funny DOG and has always been yet the BEEB suck her up like that other unfunny bloke who has a OBE I think her credibility as an edge comedian went once she started appearing on mainstream shows such as Countdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 7 hours ago, TheConductor said: Thing is Jo Brand is a nothing as she knows she is a ###### un funny DOG and has always been yet the BEEB suck her up like that other unfunny bloke who has a OBE What do you mean by calling her a dog? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiltshire Rhino Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 2 hours ago, Dave T said: What do you mean by calling her a dog? I don't think I'm going out too much on a limb here when I say I don't think @TheConductor finds her very attractive physically. I could be wrong though. 2014 Challenged Cup Winner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 56 minutes ago, Wiltshire Rhino said: I don't think I'm going out too much on a limb here when I say I don't think @TheConductor finds her very attractive physically. I could be wrong though. I thought maybe I was missing something, as I thought we had moved on from that kind of misogyny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Eel Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 Jokes are often based on mis-fortune, or something perceived to be wrong/unacceptable. Here's an interesting study result which lends itself to the idea of 'Benign violation theory', citing three conditions which are 'required' to be met in order for something to be funny. Where there is doubt, such as with Baker and Brand, either (or both) the level of violation has been exceeded/vastly understated, or the subject is not sufficiently benign (sufficient time has passed). (Peter McGraw, University of Colorado) Society has a way of naturally drawing a line at what is acceptable, but as that is a constantly moving line, that's where the grey areas often exist. When we know a joke does cross that line, can we have any surprise that our judgement is called into question? However, it is not always obvious; those moving lines of violation and benign-ness (is that a word?!) can change quickly. Comedians are often walking on the tightrope of that line. Social media, tv and the press appear to be the main barometers of feeling, but they can have an immediate impact on where those line lie. That said, can we be castigated for finding something funny in the past that would not be appropriate now, if we were in the knowledge that, at the time, societal lines were not being crossed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob8 Posted June 16, 2019 Share Posted June 16, 2019 22 hours ago, Wiltshire Rhino said: Time to post this again Anyone who thinks being easily offended is particular to one side is very stupid and certainly shouldn’t bother sharing their idiocy. "You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenilworth Tiger Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 So................... Any reports of attacks on politicians using battery acid? #projectfear Now then, it's a race between Sandie....and Fairburn....and the little man is in........yeees he's in. I, just like those Castleford supporters felt that the ball should have gone to David Plange but he put the bit betwen his teeth...and it was a try Kevin Ward - best player I have ever seen The real Mick Gledhill is what you see on here, a Bradford fan ........, but deep down knows that Bradford are just not good enough to challenge the likes of Leeds & St Helens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niels Posted June 17, 2019 Share Posted June 17, 2019 https://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/17711208.acid-attack-oxford-update-household-bleach-was-substance-thrown/ There was an acid style attack in Oxford though (bleach is included in the group including acid substances). Highly unlikely to have been inspired by Jo Brand I admit, but it's too much in the news for it to be casually suggested and joked about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 14 hours ago, Niels said: https://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/17711208.acid-attack-oxford-update-household-bleach-was-substance-thrown/ There was an acid style attack in Oxford though (bleach is included in the group including acid substances). Highly unlikely to have been inspired by Jo Brand I admit, but it's too much in the news for it to be casually suggested and joked about. That it is relevant makes the joke work better. And your wording in your last line is intentionally provocative. She didn't 'suggest' it, she joked about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niels Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 42 minutes ago, Dave T said: That it is relevant makes the joke work better. And your wording in your last line is intentionally provocative. She didn't 'suggest' it, she joked about it. She did suggest it, jokingly. The royal baby was relevant but that didn't make Danny Baker's joke work better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 40 minutes ago, Niels said: She did suggest it, jokingly. The royal baby was relevant but that didn't make Danny Baker's joke work better. That doesn't really make sense. Referring to the baby as a monkey was the issue, not joking about the baby itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob8 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 Yes. I am not keen on Brand’s joke. There is a danger in upping the ante. I would take some of the outrage more seriously if those most outraged were proportionally more outraged by Farage making up an assasination attempt. Particularly in regard to there having been a planned assasination and an assasination related to Brexit. "You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padge Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 Watch Mel Brookes film The Producers if you want to see a really offensive joke. Hilarious but outrageous. Visit my photography site www.padge.smugmug.com Radio 5 Live: Saturday 14 April 2007 Dave Whelan "In Wigan rugby will always be king" This country's wealth was created by men in overalls, it was destroyed by men in suits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleep1673 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 A really offensive joke.... Danny Baker is to do a twice weekly podcast. I said he'd be back before Christmas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Futtocks Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 3 hours ago, Bleep1673 said: A really offensive joke.... Danny Baker is to do a twice weekly podcast. I said he'd be back before Christmas. It is planned (unless he's just kite-flying) for 2020. So he'll be back before the Christmas after next. Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted. Ralph Waldo Emerson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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