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The Daddy

London Broncos have been a disaster off the pitch

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On 22/06/2019 at 15:43, Dunbar said:

As I say, I would love to see it happen.

If I won the Euromillions I would even build it myself!

If its so easy to build a new stadium on 8% then why haven't everyone done that... Castleford for instance?

Best wishes to London, but...     Getting back to the point, London would do well to get about 2500. At the moment.  What plans do they have to expend their fan base (if it's possible) and if and when that happens, surely then they can look to expand seating in their current base? And then move on.

Otherwise we seem to be simply looking to "build it and they will come".

Plus of course given the obsession with P&R, just HOW could they be expected to expand their fan base?

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23 hours ago, Southerner said:

London needs to be run on the same business plan as Melbourne Storm but we simply don’t have the funds. 

Spend a lot until it wins and then the crowds come? I'd love us to try.... If we got to a final or won something we'd grow ecponentially.. even if we stayed up for 3 years we would be back up to 4000+ crowds. Nothing helps crowds like success

Some say the Storm are the only truly successful expansion club (pre-Canada)

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14 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

  What plans do they have to expend their fan base (if it's possible) and if and when that happens, surely then they can look to expand seating in their current base? And then move on.

 

The fundamental problem is -  for either Bronocos or Skolars to build support more people (many more people) in the capital need to be aware of the sport and the clubs alone cannot do this. Skolars have an offer of free tickets for local residents. A few have taken this up but how many of the 300,000 plus residents of Haringey have heard of the sport, let alone the offer? We don’t have the resource to market in any significant way. In the heartland it’s different. RL is regularly on local radio and TV for instance. People are aware of it, even they don’t attend. There are channels to promote it easily. I think this season Broncos have been featured twice of the London BBC TV sports report. That makes us a novelty. 

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1 hour ago, EssexRL said:

The fundamental problem is -  for either Bronocos or Skolars to build support more people (many more people) in the capital need to be aware of the sport and the clubs alone cannot do this. Skolars have an offer of free tickets for local residents. A few have taken this up but how many of the 300,000 plus residents of Haringey have heard of the sport, let alone the offer? We don’t have the resource to market in any significant way. In the heartland it’s different. RL is regularly on local radio and TV for instance. People are aware of it, even they don’t attend. There are channels to promote it easily. I think this season Broncos have been featured twice of the London BBC TV sports report. That makes us a novelty. 

Indeed.

But a reasonable successful SL team averages 6000. The good ones get 10000.  So merely being there is not going to attract a stadium worthy of anything like 6000.

This is why the game is not going to expand, either in profile or in nr of clubs, by the work of the individual clubs themselves. 

The game needs to decide where it going.

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7 hours ago, EssexRL said:

On a sad note Brixton Bulls have had to fold their women's team due to lack of opposition. Where London is lacking is -

  • Women's RL
  • LD RL 

 

Of course it has.

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13 hours ago, Rupert Prince said:

Why should anybody offer grants and loans when there is already a ground called Trailfinders? It is there and up and running, shouldn't its grants be first in line? Just where does this never ending money stream come from, because I would like some of it please.

Because trailfinders isn't of the necessary quality, size and nor does it belong to the sport. It achieves pretty much none of the things that I suggested we would use this stadium for. 

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So, the conclusion is that London have just not moved stadium enough.

It is nothing to do with having to tidentify and take advantage of a smaller niche, but affluent market within London.

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"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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33 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

Because trailfinders isn't of the necessary quality, size and nor does it belong to the sport. It achieves pretty much none of the things that I suggested we would use this stadium for. 

The capacity is more than adequate with room to grow and the facility is excellent

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2 minutes ago, Tre Cool said:

The capacity is more than adequate with room to grow and the facility is excellent

No it isn't. Its an amateur level capacity and an amateur level quality. It is not a top tier level facility. 

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38 minutes ago, Tre Cool said:

The capacity is more than adequate with room to grow and the facility is excellent

agreed, it is fine for now and if they continue in super league hopefully they can build on it.. if not then maybe look outside.

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1 hour ago, scotchy1 said:

Because trailfinders isn't of the necessary quality, size and nor does it belong to the sport. It achieves pretty much none of the things that I suggested we would use this stadium for. 

All well and good, but that is not my point. I am suggesting to you that if there is any available grant money's, and it's not a bottomless pit, then it strikes me that Trailfinders would be in the queue if they were intetested. After that then there are likely to be many other London projects.

The idea that the RFL are going to fund a stadium for RL and up to 3 teams... for an audience it does not have ...  is risible.

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Just now, Rupert Prince said:

All well and good, but that is not my point. I am suggesting to you that if there is any available grant money's, and it's not a bottomless pit, then it strikes me that Trailfinders would be in the queue if they were intetested. After that then there are likely to be many other London projects.

The idea that the RFL are going to fund a stadium for RL and up to 3 teams... for an audience it does not have ...  is risible.

Trailfinders does not belong to the game or the club, and wouldn't achieve any of the things I suggested. What happens to it is irrelevant. The club is currently renting a facility that can barely be called a stadium, that is nowhere near SL standard and does not offer them any ability to scale their business. Trailfinders is a waste of time, if London are ever able to wash their own face it wont be there. They will need to move. Trailfinders can apply for all the grants they want, it wouldn't achieve any of the things I suggested for RL. 

I have no idea which three teams you are talking about. The RFL could fund a stadium, in conjunction with other bodies such as councils etc, and have a hub of RL in London. Governing bodies owning stadiums is a pretty common thing

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14 hours ago, Rupert Prince said:

If its so easy to build a new stadium on 8% then why haven't everyone done that... Castleford for instance?

Best wishes to London, but...     Getting back to the point, London would do well to get about 2500. At the moment.  What plans do they have to expend their fan base (if it's possible) and if and when that happens, surely then they can look to expand seating in their current base? And then move on.

Otherwise we seem to be simply looking to "build it and they will come".

Plus of course given the obsession with P&R, just HOW could they be expected to expand their fan base?

I want licensing back

I suspect we'd get a successor investor to Hughes if it was

 

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7 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

Trailfinders does not belong to the game or the club, and wouldn't achieve any of the things I suggested. What happens to it is irrelevant. The club is currently renting a facility that can barely be called a stadium, that is nowhere near SL standard and does not offer them any ability to scale their business. Trailfinders is a waste of time, if London are ever able to wash their own face it wont be there. They will need to move. Trailfinders can apply for all the grants they want, it wouldn't achieve any of the things I suggested for RL. 

I have no idea which three teams you are talking about. The RFL could fund a stadium, in conjunction with other bodies such as councils etc, and have a hub of RL in London. Governing bodies owning stadiums is a pretty common thing

I agree with all this. The RFL should have made a strategic decision with London 25 years ago and built a stadium in conjunction with the club and a Football club. Other sports get plenty of funding for such projects so the RFL should have been aiming for a slice of that pie. The game would now be in a far better and stronger position for it.

Instead we go round in circles, making the same mistakes and expanding or contracting at the whim of Sports England funding for development officers and in the case of London at the whim of the club's that London groundshare with.

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14 hours ago, Rupert Prince said:

If its so easy to build a new stadium on 8% then why haven't everyone done that... Castleford for instance?

Best wishes to London, but...     Getting back to the point, London would do well to get about 2500. At the moment.  What plans do they have to expend their fan base (if it's possible) and if and when that happens, surely then they can look to expand seating in their current base? And then move on.

Otherwise we seem to be simply looking to "build it and they will come".

Plus of course given the obsession with P&R, just HOW could they be expected to expand their fan base?

Most clubs are absolutely tiny businesses, you are talking about businesses turning over 2,3,4,5 million per year with probably 2.5-3m of that dependent on their continued position in SL.

Most stadiums are expensive, you are looking at ay £15m for the very cheapest in the north to £45m or so for a decent stadium. Nobody is going to lend Cas £15m, they will struggle to pay it off. 

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7 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

I want licensing back

I suspect we'd get a successor investor to Hughes if it was

 

  Great.But London Broncos wouldn't get a licence on the previous criteria

  http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_league/super_league/7138760.stm

  What criteria would you apply?


     Born - didn't ask. Dying - didn't argue                                 

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1 minute ago, Angelic Cynic said:

  Great.But London Broncos wouldn't get a licence on the previous criteria

  http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_league/super_league/7138760.stm

  What criteria would you apply?

The 'criteria' was the biggest mistake the game has made in a long time. Made it a tick-box competition rather than the much simpler process it was. 

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1 minute ago, Angelic Cynic said:

  Great.But London Broncos wouldn't get a licence on the previous criteria

  http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_league/super_league/7138760.stm

  What criteria would you apply?

1) Has Mark Tookey made more than 55 appearances for your club?

 

If the answer to (1) is yes, then you're in Super League for perpetuity.

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2 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

The 'criteria' was the biggest mistake the game has made in a long time. Made it a tick-box competition rather than the much simpler process it was. 

  Will you 'elite' clubs be pulling up the drawbridge without any criteria - other than 'currently in Super League?'


     Born - didn't ask. Dying - didn't argue                                 

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9 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

Trailfinders does not belong to the game or the club, and wouldn't achieve any of the things I suggested. What happens to it is irrelevant. The club is currently renting a facility that can barely be called a stadium, that is nowhere near SL standard and does not offer them any ability to scale their business. Trailfinders is a waste of time, if London are ever able to wash their own face it wont be there. They will need to move. Trailfinders can apply for all the grants they want, it wouldn't achieve any of the things I suggested for RL. 

I have no idea which three teams you are talking about. The RFL could fund a stadium, in conjunction with other bodies such as councils etc, and have a hub of RL in London. Governing bodies owning stadiums is a pretty common thing

Common thing?

Like the FA who are desperate to unload Wembley because of the debt but now are stuck with it. And Twickers is in debt thanks to the ground as well.

But your rigernarole is pointless in the context of my point, in that there are many places to fill before Broncos and RLF would get grants for a London stadium.

Please call off the search for another response to this, as I won't be repeating myself further.

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15 minutes ago, Angelic Cynic said:

  Will you 'elite' clubs be pulling up the drawbridge without any criteria - other than 'currently in Super League?'

There should be three criteria,

will you add to super league

Will you survive in Super league

and do you contribute to the long term strategic aims of growth and expansion. 

That's it. 

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13 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

Common thing?

Like the FA who are desperate to unload Wembley because of the debt but now are stuck with it. And Twickers is in debt thanks to the ground as well.

But your rigernarole is pointless in the context of my point, in that there are many places to fill before Broncos and RLF would get grants for a London stadium.

Please call off the search for another response to this, as I won't be repeating myself further.

Like Wembley which the FA have owned and made millions off for more than a century, like Twickenham which makes the RFU millions, Like Murrayfield which pretty much sustains Scottish RU, like the SFA buying Hampden Park, 

There is no hierarchy of grants, there is no list we are working our way through. The RFL would apply for grants like everyone else, and if it can put together a compelling bid(there is no reason it couldn't) then it would gain access to it 

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On 21/06/2019 at 23:47, Henson Park Old Firm said:

They need to build there own stadium

That's easily done, find some spare land in London that you can afford, then, oh... hang on...

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"I am the avenging angel; I come with wings unfurled, I come with claws extended from halfway round the world. I am the God Almighty, I am the howling wind. I care not for your family; I care not for your kin. I come in search of terror, though terror is my own; I come in search of vengeance for crimes and crimes unknown. I care not for your children, I care not for your wives, I care not for your country, I care not for your lives." - (c) Jim Boyes - "The Avenging Angel"

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4 hours ago, scotchy1 said:

No it isn't. Its an amateur level capacity and an amateur level quality. It is not a top tier level facility. 

It's good enough for an upper 2nd tier pro union team and a lower level SL club.  Have you been??

Edited by Tre Cool
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