Can Ralph Rimmer get Ottawa to the starting gate?

[dealwithit]

On 13/08/2019 at 09:49, Man of Kent said:

It’s a fact iLink is suing Toronto for an unpaid bill claim....

Attempting to sue, but likely to be resolved out of court. 

[The Parksider]

4 hours ago, RugbyLeagueMan said:

You remind me of a certain other poster.... but I am probably way off the mark.

The debate about wether it's good to follow the Perez plan and have a transatlantic league or follow the Superleague plan to have an anglo-french league certainly puts people into two opposite camps. 

But be under no illusion, ever since TWP appeared (In the championship) I have always said I welcome them wholeheartedly, it's just that I do not welcome them joining Superleague  because they will replace a club who underpins TV deals and produces players. That club will go into demise. 

Keep repeating that and well before we get to a transatlantic league SKY will have pulled the plug as the English content will have dropped below the level SKY require. What maybe makes me angry is that some people think insulting others and calling for them to be banned is good. 

I've no problem at all with as many NA clubs coming into the Championship who may try to grow the game in North America developing players and TV deals, and neither do the Championship have a problem either.  It's just that those who do not actually care about the health of the game, are bored with the M62, and just fancy a novelty act or two entering the SL stage don't like being pulled up on the damage this will do to the game we love....That OK with you??

3 hours ago, TIWIT said:

That will be Parky's head exploding. Or, if he is correct and Super League refuse to admit TWP, David Argyle's.

My head certainly won't explode, don't forget when I made the arguments against TWP being the saviours of Rugby league here, converting grid iron players to RL, bringing in massive North American TV deals, and waking North America up to the fantastic game of Rugby league NA fans would flock to, selling out the World Cup venues .....

It was other persons heads who exploded......................

"Put him on ignore" "he's an idiot" etc etc etc many times over. But three years on you know as well as I do that what few NA players they had they sacked,  that Canada RL hasn't produced any quality players in 10 years, Argyle hasn't bothered to even try, TWP pay to be on TV and have cancelled two showings, and immense amounts of money has to be paid out to prop this all up. 

NA World cup went "pop", Poor Brian Noble appears to have walked, Argylle found a heck of an excuse to excuse himself from TWP, and apparently the bills are piling up and not being promptly paid.

I think if you are keen on TWP succeeding as a viable and successful club, then maybe it's yours and David Argyles head that should already have exploded given the total shambles the club is now in??

But if your pretend North American team win the play off at least you can keep your heads on until any decision on promotion is made. Problem is McManus seemed to have made it a few weeks ago, and only last monday in League Express lenegan confirmed he'd like to push for Toulouse as well... 

1 hour ago, dealwithit said:

Attempting to sue, but likely to be resolved out of court. 

Why would this be resolved out of court? If TWP intend to carry on under their Limited Liability company who owe the money then of course anyone who is owed money just needs to get a lawyer to chase that money and also the said lawyers costs as well through the high court for the large debts.

If the limited liability company has no money or assets (I'm sure Mr. Argyle doesn't trade as TWP personally) then anyone owed money cannot get blood out of a stone. Do you not remember the Bradford Bulls putting their limited liability company into administration and most people not getting paid.

I know it's unthinkable everyone, that the Toronto Wolfpack may just call it a day and wind up, but it's looking more and more like that. So I do encourage anyone worried enough to take out insurance on their heads exploding?

MEMO TO WELLSY Yes I wholeheartedly welcomed them to the Championship. I qualified this in the sentence after. See above the bit in bold where I assist you accordingly with your grammatical error.

[Wellsy4HullFC]

7 minutes ago, The Parksider said:

But be under no illusion, ever since TWP appeared I have always said I welcome them wholeheartedly, it's just that I do not welcome them joining Superleague  because they will replace a club who underpins TV deals and produces players.

You do know what "wholeheartedly" means, don't you? Because not welcoming them to join the SL is a pretty big part of your heart to not be welcoming them with!

In short, you don't welcome them. Be under no illusion that you do.

[krakauer]

1 hour ago, The Parksider said:

 

But if your pretend North American team win the play off at least you can keep your heads on until any decision on promotion is made. Problem is McManus seemed to have made it a few weeks ago, and only last monday in League Express lenegan confirmed he'd like to push for Toulouse as well...

 "Push for Toulouse"? sounds like some under the table deal.

[Moove]

3 hours ago, The Parksider said:

But if your pretend North American team win the play off at least you can keep your heads on until any decision on promotion is made. Problem is McManus seemed to have made it a few weeks ago, and only last monday in League Express lenegan confirmed he'd like to push for Toulouse as well...

No he didn't. What he actually said was "I like Toulouse and I rate them highly. Toulouse and Perpignan together would be very attractive for a French broadcaster, with one home game in France taking place every week. I certainly think that would be an interesting prospect for the competition" [League Express, 12/8, page five]

Personally I would like to see Toulouse in SL and agree with what Lenagan said, however he did not 'confirm' he would like to 'push for Toulouse' at all

[Jayme2020]

11 hours ago, TIWIT said:

Artificial turf isn't it so the field won't be damaged by multiple users.

it still can be damaged.

[TIWIT]

34 minutes ago, Jayme2020 said:

it still can be damaged.

Hey, when I was a kid, the yard of one of the schools we played against was just lines painted on asphalt. And this wasn't just basketball, it was also soccer and softball. Needless to say, it was quite the homefield advantage for them.

[dealwithit]

9 hours ago, The Parksider said:

The debate about wether it's good to follow the Perez plan and have a transatlantic league or follow the Superleague plan to have an anglo-french league certainly puts people into two opposite camps. 

But be under no illusion, ever since TWP appeared (In the championship) I have always said I welcome them wholeheartedly, it's just that I do not welcome them joining Superleague  because they will replace a club who underpins TV deals and produces players. That club will go into demise. 

Keep repeating that and well before we get to a transatlantic league SKY will have pulled the plug as the English content will have dropped below the level SKY require. What maybe makes me angry is that some people think insulting others and calling for them to be banned is good. 

I've no problem at all with as many NA clubs coming into the Championship who may try to grow the game in North America developing players and TV deals, and neither do the Championship have a problem either.  It's just that those who do not actually care about the health of the game, are bored with the M62, and just fancy a novelty act or two entering the SL stage don't like being pulled up on the damage this will do to the game we love....That OK with you??

My head certainly won't explode, don't forget when I made the arguments against TWP being the saviours of Rugby league here, converting grid iron players to RL, bringing in massive North American TV deals, and waking North America up to the fantastic game of Rugby league NA fans would flock to, selling out the World Cup venues .....

It was other persons heads who exploded......................

"Put him on ignore" "he's an idiot" etc etc etc many times over. But three years on you know as well as I do that what few NA players they had they sacked,  that Canada RL hasn't produced any quality players in 10 years, Argyle hasn't bothered to even try, TWP pay to be on TV and have cancelled two showings, and immense amounts of money has to be paid out to prop this all up. 

NA World cup went "pop", Poor Brian Noble appears to have walked, Argylle found a heck of an excuse to excuse himself from TWP, and apparently the bills are piling up and not being promptly paid.

I think if you are keen on TWP succeeding as a viable and successful club, then maybe it's yours and David Argyles head that should already have exploded given the total shambles the club is now in??

But if your pretend North American team win the play off at least you can keep your heads on until any decision on promotion is made. Problem is McManus seemed to have made it a few weeks ago, and only last monday in League Express lenegan confirmed he'd like to push for Toulouse as well... 

Why would this be resolved out of court? If TWP intend to carry on under their Limited Liability company who owe the money then of course anyone who is owed money just needs to get a lawyer to chase that money and also the said lawyers costs as well through the high court for the large debts.

If the limited liability company has no money or assets (I'm sure Mr. Argyle doesn't trade as TWP personally) then anyone owed money cannot get blood out of a stone. Do you not remember the Bradford Bulls putting their limited liability company into administration and most people not getting paid.

I know it's unthinkable everyone, that the Toronto Wolfpack may just call it a day and wind up, but it's looking more and more like that. So I do encourage anyone worried enough to take out insurance on their heads exploding?

MEMO TO WELLSY Yes I wholeheartedly welcomed them to the Championship. I qualified this in the sentence after. See above the bit in bold where I assist you accordingly with your grammatical error.

 

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5246453

Bob Hunter has overseen the growth of B.C. Place Stadium, Rogers Centre, Scotiabank Arena and BMO Field. Now he is looking to help take the Toronto Wolfpack to the next level.

The former Maple Leaf Sports & Entertainment executive has been named chairman and interim CEO of the transatlantic rugby league team.

"With Bob's experience and reputation in the Toronto sports market, I am confident that he is the right person to help build and increase our organization's foothold in the Canadian sports landscape," Argyle said in a statement. "One of our goals is to improve and reshape our fans' experience at Lamport Stadium and there is no one better than Bob to help lead us in that direction."

———

I think you might be wrong. 

[Omott91]

10 hours ago, The Parksider said:

What maybe makes me angry is that some people think insulting others and calling for them to be banned is good. 

Who and when did anybody call for you to be banned?

 You keep posting this yet there is no evidence of this ever happening.

 Stop being disingenuous and lying. 

[Jayme2020]

1 hour ago, TIWIT said:

Hey, when I was a kid, the yard of one of the schools we played against was just lines painted on asphalt. And this wasn't just basketball, it was also soccer and softball. Needless to say, it was quite the homefield advantage for them.

Ontario leagues right or wrong get very nit picky on the shape of fields and i would say in Ontario 60% are turf.

[TIWIT]

1 minute ago, Jayme2020 said:

Ontario leagues right or wrong get very nit picky on the shape of fields and i would say in Ontario 60% are turf.

This was a very long time ago. And what was the playground is now a little open area with swings, slides etc. between the parking lot and the portables. Still paved though.

[dealwithit]

2 hours ago, Raumati Rugby said:

I genuinely think that Rugby League fans are a gullible as any I have ever encountered....
10 years ago
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2009/dec/21/wakefield-trinity-stadium-plans

Why do we embrace such bluster as good news when reality is hitting us in the face...? I'd add, it's a white face and not a black one, because that would be racist.....as the OWNER of the club has been identified as.

Gullible to what? One person says the Wolfpack are winding up, a factual article says the opposite. 

[Oxford]

3 hours ago, Raumati Rugby said:

as is the CEO who will be the front for the racist owner.

This bit is as unnecessary as it is stupid.

 

3 hours ago, Raumati Rugby said:

TWP will be nowhere near SL unless they're paying for flights.....you didn't hear it here first, because you didn't want to.

This bit remains to be seen but I have seen it posted, a few hundred times I think, and that was only Parky. And I responded to it, and so did some others. I'm not sure why you feel the need to say it again unless you're a fan of films that need subtitles?

 

[Oxford]

6 hours ago, Omott91 said:

Who and when did anybody call for you to be banned?

 You keep posting this yet there is no evidence of this ever happening.

 Stop being disingenuous and lying. 

I have never said that either and I'm Parky's biggest critic. I put him on ignore because he says the same thing over and over again. He is very insulting in a general sense but that's largely because anyone who doesn't agree with him not being clever enough to spot the truth when it hits them in the face.

He says if TWP join SL one English club will go into decline and ignores the fact that whoever replaces one club according to the rules of the competition the club going down may indeed decline. In this he totally ignores the role of P&R which he championed ad infinitum before its return . Neither the Bulls nor Widnes were replaced by TWP.

I have to say that he cuts a lonely figure in my ignore pile because he's not there for the same reasons as the others, though without him and them the place is a lot more agreeable as an experience. Though no less disagreeing!

[The Parksider]

18 hours ago, Moove said:

No he didn't. What he actually said was "I like Toulouse and I rate them highly. Toulouse and Perpignan together would be very attractive for a French broadcaster, with one home game in France taking place every week. I certainly think that would be an interesting prospect for the competition"

No sorry, when the SL bosses first met TO in France when they had a big dinner event around 2012 they were all for TO to be in Superleague but told them they must contribute to the TV money and produce players, both of which Catalans had been lax in doing. 

Lenegan and McManus were there cheerleading the idea of Touluse, and have done this ever since, and now are openly talking about accepting them into Superleague next year and are looking with Elstone and the two french clubs for a TV deal now, based on them both being in Superleague next year providing a french home game every week and three french derbies.

Hey- what's not to like there but there is more........?

A deal that would involve not just TV money but French SL players in both sides and of course the catalans reserves and the toulouse reserves who play in the French Competition, also qualify TO to be in Superleague. Please remember Argyle ignored this mandatory entry requirement that already disqualifies TWP.

A French deal could also boost the french playing numbers and bring back a meaningful Great Britain versus France test match series??

Hey - what about that that was the whole point of French expansion? How can Canadian expansion ever bring us test matches?

Your "point" is so narrow with respect it's no point at all. I may be wrong but it appears inconceivable that the two top SL bosses who have neen  backed by several other SL bosses in working towards Toulouse coming in for a number of years, in which Toulouse have french players, have reserves and have every chance of being part of a french TV deal and GB test games...........

Would just abandon their plans for france and all that hard work to allow a team into Superleague they see as a "Team of antipodeans and English players dressed up in  canadian jerseys" As McManus called them and I am sure his colleagues agree.....

I know that there is an idea if TWP win it they go up, but I am afraid that if they do go up what a booby prize that would be for the SL bosses who have had their hearts set on more from France for some years now. You have to remember my friend that Toronto have no right to enter SL if SL says no. They have been saying yes to France for years now and the signs are really good for more French players, GB/French Tests, French derbies, bigger French TV deal with a game shown every week.

The overwhelming evidence across several seasons now is Superleague want and can have Toulouse next year. Aren't Toulouse signing to play in a bigger stadium??

 

12 hours ago, dealwithit said:

Bob Hunter has overseen the growth of B.C. Place Stadium, Rogers Centre, Scotiabank Arena and BMO Field. Now he is looking to help take the Toronto Wolfpack to the next level.

I think you might be wrong. 

Well after my post above you may need to think again, but better than that actually look up the whole story about Superleague and the inclusion of France. I've set out the basics for you above, but all the ya-boo aside Superleague really do need to move on Toulouse now.

As for Bob Hunter, I  wonder what length of contract has he signed? Three months may be enough to firstly see TWP maintain their proud best to see the season out to the play off final which I think they will do as sportsmen. 

After that they will carry on whilst Superleague decide who to promote, and make no mistake again, they do not have to promote TWP and have refused entry to member clubs before (never mind how long ago this was) it still stands.

If they are in SL then Mr. Hunter can look forward to a contract extension, rather than see his last month out selling off the playing staff and what few other assets they may have, before looking to wind up the Ltd. Company BUT.........

Toronto and Argyle actually may surprise me (well shock me) and others and may stay in the Championship to fight on to earn a Superleague place another day (how he will manage to field reserves though I don't know). I think that the reason Ottawa backed off starting 2020 was to see what happens with TWP.   Perez was going to at least hire a coach but I think he even backed off that?

Finally Mr. Hunter must still talk about promotion and finding a bigger ground, if the beer tents get wind of a block on TWP for SL (I think dropping the last two regular season games from TV was a signal) ticket sales would plummet for the play offs.

They would not even be able to "give tickets away" (sorry guys could not resist)

3 hours ago, SL17 said:

If you have him on ignore at least have the decency to stop posting about him.

Thanks for that your a Gentleman.  It's gone on for three years now and I'm pretty immune to it. I take my dressings down from the Mods if I go too far, and I don't report anyone to them because those two Gentlemen have better things to do.

I look at it like this SL17 = If they are concentrating on insulting me and demonising me then it only shows they cannot actually engage in the facts of the matter to hand. 

As we approach what may be the ultimate moment in the ultimate debate I can only reflect just how much evidence there is - so much from the SL horses mouth - that whatever happens Toulouse are most likely going up and not TWP.

I also reflect how Argyle backed off some weeks ago, when maybe he got the word himself (for I cannot believe that true gentlemen can look to be pre-deciding Toulouse are going up without privately telling Mr. Argylle in advance) I think Mr. Argyle may have been told and that's why he's pretty much gone to ground.

I know there's this idea Hunter is looking to "take TWP to the next level" (rather than see the season out, and wind things up with minimum losses) but they are hardly going to say that are they.....  

[Moove]

 

1 hour ago, The Parksider said:

Your "point" is so narrow with respect it's no point at all. I may be wrong but it appears inconceivable that the two top SL bosses who have neen  backed by several other SL bosses in working towards Toulouse coming in for a number of years, in which Toulouse have french players, have reserves and have every chance of being part of a french TV deal and GB test games

The point was simply that you made something up and presented it as fact, that is all. Regardless of how inconceivable it may appear to be to you and I

1 hour ago, The Parksider said:

No sorry

Apology accepted. Just don't lie about things being in respected publications like League Express when they're clearly not

[Davo5]

12 hours ago, Omott91 said:

 

 You keep posting this yet there is no evidence of this ever happening.

 Stop being disingenuous and lying. 

But he does it so well.

[dealwithit]

1 hour ago, The Parksider said:

 

As for Bob Hunter, I  wonder what length of contract has he signed? Three months may be enough to firstly see TWP maintain their proud best to see the season out to the play off final which I think they will do as sportsmen. 

After that they will carry on whilst Superleague decide who to promote, and make no mistake again, they do not have to promote TWP and have refused entry to member clubs before (never mind how long ago this was) it still stands.

If they are in SL then Mr. Hunter can look forward to a contract extension, rather than see his last month out selling off the playing staff and what few other assets they may have, before looking to wind up the Ltd. Company BUT.........

Toronto and Argyle actually may surprise me (well shock me) and others and may stay in the Championship to fight on to earn a Superleague place another day (how he will manage to field reserves though I don't know). I think that the reason Ottawa backed off starting 2020 was to see what happens with TWP.   Perez was going to at least hire a coach but I think he even backed off that?

Finally Mr. Hunter must still talk about promotion and finding a bigger ground, if the beer tents get wind of a block on TWP for SL (I think dropping the last two regular season games from TV was a signal) ticket sales would plummet for the play offs.

They would not even be able to "give tickets away" (sorry guys could not resist)

Thanks for that your a Gentleman.  It's gone on for three years now and I'm pretty immune to it. I take my dressings down from the Mods if I go too far, and I don't report anyone to them because those two Gentlemen have better things to do.

I look at it like this SL17 = If they are concentrating on insulting me and demonising me then it only shows they cannot actually engage in the facts of the matter to hand. 

As we approach what may be the ultimate moment in the ultimate debate I can only reflect just how much evidence there is - so much from the SL horses mouth - that whatever happens Toulouse are most likely going up and not TWP.

I also reflect how Argyle backed off some weeks ago, when maybe he got the word himself (for I cannot believe that true gentlemen can look to be pre-deciding Toulouse are going up without privately telling Mr. Argylle in advance) I think Mr. Argyle may have been told and that's why he's pretty much gone to ground.

I know there's this idea Hunter is looking to "take TWP to the next level" (rather than see the season out, and wind things up with minimum losses) but they are hardly going to say that are they.....  

If you watched the video you could hear straight from the horses mouth. Argyle and Wolfpack are looking straight at SL. They want to improve Lamport. They want to grow the brand. The new Chair/CEO has plenty of runs onthe board. 

[Loup]

1 hour ago, The Parksider said:

Lenegan and McManus were there cheerleading the idea of Touluse, and have done this ever since, and now are openly talking about accepting them into Superleague next year and are looking with Elstone and the two french clubs for a TV deal now, based on them both being in Superleague next year providing a french home game every week and three french derbies.

They could admit both clubs if they chose to expand SL.

 I think that the reason Ottawa backed off starting 2020 was to see what happens with TWP.   Perez was going to at least hire a coach but I think he even backed off that?

Ottawa's association with OSEG and now Wolfpack's with MLSE is one great big synergy. Two big sports and entertainment groups are very interested in the future of rugby league in Canada - early days, but this has a lot of potential. MLSE is jointly owned by Rogers and Bell (as another poster pointed out in a thread that disappeared overnight) and these two corporations control all the major sports tv channels in the country. As tv deals are one of your biggest complaints, you'll want to keep an eye on this unfolding.

Finally Mr. Hunter must still talk about promotion and finding a bigger ground,

Wolfpack are happy at Lamport and Bob Hunter, on the day his appointment was made public, is already talking about fixing it up. It's the perfect location and very fan friendly. But the Wolfpack don't own it, so any negotiations will be done with the city. Which is exactly how BMO Field went through two expansions.

if the beer tents get wind of a block on TWP for SL (I think dropping the last two regular season games from TV was a signal) ticket sales would plummet for the play offs.

Not a chance. You've entered the land of wishful thinking.

 I can only reflect just how much evidence there is - so much from the SL horses mouth - that whatever happens Toulouse are most likely going up and not TWP.

The only place I'm hearing this is your posts.

 I think Mr. Argyle may have been told and that's why he's pretty much gone to ground.

David Argyle has been a very visible presence at the last three home games and will be at all the rest. He also spoke at last night's Tackle Talks, a Q&A/meet the team event for fans, and introduced Bob Hunter. There's no doubt that reaching Super League is this season's goal. David always does the rounds and greets many fans personally. That's not my definition of 'gone to ground'.

Thing is, Parky, you are trying to paint a picture of a team unravelling when the evidence on the ground is exactly the opposite. I'm not fussed if this is what you believe, but I hope others aren't taking your wishful thinking as gospel.

 

 

[TIWIT]

4 hours ago, The Parksider said:

I think that the reason Ottawa backed off starting 2020 was to see what happens with TWP.   Perez was going to at least hire a coach but I think he even backed off that?

For the first time in FOREVER I actually agree with you. No point in starting a project when you know it's just going to lead to a dead-end.

[Tommygilf]

11 minutes ago, TIWIT said:

For the first time in FOREVER I actually agree with you. No point in starting a project when you know it's just going to lead to a dead-end.

Personally I think that was a contributing factor, another being that they were approved so late in the season (after the watershed on out of contract players signing for new clubs was lifted)

[TIWIT]

Just now, Tommygilf said:

Personally I think that was a contributing factor, another being that they were approved so late in the season (after the watershed on out of contract players signing for new clubs was lifted)

Good point. And had it even been firmly established that they were going to start in League 1. Maybe those clubs, already facing an uncertain future, didn't want the added expense of coming to Canada and would prefer Ottawa start in the Championship.

[TIWIT]

2 hours ago, Loup said:

MLSE is jointly owned by Rogers and Bell (as another poster pointed out in a thread that disappeared overnight)

You're right, it's gone. Not moved, removed. Very strange. Wonder why?

[fighting irish]

I'm tired of constant references to Parksider and his convictions and of his own repetitive ranting. 

I tried to get him to acknowledge that everyone here is unaware of the details of any agreement Toronto have with SuperLeague, so largely commenting in ignorance. That didn't conform to his dogmatic spin.

My gut feeling is that David Argyle has not invested a huge sum of money hoping that SL will be nice to him without any black and white contractual assurances from them. That idea is, quite frankly, laughable and is behaviour more akin to a car boot sale entrepreneur than a billionaire business man.

I am less confident however, that the captains of industry that run our SuperLeague clubs will not renege (or try to) on any deal previously negotiated on their behalf.

I think that's more likely, than Argyle being a fool, but I hope they are men of integrity and honour their part of the bargain.

Anyway we shall see, in a few weeks time all will be revealed and at least half of all this unpleasant angry banter will be proven, nothing more than hot air. 

[ojx]

27 minutes ago, fighting irish said:

Anyway we shall see, in a few weeks time all will be revealed and at least half of all this unpleasant angry banter will be proven, nothing more than hot air. 

I fully agree frighting. There is way too much opinionated speculation about closed door negotiations. I guess that is what forums are for though.