3 Aug: SL: Catalans Dragons v Warrington Wolves (Merged Threads)

[Exiled Wiganer]

I think we are a sport where you can pretty much always take your family. I have never had to think twice in all the years I have taken my children to games. I would think twice about trips to Warrington, Cas or Fev, based purely on previous personal experiences, but would not hesitate anywhere else. This was such an outlier or an incident we should be careful of extrapolating into infinity. Deal with it firmly and fairly and quickly and move on. 

I was really disappointed that both coaches were at pains to blame the ref. In the aftermath of yesterday’s game, the timing was self serving and pernicious. 

[my missus]

what is amazing about this is it hasn't even made the bbc sports news just shows how much our profile has dipped.

[Bring back the Boyd]

I think Blake Austin remarked to the ref after being almost spear tackled:”I want to go home tonight Sir”—- he was looking to the referee to protect the players from foul play—- this applies to both sides obviously. Only the Captain can approach the ref to get clarification on decisions. Any other players haranguing or worse should be penalised immediately and binned if they persist. As an amateur, the Captain of most teams tended to be a calm and level headed type who could rein in the more volatile type—— everybody called the ref Sir and generally took the poor decisions on the chin——-speccies gave abuse and that’ll never change. Chris Hill should be nowhere near the Captain role because he lacks the ability to show respect and reason calmly and rationally. Referees need to enforce the rules and penalise dissent immediately. We never want to take the passion away from fans but I think clubs should consider paying for a Police presence inside grounds to deal with the morons —- every club has them to varying degrees—- stewards aren’t the answer to the drunken, foul mouthed idiots who think it’s ok to F and blind in front of kids. 

[deluded pom?]

53 minutes ago, Dave T said:

For the avoidance of doubt, I have nowt against Hull fans (even OF seemed a very nice man!), and have no desire to use any other club to defend any Wire fans.

“seemed a very nice man”. Not was a very nice man. Seemed a very nice man!

[deluded pom?]

1 hour ago, meast said:

I don't think cricket fans use the match officials as excuses to behave badly which seems to be epidemic in football and RL!

Bearing in mind English cricket fans at an Ashes Test Match played in England will be in the vast majority so little chance to fight the opposition fans. Some of the cricket fans at the first Test come across to me as very boorish. Booing Aussie players and waving sandpaper. There’s no class in this country any more. It’s just not cricket became part of the English language for a reason. That reason has all but disappeared.

[Dave T]

44 minutes ago, Exiled Wiganer said:

This was such an outlier or an incident we should be careful of extrapolating into infinity. Deal with it firmly and fairly and quickly and move on. 

I'm not so sure and I'm not convinced the SL/RFl statement about this being alien to RL is helpful as it can easily be proved wrong.

I wont go into listing incidents, but we have now utilised football rules for alcohol at the Grand Final because people cant behave and we saw an incident many times worse than this live on BBC for a game a handful of years back.

[Denton Rovers RLFC]

7 hours ago, Oxford said:

Although I've seen far too many brawls so long as the game deals with it it'll blow over.

Don't be fooled into thinking it's limited to this match or those fans or the two clubs it's all our problem.

I'll make a bet before I've seen any press coverage that this'll be the most collumn inches we've had in quite some time and the RFL's actions will be lucky to see daylight by comparison.

as for

Hardly surprising that comments like this will come out at the moment and I'm talking about the quotes not Celt here.

Fining the clubs is the poorest stock response and points deduction might not be a bad idea. I know it's probably not in the rules but being knocked out of the play-offs would send a real message for a change.

 

Fining the clubs for their players actions is not a poor stock response, it's a reasonable response to what actually happened, clubs need to get their players in check, Hill for instance was massively disrespectful to J.Child and Child should have sent him off for not doing what he was told to do. Clearly Hill is incapable of not just being a captain but of actually playing by the rules of doing what the ref tells you to do (amongst many others yesterday), and in those circumstances by not getting the game over and done with he was exacerbating matters further.

Punishing clubs with hefty fines because their players brought the game into disrepute might actually sink in to owners/coaches that the way players behave as they did yesterday will not be tolerated. Outhouse stuff wasn't isolated it was virtually throughout the whole match, hands, knees, forearms on the head/neck in the tackle and whilst players were on the ground, high shots left right and centre,, just grubby carp pretty much all match long, it was ugly.

Child has his hands tied by Ganson and the RFL because of the way they want things controlled or to 'let the game flow' which as I've said before fails to grasp basic human psychology in how to control matters. By not enforcing the rules and by continually 'coaching' players thsi backfires massively, by not penalising they make the game more stop start and unwatchable than by actually upholding the laws of the game and sticking to them. This in turn makes the refs seem weak and puts huge pressure on them to control things. 

The sick thing is if you watch Ganson at his best, and at times he really was a superb ref, he can control things, penalise players and let the game flow without any of the rubbish that goes on now. I watched the 2005 CC final again recently and he has a very good game and isn't commanding players every second, just as refs before that did too.

Accusations Child lost control is in part correct but he cannot stop these thugs from what they are doing because firstly they are thugs and he physically cannot stop them and the structure of what he (Child) can do is limiting. In fact he was well within his rights to abandon the game.

I hope both clubs get hammered but doubt it.

[JohnM]

Of the game itself,  I though that  Sam Tomkins was getting some decent  form back. His goal kickung was excellent as was the rest of his play.

[Saintslass]

1 hour ago, my missus said:

what is amazing about this is it hasn't even made the bbc sports news just shows how much our profile has dipped.

It did make the news, yesterday and this morning.  It was on the TV news, it was on the BBC sports web pages and indeed briefly on the main BBC news web page.  It was trending on Twitter at one point last night.  

[deluded pom?]

12 minutes ago, Saintslass said:

It did make the news, yesterday and this morning.  It was on the TV news, it was on the BBC sports web pages and indeed briefly on the main BBC news web page.  It was trending on Twitter at one point last night.  

I assume the BBC can get footage when it’s bad news but rarely any other time.

[barnyia]

It sounds stupid but the people in the vip area could have really done some damage to the Warrington people as if they'd have just pushed them  downthey could have really hurt themselves,(it's quite high up and the stand is very steep) I don't find it as bad as what I've read from the video I've seen, it could have been a lot worse if the catalans fans in the stand had come over, it looks like 10 or so fans trying to get up to the vip areas and the business owners/bosses in the area trying to get get them down, I know who one of the people is in the vip who tried to calm it down, then punch one and then try to calm it down again. I'm sure that he won't get banned from the ground! 

[Jim Prendle]

Just watched it on YouTube.

Disgusting.

I look forward to seeing a large number of lifetime bans for those retarded chavs who claim to be Warrington fans.

[glemiln]

27 minutes ago, Denton Rovers RLFC said:

Punishing clubs with hefty fines because their players brought the game into disrepute might actually sink in to owners/coaches that the way players behave as they did yesterday will not be tolerated. Outhouse stuff wasn't isolated it was virtually throughout the whole match, hands, knees, forearms on the head/neck in the tackle and whilst players were on the ground, high shots left right and centre,, just grubby carp pretty much all match long, it was ugly.

Sadly, another growing aspect of the game is when groups of players, of both sides, surge towards an incident usually resulting in a pathetic mass brawl. This happened yesterday late in the escalating cauldron and certainly did not help the carnage shortly to kick off.

[Dave T]

19 minutes ago, Jim Prendle said:

I look forward to seeing a large number of lifetime bans for those retarded chavs who claim to be Warrington fans.

Jim, they ARE Wire fans. I hate the culture we have in RL where we try and disown trouble makers, blaming them on football, or claiming they arent true fans, so that we can retain our sense of superiority. 

Both Wire, and the sport in general has plenty of balloons following them, and as a sport we need to decide what to do about it. 

[ELBOWSEYE]

21 minutes ago, Jim Prendle said:

Just watched it on YouTube.

Disgusting.

I look forward to seeing a large number of lifetime bans for those retarded chavs who claim to be Warrington fans.

Life time bans ,people get round them ,some fans were banned for smoke bombs but get other people to get tickets.  But glad you are balanced again  only Warrington fans, when footage clearly shows fans from both clubs. But hey lets resprt to type and kick Warrington. 

[WakefieldCityLoyal]

It will be the standard RL procedure when dealing with crowd trouble.  Both clubs will condemn the action of a small number of fans, say they are a proud family club and will ban those responsible ( say they have handed lifetime bans but not name them) the RFL will hand out suspended fines.  All major finals Magic weekends etc will have fans unable to handle their drink goading each other spoiling it for others but it doesn’t matter because it’s classed as banter.  You feel safer taking the family to the football than the Rugby, because idiots can cause trouble at Rugby and know nothing will happen to them.

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, WakefieldCityLoyal said:

It will be the standard RL procedure when dealing with crowd trouble.  Both clubs will condemn the action of a small number of fans, say they are a proud family club and will ban those responsible ( say they have handed lifetime bans but not name them) the RFL will hand out suspended fines.  All major finals Magic weekends etc will have fans unable to handle their drink goading each other spoiling it for others but it doesn’t matter because it’s classed as banter.  You feel safer taking the family to the football than the Rugby, because idiots can cause trouble at Rugby and know nothing will happen to them.

I made the point last week in the discussion after the semi final trouble that I wont sit in standard seats at things like the Grand Final anymore and that the atmosphere at Magic has been unsavoury for a few years.

Less than a week later we have yet another example of bad behaviour, likely to be alcohol fuelled.

[bobbruce]

6 hours ago, 7723 said:

Only just seen it in full. Kenny Edwards, Chris Hill and Mamo could all have easily seen red as well.

Mamo could’ve had three reds. 

[bobbruce]

5 hours ago, Exiled Wiganer said:

I stopped watching when it got to 30-10, but I didn’t think it was the dirtiest game I have ever seen up to then. 

You are a Wigan fan.

[Exiled Wiganer]

7 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

You are a Wigan fan.

Indeed, and I simply can’t imagine the fury of righteous indignation on here had we been the away team yesterday. They’d have run out of pitchforks within 10 minutes of the first attack. 

[Lowdesert]

2 hours ago, Dave T said:

For the avoidance of doubt, I have nowt against Hull fans (even OF seemed a very nice man!), and have no desire to use any other club to defend any Wire fans.

The example was around context that there have been some issues with the Frenh fans in that corner raised by two other people in recent games.

There is nothing in me referring to Hulls game, no need for any offence to be taken mate.

Fair enough. Forget it.

During my time living there, I was embarrassed to be English many times.  That’s not to say the French can’t be idiots - there is always a stocky guy with glasses who berates the linesman and players while he’s stood at the railing in Guasch from minute one and......I have seen many, many pi**ed Frenchman drive out of the St.Cyp golf club before - but we English just don’t get it with the booze.

Fans aside, IMO, the Refs have to stop cow towing to coaches requests and stop the incessant instructions to players.  It shouldn’t be about the Refs but more and more games seem to be.

 

[Jim Prendle]

45 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Life time bans ,people get round them ,some fans were banned for smoke bombs but get other people to get tickets.  But glad you are balanced again  only Warrington fans, when footage clearly shows fans from both clubs. But hey lets resprt to type and kick Warrington. 

Oh, OK, we'll just take them round the back and shoot them then.

The retards I saw attempting to get into that area behind the stand were Warrington fans. You really need to accept that, and stop defending the idefensible.

[Wellsy4HullFC]

16 minutes ago, Jim Prendle said:

Oh, OK, we'll just take them round the back and shoot them then.

The retards I saw attempting to get into that area behind the stand were Warrington fans. You really need to accept that, and stop defending the idefensible.

He's not saying they're not Warrington fans. He's saying that it wasn't only Warrington fans that caused issues.

I find it hard to believe that they began climbing up there for no reason. I can't imagine the French banter or insults being understood by many/any of the English followers down there. Something must have set them off, and I reports of something being thrown from there make sense.

[Dave T]

4 minutes ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

He's not saying they're not Warrington fans. He's saying that it wasn't only Warrington fans that caused issues.

I find it hard to believe that they began climbing up there for no reason. I can't imagine the French banter or insults being understood by many/any of the English followers down there. Something must have set them off, and I reports of something being thrown from there make sense.

There is some relatively shocking video of the bar chair being used on the fans below from the hospitality section online now. It looks like the incident had already started by then, but it was pretty early on.

I couldn't care less where the troublemakers were from, hopefully the CCTV will have clear video of it all and action can be taken.

[JonM]

27 minutes ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

I find it hard to believe that they began climbing up there for no reason. I can't imagine the French banter or insults being understood by many/any of the English followers down there. Something must have set them off, and I reports of something being thrown from there make sense.

I'm pretty sure the English fans below would be able to understand Ben Pomeroy - certainly looks like he was one of the people in there. No idea whether he was one of those saying anything.

I'll refrain from repeating my observation about who it was who threw the glass of beer from the VIP area until the RFL have had a chance to look at all the footage.