Reports suggest Toronto Wolfpack not guaranteed SL place

[GUBRATS]

1 hour ago, Themusician_2 said:

All I want is for union to be defeated so we can properly grow league in Canada.We are still playing on union terms if you know what I mean. But unfortunately no leadership from Canada recognizes this issue.

I couldn't care less what happens to union anywhere , I don't understand why anybody should care , I would like to see RL become more established elsewhere , how that is achieved I don't know , maybe it can be done by investment in pro teams into the UK structure be SL , as long as it doesn't impact upon the UK structure negatively then fine 

[CanadianRugger]

Why do we have to do away with promotion/relegation?  The problem the Rugby Football League has isn't P+R itself, it's that the yardsticks are ever changing to suit some short term/political agenda.  Toronto Wolfpack P+R question being the latest example of this.  

There is some benefit to having promotion/relegation in that it allows teams to work out any cracks in the business before they hit the big time, there is an argument to be made that spending three seasons outside Super League benefitted Toronto in terms of building a brand and working out management/corporate issues.

That being said, I think there are too many Leagues right now.  League 1 is too small and is withering on the vine, meanwhile we have a two tier Championship with the haves and have nots.

Super League expands to 18 clubs with some sort of conference system and half the Championship gets rolled in to League 1 with a proper conference system.  Do this and Toronto, Toulouse, Featherstone, York, Leigh, Bradford and London are all in Super League right now.  Any TV revenue is shared equally between all 18 clubs.  

Keep promotion and relegation between the two leagues, one up/one down every season.  The club moving down receives a parachute payment and the club coming up receives a considerable pay day.

Also, keep dual registration as is.  It gives young players a chance to play when they otherwise wouldn't and also enhances the play in the lower league.  

 

[CanadianRugger]

How many times have clubs been denied promotion and done significant harm to that club and the wider game?

 

[Tommygilf]

1 hour ago, TheReaper said:

Best thing you've posted. Genius! Somebody copyright that!

You can't tell me you've not heard of Cas Vegas, Ponte Carlo and Shakey Wakey??

[Themusician_2]

1 hour ago, Loup said:

Are you actually in Canada? Because this post is bonkers.

Whether I'm Canadian or not you can't deny the places where league is strongest union is either weak (Australia) or dead (papua new Giunea). In order for league to truly flourish in Canada union must be defeated.

[Themusician_2]

1 hour ago, GUBRATS said:

I couldn't care less what happens to union anywhere , I don't understand why anybody should care , I would like to see RL become more established elsewhere , how that is achieved I don't know , maybe it can be done by investment in pro teams into the UK structure be SL , as long as it doesn't impact upon the UK structure negatively then fine 

Because league is reliant on union players in north america

[GUBRATS]

16 minutes ago, Themusician_2 said:

Whether I'm Canadian or not you can't deny the places where league is strongest union is either weak (Australia) or dead (papua new Giunea). In order for league to truly flourish in Canada union must be defeated.

Best of luck with that 

[GUBRATS]

2 minutes ago, Themusician_2 said:

Because league is reliant on union players in north america

Exactly , so if we are to see any actual Canadians playing for Canadian teams within the UK RL structure , they will almost be 100 % union converts 

[Themusician_2]

3 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Exactly , so if we are to see any actual Canadians playing for Canadian teams within the UK RL structure , they will almost be 100 % union converts 

And you think that's a good thing

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, Themusician_2 said:

And you think that's a good thing

Certainly yes 

[Big Picture]

17 minutes ago, Themusician_2 said:

Because league is reliant on union players in north america

Only because the organizers have taken that easy route instead of targetting former gridiron players who aren't playing union and building their teams that way instead.

[GUBRATS]

2 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

Only because the organizers have taken that easy route instead of targetting former gridiron players who aren't playing union and building their teams that way instead.

Grid iron players with no experience of either code of RL will never be as good as somebody who has played ' Rugby ' , simple as 

[Themusician_2]

2 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

Only because the organizers have taken that easy route instead of targetting former gridiron players who aren't playing union and building their teams that way instead.

You are spot on but the question is why take that route knowing league would be stronger long term not relying on union we have the better game that is more suited to NA's.

[Themusician_2]

5 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Certainly yes 

I prefer RL having their own systems in place 

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, Themusician_2 said:

I prefer RL having their own systems in place 

So do I , but that will take 20/30/40 years to start producing SL quality players 

[Big Picture]

1 minute ago, GUBRATS said:

Grid iron players with no experience of either code of RL will never be as good as somebody who has played ' Rugby ' , simple as 

I can't speak about the US, but all just about all Canadian RU players have also played gridiron and many who played gridiron up to the top levels below the CFL have also played RU.  Akarika Dawn is an example of a gridiron player adapting to RL, he played linebacker at Power Five school Colorado before he became an RL player.

[Big Picture]

4 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Grid iron players with no experience of either code of RL will never be as good as somebody who has played ' Rugby ' , simple as 

Duplicate post removed — moderators, why can't we just delete such posts like we can on Facebook etc?

[GUBRATS]

2 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

I can't speak about the US, but all just about all Canadian RU players have also played gridiron and many who played gridiron up to the top levels below the CFL have also played RU.  Akarika Dawn is an example of a gridiron player adapting to RL, he played linebacker at Power Five school Colorado before he became an RL player.

But he's played union , and we are talking about SL quality RL players , not NC level or below 

[GUBRATS]

3 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

I can't speak about the US, but all just about all Canadian RU players have also played gridiron and many who played gridiron up to the top levels below the CFL have also played RU.  Akarika Dawn is an example of a gridiron player adapting to RL, he played linebacker at Power Five school Colorado before he became an RL player.

Have all Canadian Grid Iron players played Union ?

[Big Picture]

2 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

But he's played union , and we are talking about SL quality RL players , not NC level or below 

Dawn's Wikipedia entry has so such information, and it also states that he played for the Burleigh Bears down under, a club which plays in the level just below the NRL.  That's certainly not NC level or below.

[Big Picture]

6 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Have all Canadian Grid Iron players played Union ?

That's difficult to say, but I doubt that they all have.  Apart from the difference in how many players a team in either sport needs, the offensive linemen would have few (if any) skills transferable to RU.  Then again even they would likely have done at least some RU in their high school phys. ed. classes.

[GUBRATS]

2 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

Dawn's Wikipedia entry has so such information, and it also states that he played for the Burleigh Bears down under, a club which plays in the level just below the NRL.  That's certainly not NC level or below.

Yes I know the Burleigh club , visited it once , how many games did he play for them ?

[CanadianRugger]

7 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Have all Canadian Grid Iron players played Union ?

Yes, almost all have.  Mostly because the seasons in school are different.  Football is a fall sport while rugby union is a spring sport.

I coached rugby union, some of the better players on my team were also stars for their respective football teams.

My best player who was our stand off was the QB of his high school football team.

 

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, CanadianRugger said:

Yes, almost all have.  Mostly because the seasons in school are different.  Football is a fall sport while rugby union is a spring sport.

I coached rugby union, some of the better players on my team were also stars for their respective football teams.

My best player who was our stand off was the QB of his high school football team.

 

So as I said , the ones who could possibly convert WILL have played Union ?

[Big Picture]

11 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

So as I said , the ones who could possibly convert WILL have played Union ?

And among Canadian gridiron players, as CanadianRugger points out that will be the vast majority of them.

13 minutes ago, CanadianRugger said:

Yes, almost all have.  Mostly because the seasons in school are different.  Football is a fall sport while rugby union is a spring sport.

I coached rugby union, some of the better players on my team were also stars for their respective football teams.

My best player who was our stand off was the QB of his high school football team.

It's interesting that the QB was the best player, I think that guys like Doug Flutie and Tim Tebow would have excelled at RL.  How were his defensive skills?