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Gerrumonside ref

Where do St Helens 2019 rank among all time great U.K. teams?

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I don't think one good year makes them great. This is particularly so when every other club, especially the bigger clubs, were so poor.

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49 minutes ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

Where do you rank them among the all time great U.K. club sides?

The great teams win multiple trophies/championships,maybe better to wait a couple of years before asking your question.

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We’ve had better sides, though there’s scope for the current crop of players to get close to some of our better sides, should they continue in the vein they’re in. Though with a new coach, there’s bound to be some changes likely. 

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30 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

The great teams win multiple trophies/championships,maybe better to wait a couple of years before asking your question.

Indeed. It's hard to imagine the competition being as poor again next year as it was this year. It's very rare for all the big clubs to be so poor in the same season.

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45 minutes ago, Damien said:

Indeed. It's hard to imagine the competition being as poor again next year as it was this year. It's very rare for all the big clubs to be so poor in the same season.

How do you define poor, can they all be poor or did Saints make them look poor? Were you one of the people who dismissed Leicester’s title win because all the big teams were poor that year?

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20 minutes ago, Eddie said:

How do you define poor, can they all be poor or did Saints make them look poor? Were you one of the people who dismissed Leicester’s title win because all the big teams were poor that year?

Nothing to do with what Saints made them look like, they were poor consistently against each other.

No I wasn't.

I can certainly go off my own team who were woeful for much of the season and still finished 2nd, even after losing 5 of their first 6. If that is the next best, on league placings, then it doesn't say much about the other 10 teams over the 27 game season. That allied to watching most Sky games, and the many poor performances of the big clubs, and it is quite clear that they were poor.

Why do you think the big clubs were that great? Are you a Saints fan by any chance?

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41 minutes ago, Damien said:

Nothing to do with what Saints made them look like, they were poor consistently against each other.

No I wasn't.

I can certainly go off my own team who were woeful for much of the season and still finished 2nd, even after losing 5 of their first 6. If that is the next best, on league placings, then it doesn't say much about the other 10 teams over the 27 game season. That allied to watching most Sky games, and the many poor performances of the big clubs, and it is quite clear that they were poor.

Why do you think the big clubs were that great? Are you a Saints fan by any chance?

Interested to know your thoughts on Wigan’s 2018 Grand Final win and the standard of Super League then. 

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30 minutes ago, Oliver Clothesoff said:

Interested to know your thoughts on Wigan’s 2018 Grand Final win and the standard of Super League then. 

In what way? I certainly wouldn't consider the team of 2018 to be remotely close to being amongst the greatest Wigan teams ever, never mind the greatest SL ones. It would probably be between 2018 and 2016 for the weakest of the Grand Final winning teams.

See I can quite easily set aside any club loyalty and be objective like that.

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1 minute ago, Damien said:

In what way? I certainly wouldn't consider the team of 2018 to be remotely close to being amongst the greatest Wigan teams ever, never mind the greatest SL ones. It would probably be between 2018 and 2016 for the weakest of the Grand Final winning teams.

See I can quite easily set aside any club loyalty and be objective like that.

What about the rest of the league in 2018? Were they up to this mythical standard of yours?

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Just now, Oliver Clothesoff said:

What about the rest of the league in 2018? Were they up to this mythical standard of yours?

Your a bit precious aren't you about this, are you a Saints fan by any chance?

You may wish to contribute to the thread rather than being fixated by Wigan. If I'm saying that the Wigan team of 2018 is one of the weaker Grand Final teams then surely that shows that I think the standard of Super League wasn't that great either. I certainly don't think it's just declined in the last year.

I am sorry if this doesn't make Saints the greatest team ever after one season. Happy now?

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13 minutes ago, Damien said:

Your a bit precious aren't you about this, are you a Saints fan by any chance?

You may wish to contribute to the thread rather than being fixated by Wigan. If I'm saying that the Wigan team of 2018 is one of the weaker Grand Final teams then surely that shows that I think the standard of Super League wasn't that great either. I certainly don't think it's just declined in the last year.

I am sorry if this doesn't make Saints the greatest team ever after one season. Happy now?

You’re very aggressive and defensive when challenged. Apologies for daring to ask you to elaborate on your opinion. 

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4 hours ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

Where do you rank them among the all time great U.K. club sides?

29th

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2 hours ago, Damien said:

Nothing to do with what Saints made them look like, they were poor consistently against each other.

No I wasn't.

I can certainly go off my own team who were woeful for much of the season and still finished 2nd, even after losing 5 of their first 6. If that is the next best, on league placings, then it doesn't say much about the other 10 teams over the 27 game season. That allied to watching most Sky games, and the many poor performances of the big clubs, and it is quite clear that they were poor.

Why do you think the big clubs were that great? Are you a Saints fan by any chance?

If Hull were the 3rd best team for most of the season, that said a huge amount about the rest of the teams. We were quite simply shocking for great chunks of the season. To be 3rd with that form told a lot about the rest.

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57 minutes ago, Chris22 said:

Behind our 2000, 2006 and 2008 teams, but still special.

We were fantastic this year but can't be considered amongst the greatest as we didn't win the treble.

I disagree with 2008 (Grand Final win trumps Challenge Cup win) and struggle to remember 2000, but I agree on this year being behind 2006, mainly because we won the Challenge Cup that year too. This year has been much better in terms of entertainment though and that has to count for something. 

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5 hours ago, Saint 1 said:

I disagree with 2008 (Grand Final win trumps Challenge Cup win) and struggle to remember 2000, but I agree on this year being behind 2006, mainly because we won the Challenge Cup that year too. This year has been much better in terms of entertainment though and that has to count for something. 

I see the point. On reflection, it is harsh to say the 2019 team isn't amongst the best because they didn't win the treble yet name the 2008 side in the top bracket.

Saying that, in 2008 we didn't lose from mid April to Grand Final night. Had we won the 2008 Grand Final, I think we would talk about that side in higher terms than 2006.

In terms of entertainment, I agree that 2019 trumps both 2006 and 2008.

As for 2000, that year was unreal. Incredibly entertaining and to beat Wigan and Bradford (who also had fantastic sides) to the title was a special achievement.

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Saints 2006 was the best side in the SL era IMO. Star studded across the park. Nine or 10 of the 17 in Saints GF win played in the 2006 Tri Nations for GB, NZ and Australia. That is how good they were. 

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7 hours ago, Gibbo said:

29th

That's harsh.  I'd go 26th

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13 hours ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

Where do you rank them among the all time great U.K. club sides?

So who's top? One of the Wigan teams from the 80's/90's? Or were there better teams than that way back?

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1 hour ago, 17 stone giant said:

So who's top? One of the Wigan teams from the 80's/90's? Or were there better teams than that way back?

Always difficult to compare teams from different eras.

I saw the top Wigan sides at Central Park and they were very dominant, but was it a level playing field really?

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10 minutes ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

Always difficult to compare teams from different eras.

I saw the top Wigan sides at Central Park and they were very dominant, but was it a level playing field really?

It was as much a level playing field as today. There was nothing stopping other teams doing what Wigan did. Other teams like Leeds arguably spent more.

The Widnes team of the late 80s was very good too.

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Just now, Damien said:

It was as much a level playing field as today. There was nothing stopping other teams doing what Wigan did. Other teams like Leeds arguably spent more.

The Widnes team of the late 80s was very good too.

Haha I knew I was opening a can of worms there.

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