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The Daddy

GB Lions should not have been brought back

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Look it's not to say that under the England banner the results wouldn't have happened. But this whole tour has been created on the back of nostalgia and the misguided notion that GB Lions were iconic. In the grand scheme of things and in this modern age of social media, with the limited resources that the RFL has they needed to stick to the England brand and build recognisable competition brands around it. Instead we got this tour with empty seats, playing in triple headers where it's not even the main game of interest. The whole thing has been an atrocious shambles. 

Edited by The Daddy
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2 minutes ago, The Daddy said:

In the grand scheme of things and in this modern age of social media, with the limited resources that the RFL has they needed to stick to the England brand and build recognisable competition brands around it.

Do you think then that ultimately it comes down to making a choice between GB and England and then playing as whatever you've chosen, in every event?

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1 minute ago, 17 stone giant said:

Do you think then that ultimately it comes down to making a choice between GB and England and then playing as whatever you've chosen, in every event?

Not the only factor, but the main thrust behind bringing back the Lions was that it was iconic and that it meant something in the minds of the general public. Unfortunately the crowds and lack of interest show the reality. Why give yourself an extra ball to juggle when your struggling with the one you've got. 

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7 minutes ago, 17 stone giant said:

Do you think then that ultimately it comes down to making a choice between GB and England and then playing as whatever you've chosen, in every event?

Yes 100%

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6 minutes ago, 17 stone giant said:

Do you think then that ultimately it comes down to making a choice between GB and England and then playing as whatever you've chosen, in every event?

No

England is England

The other home nations should focus on player pathways and being competitive at their level.

Wales has potential and actually have a home grown team.

We have Welsh players in SL that are not converts. 

This tour has damaged their brand IMO

 

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Just now, RP London said:

Yes 100%

GB wont exist it 5 years the way Brexit and nicola sturgeon are going.

We made a choice to be England and should stick with it.

Wales development has been outstanding in the last 10-15 years we should encourage that and not force them to be GB

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5 minutes ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

Has it? They performed pretty poorly in the last WC.

I think the reference is to the whole of Wales RL as a governing body etc.

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Just now, Scubby said:

I think the reference is to the whole of Wales RL as a governing body etc.

Fair enough. However, I think we're light years away from having a competitive Welsh side that isn't reliant on heritage players.

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2 minutes ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

Fair enough. However, I think we're light years away from having a competitive Welsh side that isn't reliant on heritage players.

Isn't that the case for Samoa and Tonga?

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1 minute ago, Scubby said:

Isn't that the case for Samoa and Tonga?

Yeah absolutely. I've got no problem with using heritage players whatsoever. Most other sports do it. We would have a very limited international game without it. But in the same breath, people can't then claim that GB is just England when Lachlan Coote and Joe Philbin have played for Scotland and Ireland.

If the claim is that Wales have made outstanding progress in developing home grown talent over the past 10-15 years, well that's just not correct. There's a handful of players who came via the Celtic Crusaders, and then a smattering of youngsters at different Super League clubs. It's ok, but I certainly wouldn't describe it as outstanding.

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4 minutes ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

If the claim is that Wales have made outstanding progress in developing home grown talent over the past 10-15 years, well that's just not correct. There's a handful of players who came via the Celtic Crusaders, and then a smattering of youngsters at different Super League clubs. It's ok, but I certainly wouldn't describe it as outstanding.

It's probably not 'outstanding', but it's still way better than Scotland or Ireland. At least in Wales there is a viable pathway - with a varied of amateur clubs as well as two semi-pro clubs. It's possible to progress through the ranks to a reasonable standard, albeit not necessarily to the very top level.

There's nothing remotely comparable in Scotland or Ireland unfortunately.

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6 minutes ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

Yeah absolutely. I've got no problem with using heritage players whatsoever. Most other sports do it. We would have a very limited international game without it. But in the same breath, people can't then claim that GB is just England when Lachlan Coote and Joe Philbin have played for Scotland and Ireland.

If the claim is that Wales have made outstanding progress in developing home grown talent over the past 10-15 years, well that's just not correct. There's a handful of players who came via the Celtic Crusaders, and then a smattering of youngsters at different Super League clubs. It's ok, but I certainly wouldn't describe it as outstanding.

The currently work on zero central funding from the RFL. If you look at their youth pathways it is commendable.

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44 minutes ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

Has it? They performed pretty poorly in the last WC.

They did but it was a team of homegrown players.

They have been outstanding to get to this level as a full set up and producing professional players that are not cross code. 

At junior level they are competitive.

The demise of the crusaders dented the initial good work that produced a full squad of professional players. 

With a little bit of additional funding and professional clubs for the promising youth players to play for they can progress to the next level.

At senior international level it's a numbers game. If your a professional player you are in. In England the competition for every position is intense. 

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2 hours ago, yipyee said:

They did but it was a team of homegrown players.

They have been outstanding to get to this level as a full set up and producing professional players that are not cross code. 

At junior level they are competitive.

The demise of the crusaders dented the initial good work that produced a full squad of professional players. 

With a little bit of additional funding and professional clubs for the promising youth players to play for they can progress to the next level.

At senior international level it's a numbers game. If your a professional player you are in. In England the competition for every position is intense. 

The player development work that Wales are doing is very admirable on such a limited budget, and hopefully it will provide dividends down the track. But IMO the national side's development has not been outstanding in the last decade, and that isn't anyone's fault - it's just the reality of where they're at and the extremely limited resources they have available.

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4 hours ago, Scubby said:

The currently work on zero central funding from the RFL. If you look at their youth pathways it is commendable.

That's cos they shouldn't get central funding from the RFL..just like France,Italy,Greece,Serbia,Canada,Jamaica,USA,Fiji......etc.....don't 

Welsh get funding from the IRL,RLEF & SPORTWALES...

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Some really good discussion on the development of players in the home nations, and the commendable work that goes on

in terms of the OP, its apparent some value and like the GB brand and concept and some dont

i very much do, I believe it's the pinnacle for our players and is iconic, historic and recognisable. I understand others don't have the same affiliation as I do, no end of posts will change either view 

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8 minutes ago, Fuzzy said:

Some really good discussion on the development of players in the home nations, and the commendable work that goes on

in terms of the OP, its apparent some value and like the GB brand and concept and some dont

i very much do, I believe it's the pinnacle for our players and is iconic, historic and recognisable. I understand others don't have the same affiliation as I do, no end of posts will change either view 

Well it wasn't too recognisable to the NZ general public or the sports tabloids over here. 

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35 minutes ago, Fuzzy said:

believe it's the pinnacle for our players and is iconic, historic and recognisable. I understand others don't have the same affiliation as I do, no end of posts will change either view 

1. It's not the pinnacle...playing for GB in front of a few thousand people doesn't trump playing upfront of 60,000 at Wembley or losing a world cup final by a ankle tap as England..

2. Iconic and historic ?? GB hasn't won't Owt for 50 effing years!!! What's iconic & historic about that????

3. Recognisable ?? WTF are the GB rugby league lions?? The kiwi touchline reporter couldn't get her mouth around it,struggled to say it everytime...I lost count of the number of times GB got called England...yeah recognisable that..

 

The fact you say no end of posts will change your view....that's the problem,you live in the past,the sport has moved on...want GB ? Go watch masters RL then...

What's the saying? " if you don't learn from history then you are doomed to repeat it" ?

Everything bad everyone said about GB coming back has come true...

There's no appetite for it..

No one will travel to watch it...

It's just England in different shirts...

It'll lose a ton of cash...

But at least the Jersey is nice...

Don't change your view,that's fine...but recognise this...it's attitudes like yours that's ruining this sport.

Edited by roughyedspud
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OLDHAM RLFC

the 8TH most successful team in british RL

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Well it's not that they lost because they were called GB 😅

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I’m glad for the four Tests, which possibly may not have happened otherwise. 

It wasn’t a bad idea per se to have a GB tour but, as ever with the RFL, execution, execution, execution. Woeful. 

The RFL don’t seem to really believe in it and Wayne Bennett certainly doesn’t.

Maybe history will recall it was just a Nigel Wood w**k fantasy that won’t be repeated.

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7 minutes ago, The Daddy said:

No one is claiming that 

Of course.

But here reading this discussion, it seems the main problem of this tour was the name GB.

As an England/GB fan, I'd be more worried about the lack of results. 

Crowds etc, having England there wouldn't have changed anything imho. New Zealand is not a rl heartland, at least not as QLD and NSW. 

In NZ, more people come to see Tonga...

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I do have some sympathy with the current RFL incumbents. This whole idea appeared to be championed by the now ousted Nigel Wood, with Ralph Rimmer having to pick up the pieces and making the best of a bad situation.

The bad results, empty stadiums and contempt shown by Bennett to the Britain brand has all contributed to a disastrous tour which has probably done irreparable damage to "Great Britain".

I wasn't a big fan of bringing Britain back. Not because I'm against it per se, I just think we should have either home nations or Britain and stick with it. Mixing and matching makes little sense.

If we had a proper tour, a three match series against Australia and one off tests against Tonga / PNG etc, a buy-in from Bennett (not dismissing it as a World Cup warm up for England), it may have worked.

I think this experiment may be filed in the ever-expanding rugby league folder of "let's pretend it never happened". 

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But I still think "GB" means something "more" for the players.

That's why this disaster of a tour has humiliated the name GB so much.


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