Farmduck Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 Australia will stay #1 because of the win over NZ. NZ will progress because of the previous year's results - if they are discounted for each year, and the discount is applied on a strict time basis, rather than a calendar year basis. Here's what I mean: Calendar year basis: 2019: NZ beat Tonga, GB x 2, loss to AUS 2018: NZ beat AUS and ENG, lost ENG x3 2017: NZ beat Scotland and Samoa, lost to AUS, TON and FIJ So, in the last 2 years, which will have the heaviest weighting towards points, NZ has 4 wins over Tier 1 teams and a win over #4, Tonga. For simplicity, ENG = GB 2019: loss to NZ x2, PNG, TON 2018: beat NZ x 3 and France, lost 1 to NZ 2017: beat Samoa, Lebanon, France, PNG and Tonga, lost to AUS x 2 England's problem is that the good year - 2018 - will presumably be worth 20% less after 1January. As will 2017 which wouldn't have been worth much anyway since Tonga wasn't very highly-ranked at that time and PNG (IIRC) wasn't even in the Top 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pulga Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 There's talk Australia may not be number 1 anymore. Or at least a tiny margin between them and #2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiltshire Warrior Dragon Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 It's all just rank stupidity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted November 17, 2019 Author Share Posted November 17, 2019 8 hours ago, Pulga said: There's talk Australia may not be number 1 anymore. Or at least a tiny margin between them and #2. I can’t see how it’s possible for anyone but Australia to be number 1, they have only lost 2 games in the last 4 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted November 17, 2019 Share Posted November 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: I can’t see how it’s possible for anyone but Australia to be number 1, they have only lost 2 games in the last 4 years 2 of their last 4 tests but agree, they are still clear no.1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted November 17, 2019 Author Share Posted November 17, 2019 3 minutes ago, Scubby said: 2 of their last 4 tests but agree, they are still clear no.1 Both are true. If Australia lose the series next year, anyone of Australia, Tonga, New Zealand or England could claim top spot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmduck Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 2 hours ago, Celt said: Good to see PNG hanging on in 10th place, having just absolutley leathered Great Britain, containing 100% of the players from 2nd placed England.... I've always thought these rankings treat PNG very harshly. For years, nearly all their games were against AUS, NZ and, in a 4 Nations, ENG. Regardless of how much they improved they still didn't get any wins. If the current team toured Europe I think they'd easily beat Ireland and Scotland and probably Wales and France. Similarly Tonga and Fiji (and maybe Samoa) have too many games against the strongest teams. Obviously the financial reality wouldn't support a PNG Europe tour against the Tier 2 nations but the lack of cross-equator Tier 2 games inflates the positions of the Euro teams, IMO. Clearly at the moment, the rankings have no actual consequences but one day we will have to cut 1 more Pacific team from the WC to make places available for Nth America, South America and Africa. I think it would be farcical to end up dropping the nation with the most grass-roots presence to accommodate a relatively "artificial," heritage-based team. It would be akin to P&R where the bottom SL team is replaced by the top League 1 team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted November 18, 2019 Author Share Posted November 18, 2019 PNG hammered Wales and USA and beat Ireland in the 2017 World Cup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copa Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 NZ are now no.1. http://rlif.com/article/8789/kiwis-take-no--spot-in-latest-international-rugby-league-world-rankings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 9 minutes ago, Copa said: NZ are now no.1. http://rlif.com/article/8789/kiwis-take-no--spot-in-latest-international-rugby-league-world-rankings This is a quote full of spin if ever I saw one: Firstly, I would like to congratulate New Zealand on achieving their number one position. It is fully deserved based upon their recent excellent performances with 4 wins from their last 5 international games. Since start of 2017: Kiwis have played 14 and won 7. (50%) Aussies have played 11 and won 9. (82%) Eng/GB have played 16 games and won 9. (56%) Tonga have played 11 and won 8. (73%) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted November 18, 2019 Author Share Posted November 18, 2019 12 minutes ago, Copa said: NZ are now no.1. http://rlif.com/article/8789/kiwis-take-no--spot-in-latest-international-rugby-league-world-rankings Bizarre, in the last 4 years Australia have lost 2 games, once each to New Zealand and Tonga. New Zealand have lost 6 games to Australia in that time, plus to England 3 times, to Fiji and Tonga, racking up 11 losses between 2016 and 2019. How can New Zealand be ranked higher? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmduck Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 34 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: Bizarre, in the last 4 years Australia have lost 2 games, once each to New Zealand and Tonga. New Zealand have lost 6 games to Australia in that time, plus to England 3 times, to Fiji and Tonga, racking up 11 losses between 2016 and 2019. How can New Zealand be ranked higher? They've never disclosed the exact points for each category - win, margin, difference in ranking of opponent, etc. It's difficult to work out but I think we're seeing the effect of NZ playing more games in the last 2 years. There is a basic points just for playing and NZ played more recent games but it still doesn't account for the difference with NZ now 100% and OZ on 91% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmduck Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 This was the previous ranking, last week: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebags1973 Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 New IRL rankings. Australia number 2, should clearly still be number 1 - they belted NZ 26-4 in their most recent match. Also noticed 3 new teams added, but 6 teams removed which is baffling considering the rankings are based on a 3 year period and the often-dormant Latvia is on the list: http://www.rlif.com/article/8789/kiwis-take-no--spot-in-latest-international-rugby-league-world-rankings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bamfordsbeans Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 I thought there had been some activity in Mexico,Thailand and The Philippines,plus a mention of Japan in the recent RLW .Not sure which other counties have any participation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmduck Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 1 minute ago, bamfordsbeans said: I thought there had been some activity in Mexico,Thailand and The Philippines,plus a mention of Japan in the recent RLW .Not sure which other counties have any participation. I only put the top 18 up there. Those countries are included in the listings. Countries below the top 20 would get very few points for beating each other so it's very difficult to move up the list. If you get 20 points for beating OZ or NZ you would only get 2 points for beating Thailand or Niue. (just using hypothetical numbers) I don't understand this % system. Fiji only went up 1% after beating PNG who were 10th so eating a team outside the top 20 wouldn't help your ranking much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 Australia have lost 2 of their last 3 tests. I don't know the criteria but maybe they just don't play enough? They have played only 4 matches since the 2017 World Cup Final (50% win rate). NZ have played 8 tests in that time (4 wins, 4 losses 50%), England/GB 9 tests (4 wins, 5 losses 44%), Tonga 5 tests (3 wins, 2 losses 60%). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copa Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 It’s great that this, and the golden boot, doesn’t all revolve around Australia and the NRL. If Australia wants to get involved in the international game they are more than welcome to get involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted November 18, 2019 Author Share Posted November 18, 2019 47 minutes ago, Scubby said: Australia have lost 2 of their last 3 tests. I don't know the criteria but maybe they just don't play enough? They have played only 4 matches since the 2017 World Cup Final (50% win rate). NZ have played 8 tests in that time (4 wins, 4 losses 50%), England/GB 9 tests (4 wins, 5 losses 44%), Tonga 5 tests (3 wins, 2 losses 60%). Yet Tonga are still a long way behind England? I don’t see how any methodically can put NZ above Australia and also put England above Tonga as is the case with the new rankings. The numbers have been plucked out of thin air. If results from the last 3/4 years are taken into account Australia should be top, if it’s only recent results Tonga should be higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted November 18, 2019 Author Share Posted November 18, 2019 It is however incredible to see that none of Australia, New Zealand or England have won over 50% of their games since the 2017 World Cup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 27 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: Yet Tonga are still a long way behind England? I don’t see how any methodically can put NZ above Australia and also put England above Tonga as is the case with the new rankings. The numbers have been plucked out of thin air. If results from the last 3/4 years are taken into account Australia should be top, if it’s only recent results Tonga should be higher. Why would results 3/4 years ago be part of current World Rankings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebags1973 Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 Further adding to the farce... Australia WON the Oceania Cup, not New Zealand - albeit on points difference. So New Zealand didn’t even win the trophy on offer (v Australia) in 2019 yet they are number 1 ??? Of the two Australia v New Zealand contests in 2018/2019, Australia’s margin of victory is hugely superior: 2018: New Zealand 26-24. 2019: Australia 26-4. And New Zealand are number 1 ??? And if we’re counting results over 3 years as part of the rankings criteria, they didn’t even make the 2017 RLWC semi finals!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidM Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 I always take rankings with a pinch of salt . Rugby , cricket , football ... hopefully the boffins who put them together can decipher them as I don’t think anyone else can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted November 18, 2019 Author Share Posted November 18, 2019 54 minutes ago, Scubby said: Why would results 3/4 years ago be part of current World Rankings? In that case how are England 3rd? We just played 4 and lost 4 games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: In that case how are England 3rd? We just played 4 and lost 4 games Maybe GB was not counted after all? IDK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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