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Super League expecting to field investment offers in February

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52 minutes ago, cookey said:

Essentially,supporters dont trust those who run SL or the individual Club owners to do what is best for rugby league. Money from SKY Sports was completely wasted,numerous promises from both Castleford and Wakefield about ground development,club owners wanting their loans back etc,etc.

There has to be absolute transparency,or in 5 yrs time we will find that SL is say,25%/year worse off and magically,all the money has disappeared.

What are the fees for negotiating this 'deal',how many solicitors will be involved,what slice will the Chief Exec and other Directors claim they are due?

I'll have to challenge your assertion that money from Sky was "completley wasted". Compared to what? On what measure?

It was quite conceivable that British rugby league - a sport that before Sky had just 1 fully pro team - could have shrivelled up and died in the 90s, in the face of pro union, the soccer boom and other broadcasting and economic changes. 

Instead it took some radical decisions and is still going - with a fully pro top tier - 25 years later. 

Many mistakes along the way, of course, and the future is uncertain. But we've really got to get away that there was some sort of miracle possible if we'd done something different. The miracle is that we're still going at all. 

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14 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

They dont need to. The RFL can only hold the special rights preference share (and nobody else can hold it)and there can be up to 49 ordinary shares. 

The ordinary shares can only be owned by entities operating a RL Club which is participating in the SL Competition, no entity is entitled to hold more than one share, so my speculation was hypothetical as new articles would have to be voted in by the club's and green lighted (accepted / authorised) by the RFL, all of which would need to happen for this PE stake to be an option. 

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21 minutes ago, Toby Chopra said:

I'll have to challenge your assertion that money from Sky was "completley wasted". Compared to what? On what measure?

It was quite conceivable that British rugby league - a sport that before Sky had just 1 fully pro team - could have shrivelled up and died in the 90s, in the face of pro union, the soccer boom and other broadcasting and economic changes. 

Instead it took some radical decisions and is still going - with a fully pro top tier - 25 years later. 

Many mistakes along the way, of course, and the future is uncertain. But we've really got to get away that there was some sort of miracle possible if we'd done something different. The miracle is that we're still going at all. 

The money was spent on the same players and coaches who were playing the game before the Sky money became available.Not a single penny was spent on ground improvements,which is why we still have hovells at Castleford,Wakefield and Bradford.

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27 minutes ago, Smudger06 said:

The ordinary shares can only be owned by entities operating a RL Club which is participating in the SL Competition, no entity is entitled to hold more than one share, so my speculation was hypothetical as new articles would have to be voted in by the club's and green lighted (accepted / authorised) by the RFL, all of which would need to happen for this PE stake to be an option. 

And as I said, the speculative solution would be unnecessary

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7 hours ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

If the money was used to buy equipment, renovate or build clubhouses and pitches then there would be more permanent infrastructure in place for the grassroots. It would gives clubs more of a presence in their communities and thus more exposure. You can't shrink the permanent infrastructure of the grassroots unless clubs sell off their assets which is their own business and would be incredibly stupid. The grassroots would shrink if participation numbers dropped again which is less likely to happen if the clubs had a bigger presence as I say. 

Broadening the appeal of the game is the bit in the quote which I found very vague. I'd like some more info there because there doesn't seem to be an obvious quick fix to that problem and that certainly comes into increasing the participation at grassroots level. 

I do agree that reducing clubs revenues is daft and there would have to be a very clear and confident business plan in place to take the risk I think. If there was some way that almost certain proof could be presented that investing in the grassroots and wider appeal of the game could get more people through the turnstiles then it might be worth the plunge cos I think that is the ultimate goal here. If this is all about getting more people involved and thus creating new fans that will go to games then that will plug the hole that will be left by the lost revenue but it is a very big risk. 

On the subject of broadening the appeal of the game, what kind of thing do people think could be done?

the clubs have already had tens of millions over the years with very little to show for it.  Rent a ground or ones made of sicks after twenty odd years of Sky money.  What makes any of you think facilities  would be improved?  makes my sides split.

There is absolutely no chance of developing the game,  do you really think RU and their media chums would let RL grow?  Open your eyes, the elite control everything in this country.

 

 

Edited by lingard
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I demand to have some booze, I want it here and I want it now!

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19 hours ago, Man of Kent said:

Rothschild has been appointed broker. Structure changes afoot for 2022. 

From the sister paper. It doesn’t take a huge leap for this to get much bigger. And a TV deal to match. https://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/domestic-club-rugby-union/33328/a-british-league-will-happen-in-two-years/


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3 minutes ago, The 4 of Us said:

From the sister paper. It doesn’t take a huge leap for this to get much bigger. And a TV deal to match. https://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/domestic-club-rugby-union/33328/a-british-league-will-happen-in-two-years/

Will a British League be that much bigger than the current English one though? The Welsh and Scottish clubs don’t get very impressive crowds, most of them are just constructs anyway, rather than clubs, and are hard to support in the traditional sense. 

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33 minutes ago, cookey said:

The money was spent on the same players and coaches who were playing the game before the Sky money became available.Not a single penny was spent on ground improvements,which is why we still have hovells at Castleford,Wakefield and Bradford.

But we went from 2 to 14 full time teams , same players yes , but fully Pro 

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14 minutes ago, Smudger06 said:

Legal terminology in a Companies Articles of Association? 

Really? 

Highlights the depth of your knowledge.

In this instance, yes. 

What do you think ranked pari passu means in this context?

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3 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

In this instance, yes. 

What do you think ranked pari passu means in this context?

I'm still waiting for you to explain how each club owns 1/12th of SLE Ltd when 13 Shares of £1 value are in issue. 

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6 minutes ago, Smudger06 said:

I'm still waiting for you to explain how each club owns 1/12th of SLE Ltd when 13 Shares of £1 value are in issue. 

Because there are 12 ordinary shares and 1 special rights share. These shares are not the same. 

I'm really not sure what you think the relevance of the nominal value is or why you keep mentioning it. 

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34 minutes ago, Eddie said:

Will a British League be that much bigger than the current English one though? The Welsh and Scottish clubs don’t get very impressive crowds, most of them are just constructs anyway, rather than clubs, and are hard to support in the traditional sense. 

I would say so yes. Cross British Isles interest. A lot of what has held back crowds in with some  Pro14 teams, not dissimilar to SL, is likely to be the fixture list. Throw in a Leeds, Leicester, Wigan or a Bath in there and I think you’ve got a “product” some TV companies may wish to do something like the Premier League with. A couple of conferences and a good second tier and you have something to work with. Probably pie in the Sky stuff but the CVC-Rothschild combo are used to making something into something more! https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.ft.com/content/2b38840e-051b-11e8-9650-9c0ad2d7c5b5

 


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38 minutes ago, The 4 of Us said:

I would say so yes. Cross British Isles interest. A lot of what has held back crowds in with some  Pro14 teams, not dissimilar to SL, is likely to be the fixture list. Throw in a Leeds, Leicester, Wigan or a Bath in there and I think you’ve got a “product” some TV companies may wish to do something like the Premier League with. A couple of conferences and a good second tier and you have something to work with. Probably pie in the Sky stuff but the CVC-Rothschild combo are used to making something into something more! https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.ft.com/content/2b38840e-051b-11e8-9650-9c0ad2d7c5b5

 

I thought you meant merging the two main British Union leagues, not SL as well. I can’t see that happening personally, hope not anyway. 

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1 hour ago, The 4 of Us said:

From the sister paper. It doesn’t take a huge leap for this to get much bigger. And a TV deal to match. https://www.therugbypaper.co.uk/domestic-club-rugby-union/33328/a-british-league-will-happen-in-two-years/

There may well be a British union club comp but if the codes merged the Six Nations dies. And so it won’t happen.

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1 minute ago, Man of Kent said:

There may well be a British union club comp but if the codes merged the Six Nations dies. And so it won’t happen.

Cracking idea grommit , I'd be well up for that , SL to merge with the Union lot , yes get on with it straight away 😂

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5 hours ago, lingard said:

the clubs have already had tens of millions over the years with very little to show for it.  Rent a ground or ones made of sicks after twenty odd years of Sky money.  What makes any of you think facilities  would be improved?  makes my sides split.

There is absolutely no chance of developing the game,  do you really think RU and their media chums would let RL grow?  Open your eyes, the elite control everything in this country.

As has already been stated, there is a full time league.

What do you think would have been the fate of rugby league in Britain without it? You can look over the channel at Elite 1 and see for yourself.


"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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If there is a large investment, it is because there is the potential for growth.

There are a few ways that could be:

- Bringing back the old days. P&R and more small town clubs based in small mining towns.

- Launching the sport into international areas where there is a niche for top class sport

Which is more likely?


"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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On 29/12/2019 at 21:53, Mark S said:

Looks like SL and therefore the clubs have been proactive in finding investment. Let’s hope the RFL don’t balls it up.

This is equity release stuff. Bad move.

If you own metaphorical land or property, don't sell unless your life depends upon it or you can get more than it is conceivably worth to a fool. And then buy more back.

 

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On 30/12/2019 at 23:02, Bob8 said:

If there is a large investment, it is because there is the potential for growth.

There are a few ways that could be:

- Bringing back the old days. P&R and more small town clubs based in small mining towns.

- Launching the sport into international areas where there is a niche for top class sport

Which is more likely?

To be fair, they are extremely loaded examples Bob. 

Nobody is calling for more small town clubs. 

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10 minutes ago, Dave T said:

To be fair, they are extremely loaded examples Bob. 

Nobody is calling for more small town clubs. 

It is a little absurd, I accept that.

But, I would propose (again, I have no proof) that investment is beccause they see some possibility of growth. They are unlikely to be interested in the amateur game, the existing market is not growing. It might be there is no interest and no growth, but if there were, it would be interesting to see where they think it is possible.

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"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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19 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

It is a little absurd, I accept that.

But, I would propose (again, I have no proof) that investment is beccause they see some possibility of growth. They are unlikely to be interested in the amateur game, the existing market is not growing. It might be there is no interest and no growth, but if there were, it would be interesting to see where they think it is possible.

I agree that they obviously see growth. And tbh it is hard not to look at RL and not see growth. I think from 1996 we made a lot of improvements with the investment that came, I know it is fashionable to say we did nowt but the professionalism and facilities are far far better now than 25 years ago, and crowds much better at top level. I think those improvements were largely getting the basics right and becoming stronger businesses. We don't lose tens of millions plus each year like some sports (or clubs), because we can't afford to. 

Now though, minor tweaks won't deliver major growth, which is what they would surely be looking for. A positive I see from investment like this is that some of the demands that come with it may see us have to be more bold. 

I wouldn't be surprised to see a closed SL, with investment in expansion teams across the UK, including London. It would be interesting to see whether they believed in the N.A expansion claims. 

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