Dunbar Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 On Friday of last week, my wife told her employees that the small business she has worked tirelessly over the last 3 years to build up will have to close due to the financial difficulties imposed by a once in a century pandemic. It was commercially successful up till March Businesses and organisations of all sizes are struggling and Toronto is just one. It is disappointing but I sincerely hope that they return in 2021. "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toby Chopra Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 hour ago, Hela Wigmen said: We don’t really have a plan for anything beyond what’s at the end of our noses, as has been proven with expansion in the shape of PSG, Celtic Crusaders and dare I say, London too, and with the incessant structure changes every three years. There is no "we" or "the sport" though. For largely historic reasons, the RFL is a much weaker governing body than pretty much any other sport, and doesn't have the institutional heft or finance to make really big picture decisions. In reality it's just a members club of 34 privately owned English rugby league businesses who (quite reasonably) only make decisions in their own interests. And on top of that they're usually pretty divided amongst themselves on what those best interests are, so the 'members club' itself is always on the brink of breaking up. In those circumstances, I think the prospects of really transformational change is probably beyond the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith989 Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 I'd worry how many fans will turn to the Arrows with their support now. I'd be hopefull that they will return in 2021 however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReaper Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, clogdance said: A team cannot just decide to 'not finish a season'. Hopefully Toronto will be punished accordingly. Sure they can. They just did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nadera78 Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 Rugby League as a sport - fans, owners, administrators, the lot - gets what it deserves. There was an opportunity here, an owner who's spent £10m, a growing fanbase and a very attractive market, for us to exploit. But no, the SL clubs would rather pocket an easy £200,000 and watch the opportunity sail on by. Anything else would have required some hard work and RL always takes the easy way out. You wanted a parochial sport, fine, that's what you've got. The future in England is abundantly clear; a second rate domestic competition, ignored by the rest of the country, played in front of crowds of old men hankering after yesterday's glory, that produces players for the NRL and union. "Just as we had been Cathars, we were treizistes, men apart." Jean Roque, Calendrier-revue du Racing-Club Albigeois, 1958-1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, Click said: I have some sympathy, but as someone else said - They told the RFL/SL or whoever as recently as last week that they would be completing the season. If they knew the problems were this bad it isn't a new development, and they shouldn't have sprung it on the rest of SL with only weeks to go till the season restarts. As I said earlier we don't know what has happened between then and now. I think the fact that they have ploughed on paying 50% wages for 4 months shows that they were acting in good faith. It would have been much more prudent to make this move in March. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gingerjon Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 34 minutes ago, Phil said: That’s it for me, Rugby League can f*** right off. A small game run by small minds, in small towns, watched by fans with smaller minds whose vision doesn’t extend beyond the shopping centre built on the decommissioned pit head. Yup. Our small world is getting smaller, the communities we reach within that small world getting older and not being replaced. The entire future of the game here really now rests on next year’s World Cup. Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toby Chopra Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 10 minutes ago, Scubby said: This is all very sad, but legally can you force an overseas team to complete the season in the UK? They are not members of SLE and do not receive any TV income. If the Warriors all decided to go home to NZ is there anything legally the NRL can do etc? How is it different? Of course not. But equally the SL and/or RFL have no legal requirement to invite them back next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smudger06 Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 11 minutes ago, Scubby said: This is all very sad, but legally can you force an overseas team to complete the season in the UK? They are not members of SLE and do not receive any TV income. If the Warriors all decided to go home to NZ is there anything legally the NRL can do etc? How is it different? They are members of SLE. Not members of the RFL though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianRugger Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 7 minutes ago, nadera78 said: Rugby League as a sport - fans, owners, administrators, the lot - gets what it deserves. There was an opportunity here, an owner who's spent £10m, a growing fanbase and a very attractive market, for us to exploit. But no, the SL clubs would rather pocket an easy £200,000 and watch the opportunity sail on by. Anything else would have required some hard work and RL always takes the easy way out. You wanted a parochial sport, fine, that's what you've got. The future in England is abundantly clear; a second rate domestic competition, ignored by the rest of the country, played in front of crowds of old men hankering after yesterday's glory, that produces players for the NRL and union. I always thought Rugby League was different from Union. This just proves to me it's same different pile in the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrispmartha Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, nadera78 said: Rugby League as a sport - fans, owners, administrators, the lot - gets what it deserves. There was an opportunity here, an owner who's spent £10m, a growing fanbase and a very attractive market, for us to exploit. But no, the SL clubs would rather pocket an easy £200,000 and watch the opportunity sail on by. Anything else would have required some hard work and RL always takes the easy way out. You wanted a parochial sport, fine, that's what you've got. The future in England is abundantly clear; a second rate domestic competition, ignored by the rest of the country, played in front of crowds of old men hankering after yesterday's glory, that produces players for the NRL and union. I would suggest £200,000 is not ‘easy’ for any club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nadera78 Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said: I would suggest £200,000 is not ‘easy’ for any club It's TWPs share of the TV revenue that they each pocketed. And they took it very easily indeed. "Just as we had been Cathars, we were treizistes, men apart." Jean Roque, Calendrier-revue du Racing-Club Albigeois, 1958-1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 39 minutes ago, Man of Kent said: They may well say that but if they are demoted to League 1/Championship would they bother? And if they want to be in Super League - as Bob Hunter presumes - why d**k the RFL/SL around? It’s not them who’ve dicked the RFL and SL around. Don’t forget even when they won the Championship GF last year SL hadn’t decided if they were allowed in or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 minute ago, Chrispmartha said: I would suggest £200,000 is not ‘easy’ for any club It's not money that they budgeted for though. It was new money that would have gone to any other club on promotion, other than Toronto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 11 minutes ago, clogdance said: A team cannot just decide to 'not finish a season'. Hopefully Toronto will be punished accordingly. They can decide that and have done, quite reasonably imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrispmartha Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, nadera78 said: It's TWPs share of the TV revenue that they each pocketed. And they took it very easily indeed. Wasn’t that to cover the cost of travel and expenses? as it happens i think it was short sighted of the clubs to not share the TV money however that doesn’t alter my point about them messing the RFL/SL about with regards to the restart. it also didn’t seem to bother Toronto when they were dishing out the cash to players did it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasginger Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 Forget all your small talk about who or why they're not fulfilling the fixtures. What plans have S/L put in place since Celtic Crusaders sad demise. Answers on back of a stamp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 I’ve just emailed TWP to say how disappointed I am not to see them play again this season and that I hope they’ll be back next season. If they have to fold the RFL and SL should be utterly ashamed of themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrispmartha Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 minute ago, Eddie said: They can decide that and have done, quite reasonably imho. It would have been reasonable a month or even two weeks ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 Let’s face it there’s some on here and in the game who still dispute London’s right to exist, what chance a “foreign” club? "Freedom without socialism is privilege and injustice, socialism without freedom is slavery and brutality" - Mikhail Bakunin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meast Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 Well, that ended well! For a club that many on here fawned over and labelled as the saviours of the sport etc it's all a bit shambolic and embarrassing Bought their way through semi professional league and then didn't have a clue what to do when it came to playing in the big boys' playground Another fine example of "expansion" working. Huddersfield Giants Supporters Association Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeytherRob Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 6 minutes ago, nadera78 said: Rugby League as a sport - fans, owners, administrators, the lot - gets what it deserves. There was an opportunity here, an owner who's spent £10m, a growing fanbase and a very attractive market, for us to exploit. But no, the SL clubs would rather pocket an easy £200,000 and watch the opportunity sail on by. Anything else would have required some hard work and RL always takes the easy way out. You wanted a parochial sport, fine, that's what you've got. The future in England is abundantly clear; a second rate domestic competition, ignored by the rest of the country, played in front of crowds of old men hankering after yesterday's glory, that produces players for the NRL and union. What difference would 200k have made considering the biggest issue was the visas? TW have already said they're underwriting the salaries and ticket refunds, this seems to be about more than just money. As for the last paragraph, wow...put your toys back in the pram, just because people point out the flaws doesn't necessarily mean they take any pleasure in these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smudger06 Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 Either Argyle doesn't have anywhere near the kind of money he was made out to have or he is as tight as a camels a£$e in a sandstorm. He's embarrassed himself and massively let down both his own players and the TWP fanbase. Pretty shameful and / or daft taking on such a project either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrispmartha Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 minute ago, Phil said: Let’s face it there’s some on here and in the game who still dispute London’s right to exist, what chance a “foreign” club? I would love both a successful London and Toronto side in SL - doesn’t give them a free pass from criticism though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommygilf Posted July 20, 2020 Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 minute ago, meast said: Well, that ended well! For a club that many on here fawned over and labelled as the saviours of the sport etc it's all a bit shambolic and embarrassing Bought their way through semi professional league and then didn't have a clue what to do when it came to playing in the big boys' playground Another fine example of "expansion" working. You are joking right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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