Harry Stottle Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 14 minutes ago, Kayakman said: Awaiting the formal announcement Me too, albeit I expect for different reasons. I will say again, my reasons have nothing whatsoever to do with Toronto or any other club across the pond, I just don't think clubs from 3K+ miles away doing nothing to expand the sport in places in respect of participants is a good fit for our sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 3 minutes ago, silverback said: New players.? Rightyho. I said medium term, it’s quite obvious that there would be more people playing if TWP carry on going versus if they don’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 minute ago, Harry Stottle said: Me too, albeit I expect for different reasons. I will say again, my reasons have nothing whatsoever to do with Toronto or any other club across the pond, I just don't think clubs from 3K+ miles away doing nothing to expand the sport in places in respect of participants is a good fit for our sport. They always said it would be top down though, they’ve only been going for 3 years you can’t expect them to have set up loads of new teams in that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 Just now, Eddie said: I said medium term, it’s quite obvious that there would be more people playing if TWP carry on going versus if they don’t. There is nothing obvious at all Eddie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 4 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said: So the same stuff we’ve been told before. Fair enough, I suppose. I will give the podcast a listen at the weekend. I think (and not trying to be cantankerous here), that the game (and by that I mean the heartlands super league clubs who run it in the N Hemisphere) needs to decide are they happy being a minority sport in a small part of the country rabbiting on about being TGG, or do they want the game taken to other places and to grow. If it’s the former then fine, but they’ll only have themselves to blame as the tv deal gets smaller each time and they end up being semi pro playing in front of much smaller crowds, still going on about being TGG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 minute ago, Eddie said: They always said it would be top down though, they’ve only been going for 3 years you can’t expect them to have set up loads of new teams in that time. With the best will in the world, it will take 3 generations from nothing to bear fruit in any numbers, can we wait that long? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 2 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said: There is nothing obvious at all Eddie. I’d say it is. Toronto have always said that they’d get the team going first, to show people what it’s about, and then try to get people playing - ie a top down model. To me that makes more sense than trying to get people playing a game with zero exposure and then setting a pro team up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommygilf Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 minute ago, Harry Stottle said: With the best will in the world, it will take 3 generations from nothing to bear fruit in any numbers, can we wait that long? Yes. Next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverback Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 3 minutes ago, Eddie said: I said medium term, it’s quite obvious that there would be more people playing if TWP carry on going versus if they don’t. Well there was less players at leigh and salford when they started up,And those who were left in the lurch wage wise seem to have got gigs elsewere too,I doubt they really attract players again with a big wage if there to stay in SL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 minute ago, Harry Stottle said: With the best will in the world, it will take 3 generations from nothing to bear fruit in any numbers, can we wait that long? If the alternative is to wait three generations and then have nothing bearing fruit, then yes. Though I’d argue that it wouldn’t take three generations, why would it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 minute ago, Tommygilf said: Yes. Next. Touche, Tommy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLANTISMAN Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 We have to be prepared for a massive drop in the next contract (My estimate and I hope I am wrong) is a 40% drop minimum. Mentioned on here yesterday I had a coffee earlier on this week with a county cricket club CEO and his opinion (They are lucky as I think the current deal runs until 2024) that they will see around 40% of what they get now from SKY. Secondary income streams will become more and more important also fans have to be prepared to pay more to watch matches RL is cheap really cheap. P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverback Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 10 minutes ago, Eddie said: If the alternative is to wait three generations and then have nothing bearing fruit, then yes. Though I’d argue that it wouldn’t take three generations, why would it. Well it has, And you have no fruit only massive bills for someone to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 2 minutes ago, Eddie said: If the alternative is to wait three generations and then have nothing bearing fruit, then yes. Though I’d argue that it wouldn’t take three generations, why would it. Just think about the infrastructure in the amatuer games in this country, how many kids play the game, how many different leagues and fixtures they take part and progress through, the centre's of excellence the best kids perculate up to compete against each other, then the best of the best advance to academies only for 90+% of those to get jettisoned, the conversation rate of kids first picking up a ball to SL status is 100's to 1, all the time our end product is not brilliant in numbers of quality player's. So please share your argument of how you will fast track from nothing the process we employ over here to produce SL quality players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hela Wigmen Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 I’ve never got the “well...they don’t have an Academy and don’t produce any players” argument. I don’t even think it’s an argument, it’s stating the obvious. A team from Canada isn’t likely to have an Academy based in a country that has very little Rugby League in it, so they’re not going to have an Academy within five years of starting or be producing Canadian players. Yes, I know Eric Perez and David Argyle made some outlandish claims about Canadians and getting rugby league balls into kids hands but even if they managed that, they’re not going to be playing Super League level inside five years and both of those are no longer involved with Toronto (thankfully in the case of Argyle) so you can’t use their claims to beat Toronto with now. If Toronto come back in, they won’t be judged off their Academy, or lack of, and nor should they be under the structure we have now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommygilf Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 27 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said: Touche, Tommy! I don't understand why you keep banging your head against this particular wall Harry. Its a sideshow from your 3000miles away will never work and is far more brittle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayakman Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 57 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said: Me too, albeit I expect for different reasons. I will say again, my reasons have nothing whatsoever to do with Toronto or any other club across the pond, I just don't think clubs from 3K+ miles away doing nothing to expand the sport in places in respect of participants is a good fit for our sport. On this we must beg to differ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLANTISMAN Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 4 minutes ago, Kayakman said: On this we must beg to differ..... From what I am hearing if Toronto are let back in they will play all there home matches in the UK/France until Canada opens up again maybe the entire season here or at least until things are safe maybe mid summer. Ottawa same . Makes total sense. P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kayakman Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 5 minutes ago, ATLANTISMAN said: From what I am hearing if Toronto are let back in they will play all there home matches in the UK/France until Canada opens up again maybe the entire season here or at least until things are safe maybe mid summer. Ottawa same . Makes total sense. P We will have to play this one by ear...no one knows what will happen although it appears we have a much greater grip on things than in the UK.....if marketed properly there could be a mass following develop of viewers over here...if any games are even allowed in the UK!....have to adopt a wait/see attitude. It will all work itself out in the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 minute ago, ATLANTISMAN said: From what I am hearing if Toronto are let back in they will play all there home matches in the UK/France until Canada opens up again maybe the entire season here or at least until things are safe maybe mid summer. Ottawa same . Makes total sense. P It may make sense but there is no guarantee when matches in Canada may be possible again. This year has shown that its hardly viable or sustainable doing this and even mid summer is a long time to have no income. Mid summer could easily become all season again too. I have every sympathy with the predicament faced by Toronto this season and the loss of all income, and am probably as big a supporter of TWP than anyone, but even I have major reservations of preceding next year in the manner that failed this year. Again I stress that I don't blame TWP for the consequences of Covid-19 but if they, and Ottawa, are admitted in this fashion then there would have to be a financial guarantees and deposit to ensure they had the funds for the full season. I also see little benefit to Toronto proceeding in such a manner and spending a fortune if they cant play in Toronto and their fans cant watch them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hela Wigmen Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 hour ago, Harry Stottle said: Me too, albeit I expect for different reasons. I will say again, my reasons have nothing whatsoever to do with Toronto or any other club across the pond, I just don't think clubs from 3K+ miles away doing nothing to expand the sport in places in respect of participants is a good fit for our sport. How quickly do you want participants to take up the game in a brand new area? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 hour ago, Harry Stottle said: Just think about the infrastructure in the amatuer games in this country, how many kids play the game, how many different leagues and fixtures they take part and progress through, the centre's of excellence the best kids perculate up to compete against each other, then the best of the best advance to academies only for 90+% of those to get jettisoned, the conversation rate of kids first picking up a ball to SL status is 100's to 1, all the time our end product is not brilliant in numbers of quality player's. So please share your argument of how you will fast track from nothing the process we employ over here to produce SL quality players. Re your last paragraph I haven’t said anything of the sort. I said people playing, be it men, kids, women, LD, wheelchair, tag etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxford Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 1 hour ago, ATLANTISMAN said: We have to be prepared for a massive drop in the next contract (My estimate and I hope I am wrong) is a 40% drop minimum. Mentioned on here yesterday I had a coffee earlier on this week with a county cricket club CEO and his opinion (They are lucky as I think the current deal runs until 2024) that they will see around 40% of what they get now from SKY. Secondary income streams will become more and more important also fans have to be prepared to pay more to watch matches RL is cheap really cheap. P RL is cheap because of its fanbase largely having a marginal amount of disposable income. A lot of the secondary income depends on that same disposable income. A drop like the one you suggest will probablt lead to franchising and the death of P&R, and in all likelihood less teams in SL. Having said that the incoming depression may produce much the same results anyway. 2 warning points Non-Political Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 19 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said: How quickly do you want participants to take up the game in a brand new area? The sooner the better Hela, there is always day 1 just to formulate a plan never mind begin with one. Please be totally honest, how would you see it if say just 3 teams TWP, Ottawa and NY were to progress to SL, how would they furnish their playing rosters, and would incumbant SL teams gladly reduce tge quality of their teams? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 14 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said: The sooner the better Hela, there is always day 1 just to formulate a plan never mind begin with one. Please be totally honest, how would you see it if say just 3 teams TWP, Ottawa and NY were to progress to SL, how would they furnish their playing rosters, and would incumbant SL teams gladly reduce tge quality of their teams? Not gladly but it would happen, just like it does in football when clubs sell their best players to the wealthier teams, and like it has always happened in RL just substitute Leeds, Wigan and Saints for Twp Ottawa and NY. I have the utmost respect for you Harry, but I just can’t understand why you’re so against TWP. Each to their own though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.