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54 minutes ago, Omott91 said:

A few hours ago in Western Australia they eased the first restrictions, allowing a number of people up to 10 to gather again.  

From what I can gather they've had hardly any restrictions already, I’m quite shocked Australias figures are so low to be honest!

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47 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

From what I can gather they've had hardly any restrictions already, I’m quite shocked Australias figures are so low to be honest!

In one sense it isn't surprising really as Australia is a big empty island thousands of miles from anyone and so in that sense they have an easier time of it when compared to more densely inhabited and travelled areas of the world, like Europe.  However, they escaped the early waves of the Spanish Flu and then were hit with the third wave (I think) in 1919.  So just because they are having a relatively easy time of it at the moment doesn't mean they will escape untouched.  I hope they do, for the sake of their people, but it is a bit early to say they've got away with it (not that you were saying that!).  

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3 hours ago, JohnM said:

Quite so. I do, though, believe most people do know the rules. The rules are clear. It's the media that is raising peoples expectations of an easing of lockdown thus creating uncertainty. 

I've watched Sky Sophy Ridge and BBC Breakfast this morning totally misrepresent the situation, as did Rachel Burden on BBC. The lockdown in France, Spain, Italy is more severe and more rigorously enforced than here, so any easing there starts from a stricter regime. In Spain, for example, kids under 14 have been confined to their homes. 

We are at a critical point in this outbreak and any easing could be disastrous and it is the duty of the media to reflect this. Yes. ask challenging questions but at the same time realise your responsibilities to the truth. 

I think the media as a whole has been dire throughout this experience so far.  No explanation of the fact - an actual fact - that other countries in Europe were hit earlier than us and so obviously their lockdowns are going to be lifted sooner than ours.

Apparently now we weren't quick enough to lock down.  Yet apparently also everyone wants to leave lockdown.  So which was it?  We were too late or we have been locked down too long?  Imagine trying to get everyone to stay indoors even longer than we have done already.  And the media would have been contrary and irresponsible at both ends too, as they have been anyway.

And of course we were a police state only a couple of weeks ago because PC Plod was trying to enforce the lock down.  Then they were basically told not to bother and now people are doing as they please.

Must be a nightmare governing this country.  

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14 minutes ago, Saintslass said:

 

Apparently now we weren't quick enough to lock down.  Yet apparently also everyone wants to leave lockdown.  So which was it?  We were too late or we have been locked down too long?   

They are two independent things. 

And who wants to leave? Like genuinely, you should provide evidence of that claim. 

Wanting to know what the options for how to exit lockdown is not the same as thinking lockdown should end now. Not in the slightest. 

Obviously the idiots like Alison Pearson and Katie Hopkins are pushing for end to restrictions, but that isn't everybody. 

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1 minute ago, Dave T said:

They are two independent things. 

And who wants to leave? Like genuinely, you should provide evidence of that claim. 

Wanting to know what the options for how to exit lockdown is not the same as thinking lockdown should end now. Not in the slightest. 

Obviously the idiots like Alison Pearson and Katie Hopkins are pushing for end to restrictions, but that isn't everybody. 

To be fair to Saintslass, the media are reporting that there mass of people wanting to ease the restrictions. You cannot blame people for accepting much of what they read.

"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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2 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

To be fair to Saintslass, the media are reporting that there mass of people wanting to ease the restrictions. You cannot blame people for accepting much of what they read.

I'm not accepting anything the media is saying so stop projecting.  I was simply repeating what the media has been saying.  They have been irresponsible (and often blatantly stupid) from early on.

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7 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

To be fair to Saintslass, the media are reporting that there mass of people wanting to ease the restrictions. You cannot blame people for accepting much of what they read.

Where is that Bob? 

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8 minutes ago, Dave T said:

They are two independent things. 

And who wants to leave? Like genuinely, you should provide evidence of that claim. 

Wanting to know what the options for how to exit lockdown is not the same as thinking lockdown should end now. Not in the slightest. 

Obviously the idiots like Alison Pearson and Katie Hopkins are pushing for end to restrictions, but that isn't everybody. 

You see the word 'apparently'?  It refers to the media.  I wasn't claiming anyone wants to leave.  I was claiming 'apparently' everyone wants to leave, because that is what the stupid media is now saying.

You are being deliberately obtuse to create an argument where it does not exist.

Oh, and how is your last sentence NOT political by the way?

Where is gingerjon?

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1 minute ago, Saintslass said:

You see the word 'apparently'?  It refers to the media.  I wasn't claiming anyone wants to leave.  I was claiming 'apparently' everyone wants to leave, because that is what the stupid media is now saying.

You are being deliberately obtuse to create an argument where it does not exist.

Oh, and how is your last sentence NOT political by the way?

Where is gingerjon?

Because it's not, it's not even remotely political.

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4 minutes ago, Saintslass said:

Where is gingerjon?

Hastings. It's lovely. I'm in the garden.

Why do you ask?

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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3 minutes ago, Saintslass said:

You see the word 'apparently'?  It refers to the media.  I wasn't claiming anyone wants to leave.  I was claiming 'apparently' everyone wants to leave, because that is what the stupid media is now saying.

You are being deliberately obtuse to create an argument where it does not exist.

Oh, and how is your last sentence NOT political by the way?

Where is gingerjon?

Alison Pearson and Katie Hopkins are journos. Where is the politics in that? 

And I am not being obtuse, the media are not making these claims. One paper today leads with this - The Sunday Times has a headline about Tory Grandees wanting an end to lockdown. Can you provide evidence of the media telling us that everyone wants an end to lockdown? That's what you claimed, you should be able to support that claim. And I'm not saying you are definitely wrong, I just haven't witnessed it. 

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Just now, Dave T said:

That 'evidence' is nothing of the sort. 

It is not direct evidence, or even true. But, people do trust the press as long as it is on their side.

"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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6 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

The Telegraph, as you mentioned.

Sorry to do this but I'm going to be a bit pedantic. But the claim was that the media are stating that everyone wants an end to lockdown. No evidence has been presented. 

Allison Pearson tweeting about two friends being furious about lockdown does not equate to the claim above. 

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1 minute ago, Bob8 said:

It is not direct evidence, or even true. But, people do trust the press as long as it is on their side.

Tbh, I don't think SLs claim is true, but by asking for the evidence I am happy to be educated on this. 

What I see happening is the media asking about the end of lockdown and how that will work. That is very different to stating that everyone wants lockdown to end. But that is how it is being spun to discredit any awkward questions. 

 

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4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Sorry to do this but I'm going to be a bit pedantic. But the claim was that the media are stating that everyone wants an end to lockdown. No evidence has been presented. 

Allison Pearson tweeting about two friends being furious about lockdown does not equate to the claim above. 

...and you do have me. I confess to a memory of the Telegraph giving the impression that the people were crying out under the yoke. But, I am not certain and have no links to hand.

PS: I also agree it is not true, but I was sympathetic as it was reported in the Telegraph and most people believe what they read in newspapers that they identify with, regardless of their own experience (such is my impression).

"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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I've said before but the media over the last couple of weeks, with regards lockdown, does not reflect public opinion. There seems to be other agendas at play.  I know barely anyone that wants the lockdown to end and any poll I have seen supports that view too.

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1 minute ago, Damien said:

I've said before but the media over the last couple of weeks with regards lockdown does not reflect public opinion. There seems to be other agendas at play.  I know barely anyone that wants the lockdown to end and any poll I have seen supports that view too.

Indeed, I do remember some polling on this:

https://www7.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2020/04/24/yougov-finds-little-evidence-of-people-wanting-to-ease-the-lockdown/

 

"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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2 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

From what I can gather they've had hardly any restrictions already, I’m quite shocked Australias figures are so low to be honest!

No, the rest of the country is still in lockdown. Our version of this is minimum gathering of 2 people at a time, state borders are closed, only leave the house for exercise and essential outings like groceries etc, most businesses and all hospitality venues closed.

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3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Tbh, I don't think SLs claim is true, but by asking for the evidence I am happy to be educated on this. 

What I see happening is the media asking about the end of lockdown and how that will work. That is very different to stating that everyone wants lockdown to end. But that is how it is being spun to discredit any awkward questions. 

 

What I see happening is the media asking about the end of lockdown and how that will work.

Yes, they are indeed asking that, time after time, despite being told time after time that it is too early to be able to say, as any easing of lockdown has to be based on a whole range of factors, trends  etc.  Things have come to something when the WHO say on TV that the UK is doing a great job but our media are hunting high and low to find bad news stories.

All reporters such as Kuenssberg are after is a statement that can be used later to trip up the govt. ( Not ALL as bad as her - never thought I'd see the day when I'd say Victoria Derbyshire was shining example of neutrality and independence) The evidence is there for all to see. The whole media tone is one of destructive negativity: a minister announces an intention, an objective, a target and the  media then present it as a promise or a commitment. Grant Shapps stated on TV for all to hear that  "all Brits on cruise ships had now been repatriated" As he was saying this, the BBC ticker said " Govt says all British holidaymakers have been repatriated". Not the same thing at all. Next up, we'll see a reporter saying, "Minister,  yesterday you promised....."  The tone of BBC News is to paint the situation badly: eg PPE. To judge by their reporters, no one has any PPE.  I spoke yesterday to the husband of a senior District Nurse in Lincolnshire, someone who does not share my politics who said that they have to change their PPE after each visit, "full" PPE" and there is absolutely no shortage.  

But that is how it is being spun to discredit any awkward questions

Well, yes, they do ask some searching questions: "Minister, will you apologise to the front line, nurses, doctors, NHS, anybody, everybody yada yada yada..for something or other...."  then follow up on the news or in print "Minister refuses to apologise...."  This is just wasting a valuable time. They would be much better off asking "why was our lockdown not as severe and not as rigorously enforced as those in France, Italy, Spain...."  or "What can we learn from the new lockdown in a Chinse city of 10 million people  to prevent the spread of coronavirus following a surge in cases." 

I've asked around my mates around the country, and not all of them by far share my political views. However, apart from one guy , all of them are fed up with the media's constant denigration of the UKs performance.

We do need an adult conversation about all this,. Pity there are not that many adults in the media. 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Bob8 said:

It is not direct evidence, or even true. But, people do trust the press as long as it is on their side.

This is it in a nutshell and we see plenty of evidence of it on here. The constant criticism of the media by a few on here is tiresome. This is especially so when they simultaneously seek out, trust and quote from the media that supports their viewpoint, all without a hint of hypocrisy.

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