Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 Shaun Wane’s comments are totally unacceptable IMO. How on earth he’s been given the England job with this attitude I will never know. People can be English despite been born elsewhere. An example, the young prop at Leeds Mikolaj Oledski who has lived in Leeds for 13 years, the majority of his life. He’s represented England Academy and England Knights with distinction. Wane, England’s head coach has sent out this UKIP style message that he’s not really English and not wanted in the National Team. Disgraceful. Wane told Betfred’s The Last Tackle Podcast: “If he can prove to me he’s English and wants to play for England and gets in touch, then I’ll have a look at it. “But I’m all for out-and-out Englishmen, I’m very patriotic and very proud. I’m happy with the squad I’ve got at the minute. “We’ve got some great talent in this country and imagine how proud we’d all be to win something major like the World Cup and have done it with all purely English-born players. That would be my dream.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Plow Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 What a strange comment to make. Guess he won’t be picking Tom Johnstone either then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 1 hour ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: Shaun Wane’s comments are totally unacceptable IMO. How on earth he’s been given the England job with this attitude I will never know. People can be English despite been born elsewhere. An example, the young prop at Leeds Mikolaj Oledski who has lived in Leeds for 13 years, the majority of his life. He’s represented England Academy and England Knights with distinction. Wane, England’s head coach has sent out this UKIP style message that he’s not really English and not wanted in the National Team. Disgraceful. Wane told Betfred’s The Last Tackle Podcast: “If he can prove to me he’s English and wants to play for England and gets in touch, then I’ll have a look at it. “But I’m all for out-and-out Englishmen, I’m very patriotic and very proud. I’m happy with the squad I’ve got at the minute. “We’ve got some great talent in this country and imagine how proud we’d all be to win something major like the World Cup and have done it with all purely English-born players. That would be my dream.” I haven't heard this podcast. Can I ask, was Wane speaking about Oledski when he said this? "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number 16 Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 I've not yet listened to the podcast but will, though I'm interested in that quote in the OP. I understand it was said about Victor Radley and not Mikolaj Oledski, and referred to a player born in Australia, living in Australia and playing in Australia. Wane was, rightly, questioning such a players loyalty to England. Or did Wane refer specifically to Mikolaj Oledski? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whippet13 Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 According to the Mirror it was regarding Victor Radley: https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/england-coach-shaun-wane-outlines-22202225 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number 16 Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 18 minutes ago, Mr Plow said: Guess he won’t be picking Tom Johnstone either then I guess he will seeing as how Johnstone was born in Germany, but can someone please tell Wane that Germany isn't now like it was in the 1930s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number 16 Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 1 minute ago, Whippet13 said: According to the Mirror it was regarding Victor Radley: https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/england-coach-shaun-wane-outlines-22202225 ... And the Super Soaraway Sun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man of Kent Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 Sir Kev has conflated Oledski being born in Gdansk and Wane saying he’d like to win the World Cup with born Englishmen to suggest the former won’t be picked. This is the downside of patriotism, unfortunately. Parochialism. On the whole, however, good for Shaun Wane. Radley is a very good player but he’s also a d*ckhead Aussie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted June 17, 2020 Author Share Posted June 17, 2020 The discussion was about Victor Radley but Wane’s comment is clearly aimed at all players, not one individual. Oledski was one player I pointed out who wasn’t born in England but has represented England at different levels. “imagine how proud we’d all be to win something major like the World Cup and have done it with all purely English-born players. That would be my dream.” Shaun Wane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hela Wigmen Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 In terms of Victor Radley, Wane doesn’t have anything to worry about. Radley is in sensational form and ordinarily would have played an Origin game or two by this point in a calendar year, with Australia honours to come next year at the World Cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hela Wigmen Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: The discussion was about Victor Radley but Wane’s comment is clearly aimed at all players, not one individual. Oledski was one player I pointed out who wasn’t born in England but has represented England at different levels. “imagine how proud we’d all be to win something major like the World Cup and have done it with all purely English-born players. That would be my dream.” Shaun Wane Sounds like the “moral victory” bilge he’d spout as Wigan coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: The discussion was about Victor Radley but Wane’s comment is clearly aimed at all players, not one individual. Oledski was one player I pointed out who wasn’t born in England but has represented England at different levels. “imagine how proud we’d all be to win something major like the World Cup and have done it with all purely English-born players. That would be my dream.” Shaun Wane I agree it is poor from Wane. I would like to give him the benefit of the doubt and hope he is referring to those players with Engilsh heritage who are born and raised overseas (like Radley) rather than someone like Oledski who is clearly very proud to represent England but he doesn't make it easy for himself and the 'purely English born' part is not necessary. "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 1 hour ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: Shaun Wane’s comments are totally unacceptable IMO. How on earth he’s been given the England job with this attitude I will never know. People can be English despite been born elsewhere. An example, the young prop at Leeds Mikolaj Oledski who has lived in Leeds for 13 years, the majority of his life. He’s represented England Academy and England Knights with distinction. Wane, England’s head coach has sent out this UKIP style message that he’s not really English and not wanted in the National Team. Disgraceful. Wane told Betfred’s The Last Tackle Podcast: “If he can prove to me he’s English and wants to play for England and gets in touch, then I’ll have a look at it. “But I’m all for out-and-out Englishmen, I’m very patriotic and very proud. I’m happy with the squad I’ve got at the minute. “We’ve got some great talent in this country and imagine how proud we’d all be to win something major like the World Cup and have done it with all purely English-born players. That would be my dream.” We completely differ in our opinions M'lud, Whilst you were very happy last season when 3 Australian Nationals whom had never stepped foot in the 'Homeland' prior to coming here to earn their living in fact one had done a season and a half about 18 months and the other two a single season so less than a calander year could get selected I thought was totally and utterly disgraceful, you may want to hit me back with "those are the rules" to which I will concede that it was played by, by those rules you accept it, I don't and the man that matters certainly doesn't. I don't see how these 'Foriegners' can summon up the same affinity, pride and nationalistic passion that Mr Wane will demand, he will get between the earholes of his charges and instill who, why and what they are playing for, player's who have spent their whole lives in another country can't possibly feel that, and when they have to dig that bit deeper the seam is barren. However, in the case of Oledski I would differ, let me make a comparrison with my second sport namely Cricket, it abhors me how easily players from other shores get selcted for our national team, this 'residency' ruling that is allowed is in my opinion far far to short, I would make it at least 10 years (in all sports) and would only breech that timescale and allow it to be shorter if a player has spent his formative years and learned his sport here, has is the case with Ben Stokes and I see nothing different in the case of Mikolaj he should in my opinion qualify, England to all intense and purpose is his home and his affinity. Your last sentance qouting Mr Wane's 'dream' is something I can readily identify with, I attend a lot of International RL games and even sat in the stand when the player's walk out and line up and sing the National anthem I am part of that team, even moreso when I am in another country, I feel the qualities that Mr Wane feels being "I am very patriotic and very proud", only 8 months ago I went to NZ for the GB tour and in the first game looking across the line I felt deflated looking at the three Australians stood there in GB jumper's that is how I perceive Mr Wane feels and I absolutely "get it". If and I stated on these pages when I returned from the trip if Mr Bennett (another for obvious reasons I disagreed with) had been retained and he carried on with his Australian selection, it would have been very hard for me to attend future Internationals with those policies in place, thank heavens for Mr Wane, I would sooner be a gallant loser and select as Mr Wane says out-and-out Englishmen, but you obviously disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 7 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: The discussion was about Victor Radley but Wane’s comment is clearly aimed at all players, not one individual. Oledski was one player I pointed out who wasn’t born in England but has represented England at different levels. “imagine how proud we’d all be to win something major like the World Cup and have done it with all purely English-born players. That would be my dream.” Shaun Wane I will point out though... deliberately or not, the way your first post was written gave the strong impression that Wane was referring to Oledski when he made the comment. "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 7 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said: Sounds like the “moral victory” bilge he’d spout as Wigan coach. Meow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said: Whilst you were very happy last season when 3 Australian Nationals whom had never stepped foot in the 'Homeland' prior to coming here to earn their living in fact one had done a season and a half about 18 months and the other two a single season so less than a calander year could get selected I thought was totally and utterly disgraceful, you may want to hit me back with "those are the rules" to which I will concede that it was played by, by those rules you accept it, I don't and the man that matters certainly doesn't. I don't see how these 'Foriegners' can summon up the same affinity, pride and nationalistic passion that Mr Wane will demand, he will get between the earholes of his charges and instill who, why and what they are playing for, player's who have spent their whole lives in another country can't possibly feel that, and when they have to dig that bit deeper the seam is barren. Do you see Oledski (who came to England as a 9 year old) as a different case Harry? Do you see him as being a patriotic Englishman in the national team? "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnM Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 8 minutes ago, Dunbar said: I will point out though... deliberately or not, the way your first post was written gave the strong impression that Wane was referring to Oledski when he made the comment. Of course it was deliberate, to the point of trolling. The bigoted op is no lover of Wane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, Dunbar said: I agree it is poor from Wane. I would like to give him the benefit of the doubt and hope he is referring to those players with Engilsh heritage who are born and raised overseas (like Radley) rather than someone like Oledski who is clearly very proud to represent England but he doesn't make it easy for himself and the 'purely English born' part is not necessary. We discussed this at great length prior to the GB tour last season, I recall you saying that you did not percieve that the 3 Aussies that were selected could have the same passion as Mr Wane describes as out-and-out Englishmen (or GB as was the case) I wholeheartedly agree with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 7 minutes ago, Dunbar said: Do you see Oledski (who came to England as a 9 year old) as a different case Harry? Do you see him as being a patriotic Englishman in the national team? Yes, I gave the example of Ben Stokes and I think it would be no different, if you watch Cricket you will readily know what I mean. Did you not read the whole post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 2 minutes ago, JohnM said: Of course it was deliberate, to the point of trolling. Oledski is a Leeds player afterall! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted June 17, 2020 Author Share Posted June 17, 2020 The comment from Wane was clearly aimed at all players, despite been in a discussion about Radley. Oledski is one example of the players Wane disgracefully doesn’t want his ideal winning team. The quote is clear as day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said: We discussed this at great length prior to the GB tour last season, I recall you saying that you did not percieve that the 3 Aussies that were selected could have the same passion as Mr Wane describes as out-and-out Englishmen (or GB as was the case) I wholeheartedly agree with him. 2 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said: Yes, I gave the example of Ben Stokes and I think it would be no different, if you watch Cricket you will readily know what I mean. We agree about the Australian nationals coming and playing a season in the UK and then representing England. Or even more the players who are in Australia representing England on heritage qualification. But I don't agree on Oledski. Coming here as a 9 year old I am happy that he represents England as the country he has known most of his life and one that has provided opportunities for himself and his family. "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted June 17, 2020 Author Share Posted June 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, Dunbar said: We agree about the Australian nationals coming and playing a season in the UK and then representing England. Or even more the players who are in Australia representing England on heritage qualification. But I don't agree on Oledski. Coming here as a 9 year old I am happy that he represents England as the country he has known most of his life and one that has provided opportunities for himself and his family. What about Oledski’s kids? Should they be allowed to represent Poland or only England? Everyone has a different opinion, that’s why we have international selection rules and we should stick to them instead of making offensive little britain comments like our National Head Coach has done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, Dunbar said: We agree about the Australian nationals coming and playing a season in the UK and then representing England. Or even more the players who are in Australia representing England on heritage qualification. But I don't agree on Oledski. Coming here as a 9 year old I am happy that he represents England as the country he has known most of his life and one that has provided opportunities for himself and his family. Are you missqouting me Dunny? I have said I would readily accept Oledski, for much the sane reasons as you state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 1 minute ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said: What about Oledski’s kids? Should they be allowed to represent Poland or only England? Yes. In my opinion, they should be allowed to represent Poland . "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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