Championship clubs still in deadlock

[Harry Stottle]

9 hours ago, Hela Wigmen said:

I’d love the game, Super League, Championship and League One, to have an administrator(s) with a bit of backbone and enough power to listen to all arguments across all levels and make a decision. What we have now is everyone, understandably voting with self-interest. 

Off course it is, I would say your Chairman could be very much accused of doing exactly that and understandably so, he has poured a lot of time and money into the Saints just the same as some of the Championship Chairmen/Owners have done, all they are requesting is for an opportunity to see if their investment can reap it's rewards, whilst other clubs having done their maths consider it financially impractical to begin again without paying customers.

If you were appointed to be the administrator what would you do?

[Hela Wigmen]

24 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Off course it is, I would say your Chairman could be very much accused of doing exactly that and understandably so, he has poured a lot of time and money into the Saints just the same as some of the Championship Chairmen/Owners have done, all they are requesting is for an opportunity to see if their investment can reap it's rewards, whilst other clubs having done their maths consider it financially impractical to begin again without paying customers.

If you were appointed to be the administrator what would you do?

I don’t have all the facts and figures, so I’m not sure tbh. 

I don’t feel comfortable with a short-form Championship with promotion and a side relegated from Super League after going through 22 games in 14 weeks. 

[gingerjon]

2 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

I don’t have all the facts and figures, so I’m not sure tbh. 

I don’t feel comfortable with a short-form Championship with promotion and a side relegated from Super League after going through 22 games in 14 weeks. 

Cricket is proposing a merged 'Championship' this year where the counties will not play in their normal divisions but will instead play in geographical groups and then have a title decider. Simply put, this is because there isn't the time now to have a normal season and, without crowds, none of the outgrounds the clubs use are feasible. I *believe* that the idea is that a title will be awarded but that it may not (typical fudge) count as a full county champion.

My own view is that something along those lines should be proposed for clubs in the Championship and League 1 who wish to play and can afford to play. I don't see how a full season is possible and don't see the benefits of forcing clubs who will be bankrupted by playing behind closed doors/reduced crowds into playing. Nor do I see why the game should be bounced into offering promotion to clubs who won't have played a full competitive season. A genuine competition with a title and prize money seems the best solution.

 

[tms]

As a FEV fan  I would wait until the government allow crowds back and play out the full season in the championship to give the clubs  some much needed money without promotion  but  at the end of 2021 season once we'are back to normal   I would relegate 2 SL and promote 2  championship to make up for missing out this year

[Les Tonks Sidestep]

11 hours ago, sweaty craiq said:

Pub teams with no ambition, dependent on TV money and getting things done on the cheap bt amateur volunteers. All of which is fantastic until pitted against ambition.

Cast the Luddites adrift into a world they understand and find a home for the ones who want to grow and have a fan base to support it

Do those 'pub teams' include the one that nearly went out of business because its owner threw his teddy and had a massive sulk when things didn't go his way?

[whatmichaelsays]

10 hours ago, Robthegasman said:

The fact is that the vast majority of clubs in both the Championship and Championship 1 divisions simply cannot afford to resume the season due to the costs that they have to face. And with no gate money.

 And any sensible chairman in this position would not risk his club financially in order to play again.

Now whilst the language used by a poster here is very brutal,it does show the inequality of rugby league outside of Super League.

But how do you deal with that?Do you say kick them out immediately if they cannot afford to play?

Do you withdraw their central funding?

Have we arrived at the watershed moment a year early because of this situation?

Where do we therefore go from here?

Another point that was raised on Radio Leeds by (I think) the Batley coach was the issue of player availability. 

Most clubs below Super League rely on part-time players and a concern was raised that, as employers look to ensure that they are "COVID-secure" or "COVID-compliant" (whatever the term is), it was possibile that employers could revoke permission for their staff to take on second-jobs in order to protect their work force. 

So you could have situation where play is allowed to restart, but a small number of local employers refuse to allow second-jobs, meaning that the players are prevented from playing. 

I'd question how likely that scenario is, but it certainly does present itself as a risk. 

[Griff]

So - just to be clear - the plan is that the unambitious, pub side clubs have to incur huge costs so that the ambitious, spendthrift clubs have a chance of getting to $uperleague by playing half a season.

Is that right ?

[Harry Stottle]

21 minutes ago, Griff said:

So - just to be clear - the plan is that the unambitious, pub side clubs have to incur huge costs so that the ambitious, spendthrift clubs have a chance of getting to $uperleague by playing half a season.

Is that right ?

No, let those who want to play do so and keep the goal of promotion intact, and those clubs who claim it to be financial suicide let them sit it out without penalties.

[Griff]

18 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

No, let those who want to play do so and keep the goal of promotion intact, and those clubs who claim it to be financial suicide let them sit it out without penalties.

Ah right.  So, promotion's to be decided on the back of a six team comp.

At least one of which is in Division 3.  If Newcastle win it, they'll be in $uperleague next year, will they ?

It's not much of a plan once you strip it down, is it ?

[gingerjon]

15 minutes ago, Griff said:

Ah right.  So, promotion's to be decided on the back of a six team comp.

At least one of which is in Division 3.  If Newcastle win it, they'll be in $uperleague next year, will they ?

It's not much of a plan once you strip it down, is it ?

It's a joke of a plan and one that hopefully can be rejected without too much further discussion.

[gingerjon]

32 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

Its interesting to see that the Leigh fans who positioned themselves as protectors of the game, guardians of the grass roots and the final bastions of the Corinthian spirit have, when push comes to shove, basically said Fsk every other lower league club

You have the terminology wrong.

"Whole game solution" is what it is. It's entirely coincidental that every whole game solution presented centres Leigh and what Leigh want.

[paulwalker71]

1 hour ago, Griff said:

So - just to be clear - the plan is that the unambitious, pub side clubs have to incur huge costs so that the ambitious, spendthrift clubs have a chance of getting to $uperleague by playing half a season.

Is that right ?

Exactly that

 

[Robthegasman]

1 hour ago, whatmichaelsays said:

Another point that was raised on Radio Leeds by (I think) the Batley coach was the issue of player availability. 

Most clubs below Super League rely on part-time players and a concern was raised that, as employers look to ensure that they are "COVID-secure" or "COVID-compliant" (whatever the term is), it was possibile that employers could revoke permission for their staff to take on second-jobs in order to protect their work force. 

So you could have situation where play is allowed to restart, but a small number of local employers refuse to allow second-jobs, meaning that the players are prevented from playing. 

I'd question how likely that scenario is, but it certainly does present itself as a risk. 

I think that is a very good and very valid point.And I think it is something that needs to be considered.

[John Rhino]

12 hours ago, Robthegasman said:

An absolute farce and joke.

 And then clubs wonder why the game is on its ass when they cannot make a decision.

 

This could be a life or death decision. Certainly a very long and painful recovery, if at all, for some people. 

Putting your life at risk for a sport is not a joke or a farce. 

[Blind side johnny]

2 hours ago, Hela Wigmen said:

I don’t have all the facts and figures, so I’m not sure tbh. 

I don’t feel comfortable with a short-form Championship with promotion and a side relegated from Super League after going through 22 games in 14 weeks. 

Yes I agree.

Many posters on here are choosing to ignore the elephant in the room: SL don't want any P&R at the end of the season and have said that quite plainly. This creates a difficulty because, if I understand things correctly, the RFL can only insist upon promotion to SL if they can demonstrate that the canididate club has qualified on the basis of a properly meaningful competition. This would not include a six-club league nor one that embraces kicking out those who are unwilling to make massive losses simply to satisfy a couple of wealthy owners. SL can insist upon no relegation from their numbers and I don't believe that the RFL can prevent this.

You can come up with all the schemes that you like guys, hair-brained, brutal or ignorant, but you won't get your own way unless SL agree to it and at the moment they don't.

[Harry Stottle]

46 minutes ago, Griff said:

Ah right.  So, promotion's to be decided on the back of a six team comp.

At least one of which is in Division 3.  If Newcastle win it, they'll be in $uperleague next year, will they ?

It's not much of a plan once you strip it down, is it ?

No possibly a 5 team comp, Newcastle could not play in the Championship and it is stupid to even suggest so which makes your post quite ridiculous.

But not wishing to be unkind to any other team, if the season had not been interrupted it would still have effectively been a 5 horse race, unless you can tell me of any club outside of the top 5 who would be challenging for promotion.

[Harry Stottle]

4 minutes ago, Blind side johnny said:

the RFL can only insist upon promotion to SL if they can demonstrate that the canididate club has qualified on the basis of a properly meaningful competition.

Link please Johnny, I have honestly never ever seen reference to that statement.

[Robthegasman]

28 minutes ago, John Rhino said:

This could be a life or death decision. Certainly a very long and painful recovery, if at all, for some people. 

Putting your life at risk for a sport is not a joke or a farce. 

An individual’s life is not a joke and farce and quite honestly I resent the fact that you appear to think that I think an individual person’s life is a joke and farce.

I think that the fact that a decision has not been made as to whether to resume the Championship and Championship 1 season,when I might add a firm decision was taken to abandon Wimbledon,the Euro Championships and the biggest of all the Olympic Games in Tokyo,is a joke and farce.

[Robthegasman]

6 minutes ago, SL17 said:

You can’t call it a farce until you know what was placed on the table. 

Again how come others that are bigger such as Wimbledon,UEFA with the Euros and Olympic Games committee have had the balls and guts to make a call and decide to postpone?

[Magic XIII]

17 minutes ago, Robthegasman said:

Again how come others that are bigger such as Wimbledon,UEFA with the Euros and Olympic Games committee have had the balls and guts to make a call and decide to postpone?

Because the other events you identify are global events with mass international travel, huge TV deals, logistics, etc .... we are talking about a sport played in a small part of Northern England with no TV deal and a small walk up audience. I guess one of the benefits of being a minority sport is you can sit on these decisions a lot longer.

[dkw]

SL17 and Sweaty embarrassing themselves as usual, all in the name of their desperation to see their club promoted, and sod the rest of the clubs. As usual they just ignore that it was their own club gasping for air a few years ago, asking other clubs fans to help them out with bucket collections etc. 2 disgusting self-serving individuals, perfectly suited to the owner of their club.

How can anyone want to force clubs to play games that would almost certainly destroy them, and theirs no way there should be some sort of ridiculous truncated competition to lead to promotion or relegation. If the teams want to play then by all means organise a competition for them, they can even have a lovely shiny trophy at the end of it if they want but it should have absolutely no bearing on the 2020 season.

[Ackroman]

10 hours ago, sweaty craiq said:

The problem most of the lower tiers have is they have no fans, poor facilities, no sponsors and await the fuse blowing on the life support. Thats why there is no interest in tv coverage, especially if the “potentials” are removed. Widnes Bradford and Leigh have shown they can pull a gate, Newcastle and Fev are up for it and we must expand the sport. The solution is obvious to anyone who understands how to grow a business

Widnes, Bradford and Leigh also know how to spend money they dont have in the pursuit of glory, so I would take what they may think is the right option with a large pinch of salt.

The best thing by far is to accept the pandemic has scuppered just about everyones plans except those with the deepest pockets and set up to fight another day rather than try and make a silk purse from a sows ear.

[sweaty craiq]

1 hour ago, dkw said:

SL17 and Sweaty embarrassing themselves as usual, all in the name of their desperation to see their club promoted, and sod the rest of the clubs. As usual they just ignore that it was their own club gasping for air a few years ago, asking other clubs fans to help them out with bucket collections etc. 2 disgusting self-serving individuals, perfectly suited to the owner of their club.

How can anyone want to force clubs to play games that would almost certainly destroy them, and theirs no way there should be some sort of ridiculous truncated competition to lead to promotion or relegation. If the teams want to play then by all means organise a competition for them, they can even have a lovely shiny trophy at the end of it if they want but it should have absolutely no bearing on the 2020 season.

Sellafield must have taken a huge toll on your brain cell over the years, but not unexpected from a clueless alleged fan of the game. Tell me again when the begging bowls came out? Leigh last entered a cva in 2003 ish, we tend to sort our finances out when the hits the fan pretty well these days.

RL is dragged back by pub teams, fine but remove those with ambition and let the pub teams enjoy their level

 

[Robthegasman]

24 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

Sellafield must have taken a huge toll on your brain cell over the years, but not unexpected from a clueless alleged fan of the game. Tell me again when the begging bowls came out? Leigh last entered a cva in 2003 ish, we tend to sort our finances out when the hits the fan pretty well these days.

RL is dragged back by pub teams, fine but remove those with ambition and let the pub teams enjoy their level

 

So let me ask you the question.

What would you do with these”Pub teams”who are dragging RL back?
Who are these”Pub teams”?

 

 

[dkw]

35 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

Sellafield must have taken a huge toll on your brain cell over the years, but not unexpected from a clueless alleged fan of the game. Tell me again when the begging bowls came out? Leigh last entered a cva in 2003 ish, we tend to sort our finances out when the hits the fan pretty well these days.

RL is dragged back by pub teams, fine but remove those with ambition and let the pub teams enjoy their level

 

You are a disgusting ingrate, begging clubs to help then wanting them to get stuffed just because you have a sugar daddy pumping money in. I would never want a fan of any RL clubs to have to go through the pain of seeing their club potentially disappearing, but you and your ilk couldnt care less for the rest of the game, just your own club. None of your concerns about this have the good of the game at mind, you just want to see your club promoted and you see it slipping away after good old degsy piled a load more cash in. There`s 25 clubs that this impacts on, there`s 3 maybe 4 that can survive without their usual match day income and you are fortunate that your club is one of them, and that`s all down to one man but you couldnt care less if those other "Pub teams" go under.