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Irish RL Grand Final live-streaming now!


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I am grateful they streamed it and caught most of the first half.  But it was pretty poor production quality and difficult to watch.  The camera was on the 10 metre line so was was difficult when play was down the other end.

Viewing figures were steadily between 120-150 for the entire first half while I was watching, which is great!  I am certain it would have been at least double had the quality been better, or if at the very least, the camera had been situated on the halfway line.  Oh well, live and learn.

Longhorns won 24-10 by the way.  I think Ronan Michael may have been playing for them too!

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Not the best camera location, but they did bother to include on-screen graphics for score and time.

Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
Ralph Waldo Emerson

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4 hours ago, langpark said:

A few match highlights here, plus some of the players honing their Gaelic skills!  Does anyone here speak it?  How did they do?  Some seem fluent, others not so much.

None of them are native speakers but the first two were pretty good, particularly the second guy (first guys accent wasn't great).

Third guy tried his best but was fairly basic and Ronan Michael at the end, well, here's a direct translation:

"A lot of person are playing football and playing rugby union, so eh, this boys are wonderful".

Fair play to him for trying though!

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6 hours ago, damp squib said:

None of them are native speakers but the first two were pretty good, particularly the second guy (first guys accent wasn't great).

Third guy tried his best but was fairly basic and Ronan Michael at the end, well, here's a direct translation:

"A lot of person are playing football and playing rugby union, so eh, this boys are wonderful".

Fair play to him for trying though!

Conas a ta tu, Damp Squib,  do you speak Gaelic fluently?

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7 hours ago, damp squib said:

None of them are native speakers but the first two were pretty good, particularly the second guy (first guys accent wasn't great).

Third guy tried his best but was fairly basic and Ronan Michael at the end, well, here's a direct translation:

"A lot of person are playing football and playing rugby union, so eh, this boys are wonderful".

Fair play to him for trying though!

Isn`t the language called "Irish" rather than "Gaelic"? Asking on behalf of my ancestors from Co. Roscommon.

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10 hours ago, damp squib said:

None of them are native speakers but the first two were pretty good, particularly the second guy (first guys accent wasn't great).

Third guy tried his best but was fairly basic and Ronan Michael at the end, well, here's a direct translation:

"A lot of person are playing football and playing rugby union, so eh, this boys are wonderful".

Fair play to him for trying though!

Thanks for that, I find it fascinating! 

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On 08/09/2020 at 05:39, kiwis 13 6 said:

Conas a ta tu, Damp Squib,  do you speak Gaelic fluently?

Táim go maith Kiwi, agus tú féin? I'm fluent but not a native speaker. I grew up near the Gaeltacht though.

On 08/09/2020 at 06:49, unapologetic pedant said:

Isn`t the language called "Irish" rather than "Gaelic"? Asking on behalf of my ancestors from Co. Roscommon.

That's a complicated one with a long answer! Technically Gaelic is a family of languages or dialects that includes the various Gaelic languages/dialects of Ireland, Scotland and the Isle of Man.

A lot of Irish people have, to me, an illogical dislike of people calling the language Gaelic instead of Irish. There are historical/political reasons why this is a valid view but in my experience for most of the people who take issue with calling the language Gaelic don't consider these and their objections are just pedantry or a force of habit, Still though, almost everyone in Ireland calls it Irish so you're best to go with that.

18 hours ago, OriginalMrC said:

Can be called either. Where I grew up in Ireland everyone called it Gaelic. 

Where's that Mr C? I've genuinely never heard another Irish person call it Gaelic instead of Irish in everyday speech.

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7 minutes ago, damp squib said:

Táim go maith Kiwi, agus tú féin? I'm fluent but not a native speaker. I grew up near the Gaeltacht though.

That's a complicated one with a long answer! Technically Gaelic is a family of languages or dialects that includes the various Gaelic languages/dialects of Ireland, Scotland and the Isle of Man.

A lot of Irish people have, to me, an illogical dislike of people calling the language Gaelic instead of Irish. There are historical/political reasons why this is a valid view but in my experience for most of the people who take issue with calling the language Gaelic don't consider these and their objections are just pedantry or a force of habit, Still though, almost everyone in Ireland calls it Irish so you're best to go with that.

Where's that Mr C? I've genuinely never heard another Irish person call it Gaelic instead of Irish in everyday speech.

I see a lot (relatively) of people use “Gaelige” on Twitter. Obviously that’s written and often being used to make the language use clear. When I did my Celtic Studies a lifetime ago, the language was referred to as Irish by the native speakers I came across.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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1 hour ago, damp squib said:

Táim go maith Kiwi, agus tú féin? I'm fluent but not a native speaker. I grew up near the Gaeltacht though.

That's a complicated one with a long answer! Technically Gaelic is a family of languages or dialects that includes the various Gaelic languages/dialects of Ireland, Scotland and the Isle of Man.

A lot of Irish people have, to me, an illogical dislike of people calling the language Gaelic instead of Irish. There are historical/political reasons why this is a valid view but in my experience for most of the people who take issue with calling the language Gaelic don't consider these and their objections are just pedantry or a force of habit, Still though, almost everyone in Ireland calls it Irish so you're best to go with that.

Where's that Mr C? I've genuinely never heard another Irish person call it Gaelic instead of Irish in everyday speech.

I grew up in Fermanagh. Thinking a bit more about it you are right. People mostly call it Irish but it is sometimes referred to as Gaelic 

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19 hours ago, gingerjon said:

I see a lot (relatively) of people use “Gaelige” on Twitter. Obviously that’s written and often being used to make the language use clear. When I did my Celtic Studies a lifetime ago, the language was referred to as Irish by the native speakers I came across.

Gaeilge is just the Irish/Gaelic word for the language and is usually used in English in a kind of affectionate way by speakers or, as you say, in a context where calling it Irish or Gaelic would be unclear.

18 hours ago, OriginalMrC said:

I grew up in Fermanagh. Thinking a bit more about it you are right. People mostly call it Irish but it is sometimes referred to as Gaelic 

I suspected it must be in the north which ties into the historical/political context I mentioned earlier. I wonder if the use of Gaelic vs Irish is divided by community?

Historically the use of the name Gaelic Instead of Irish was often a subtle attempt to downplay the connection between the language and the land for political reasons. Obviously this doesn’t happen in the South anymore but still does in the North with the DUP etc. Obviously the vast majority of people who call it Gaelic instead of Irish are not Gregory Campbell types but that’s where the negative association comes from I think.

Scotland is a great example of this. When the ruling class and the majority of the population of Scotland were Gaelic speaking, the speakers of “Inglis” (what we would now call Scots) referred to Gaelic as “Scots”. When the ruling class were gradually became dominated by “Inglis” speakers, “Inglis” became “Scots” and “Scots” or Gaelic, became “Erse” or Irish.

This was an obvious attempt by the new ruling class to present their language as the true “National language”, justifying their power over the state as part of the increasing conflict between the lowland, Scots-speaking aristocracy and the highland, Gaelic-speaking clan chiefs. It presented the Gaelic language as foreign and, worse still, Irish, which was at the time presented as a land of backward savages which needed to be civilised by Scottish colonists.

The effects of this are obvious to me to this day where reaction in Scotland to attempts to preserve Scottish Gaelic are met with absurd levels of opposition, and there is widespread denial of the connection of Gaelic to anywhere outside of the highlands, even areas with obviously Gaelic place names.

Ironically, following the Act of Union, when Standard English Replaced Scots as the language of the ruling class, Scots became the victim of a similar campaign of vilification and was, and still is, presented as simply bad English, spoken by the uneducated, rather than a language in its own right which lost its status as the language of political power. You can extend this argument to anywhere really, even within the same language - why is a broad Yorkshire accent any less “proper English” than a generic middle class English accent? Because the latter has political power.

This was an insanely long post but my basic point is that languages are inherently political and What they are and were called and how they are viewed by different populations reflects the political history of those populations. People will react to those languages and what they are called as a result of those histories, even if they are not consciously aware that they are doing so.

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A recent thing about Scots that is both funny and absolutely terrible https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/wxqy8x/most-of-scottish-wikipedia-written-by-american-in-mangled-english

EDIT

And a mea-culpa, I have used Scots Wikipedia as a tool to show that modern Scots does not really exist. I am now having to revise that opinion based on finding out that it was Scots Wikipedia and not the Scots language that was the issue.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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4 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

A recent thing about Scots that is both funny and absolutely terrible https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/wxqy8x/most-of-scottish-wikipedia-written-by-american-in-mangled-english

EDIT

And a mea-culpa, I have used Scots Wikipedia as a tool to show that modern Scots does not really exist. I am now having to revise that opinion based on finding out that it was Scots Wikipedia and not the Scots language that was the issue.

You’re not alone there, I do it all the time.

I have to constantly check myself that Ullans (the Ulster dialect of Scots) is a legitimate and, arguably, oppressed language, with native speakers dedicated to it’s survival who deserve support and which does not deserve to be vilified because it is now used as a stick to beat down Irish by the same opportunistic Unionist ruling class charlatans who once vilified it as uneducated when it was of no use to them.

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On 08/09/2020 at 07:50, damp squib said:

None of them are native speakers but the first two were pretty good, particularly the second guy (first guys accent wasn't great).

Third guy tried his best but was fairly basic and Ronan Michael at the end, well, here's a direct translation:

"A lot of person are playing football and playing rugby union, so eh, this boys are wonderful".

Fair play to him for trying though!

The Irish Club in Canberra offers free Irish language classes to anyone who is interested. I’m not sure how popular it is.

An Irish family lives around the corner from me in Canberra and when I asked them if they could speak Irish they laughed and then said it was a stupid and pointless language. I was quite surprised by their response.

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35 minutes ago, Copa said:

The Irish Club in Canberra offers free Irish language classes to anyone who is interested. I’m not sure how popular it is.

An Irish family lives around the corner from me in Canberra and when I asked them if they could speak Irish they laughed and then said it was a stupid and pointless language. I was quite surprised by their response.

A bizarre response indeed. I would love to be fluent in Irish but unfortunately I didn't grow up in a gaeltacht and the way it's thought in most schools here is a joke.

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5 minutes ago, Keith989 said:

A bizarre response indeed. I would love to be fluent in Irish but unfortunately I didn't grow up in a gaeltacht and the way it's thought in most schools here is a joke.

This thread have gone way, way off-topic, but one thing that strikes me is that Irish seems to be a slowly dying language in spite of the best efforts of politicians since Eamonn de Valera etc. - in the sense that the Gaeltacht is shrinking and many Irish people have a negative view of the language. Other things (e.g. the role of Comhaltas promoting Irish music not just in Ireland but among the wider Irish diaspora) seem to have gone far better in comparison.

If I contrast that with Welsh, where (on the whole) Welsh people have a positive view of the language, often feel bad that they don't speak it well, particularly if they can't help their children with Welsh homework, and the numbers of speakers are increasing. 

Maybe my view is not accurate? I wonder how much the academic way that Irish is taught is a factor? I don't think Irish people are any less patriotic or aware of their history compared with Welsh people.

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3 minutes ago, JonM said:

This thread have gone way, way off-topic, but one thing that strikes me is that Irish seems to be a slowly dying language in spite of the best efforts of politicians since Eamonn de Valera etc. - in the sense that the Gaeltacht is shrinking and many Irish people have a negative view of the language. Other things (e.g. the role of Comhaltas promoting Irish music not just in Ireland but among the wider Irish diaspora) seem to have gone far better in comparison.

If I contrast that with Welsh, where (on the whole) Welsh people have a positive view of the language, often feel bad that they don't speak it well, particularly if they can't help their children with Welsh homework, and the numbers of speakers are increasing. 

Maybe my view is not accurate? I wonder how much the academic way that Irish is taught is a factor? I don't think Irish people are any less patriotic or aware of their history compared with Welsh people.

I'm about 20 years out of date but I did some work on this as part of my undergrad dissertation - specifically comparing Welsh and Irish.

My view remains unchanged. In about 20 years Welsh will be spoken to a high degree of fluency by at least half of the population of Wales and be utterly dead as a community language.

EDIT

My opinion was not popular with the Welsh department who only gave me a 2:1. But then I was an annoying POS.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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1 hour ago, JonM said:

This thread have gone way, way off-topic, but one thing that strikes me is that Irish seems to be a slowly dying language in spite of the best efforts of politicians since Eamonn de Valera etc. - in the sense that the Gaeltacht is shrinking and many Irish people have a negative view of the language. Other things (e.g. the role of Comhaltas promoting Irish music not just in Ireland but among the wider Irish diaspora) seem to have gone far better in comparison.

If I contrast that with Welsh, where (on the whole) Welsh people have a positive view of the language, often feel bad that they don't speak it well, particularly if they can't help their children with Welsh homework, and the numbers of speakers are increasing. 

Maybe my view is not accurate? I wonder how much the academic way that Irish is taught is a factor? I don't think Irish people are any less patriotic or aware of their history compared with Welsh people.

After RTE radio switched off their longwave transmitters around the turn of the millennium, I didn`t follow ROI news and current affairs until the fairly recent referenda on social issues. The change is astounding. They seem to have gone from Gay Byrne to Sinead O`Connor in one fell swoop. This must have repercussions for the Irish language.

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11 hours ago, JonM said:

This thread have gone way, way off-topic, but one thing that strikes me is that Irish seems to be a slowly dying language in spite of the best efforts of politicians since Eamonn de Valera etc. - in the sense that the Gaeltacht is shrinking and many Irish people have a negative view of the language. Other things (e.g. the role of Comhaltas promoting Irish music not just in Ireland but among the wider Irish diaspora) seem to have gone far better in comparison.

If I contrast that with Welsh, where (on the whole) Welsh people have a positive view of the language, often feel bad that they don't speak it well, particularly if they can't help their children with Welsh homework, and the numbers of speakers are increasing. 

Maybe my view is not accurate? I wonder how much the academic way that Irish is taught is a factor? I don't think Irish people are any less patriotic or aware of their history compared with Welsh people.

This is exactly why it isn't popular among young people here. The Irish curriculum in the schools is a complete joke, students can spend around 13 years studying the language in school and come out not knowing how to construct a single sentence in it. From my point of the view, the government would be only too happy to let it die out.

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3 hours ago, Keith989 said:

This is exactly why it isn't popular among young people here. The Irish curriculum in the schools is a complete joke, students can spend around 13 years studying the language in school and come out not knowing how to construct a single sentence in it. From my point of the view, the government would be only too happy to let it die out.

Bit that is also the fault of the student. I did French at school for 3 years and learnt minimal, because I had such an indifferent attitude towards it. It is one of my biggest regrets. I since went back and learnt it to a decent conversational level. Everyone seems to blame the system, rather than themselves. 

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7 hours ago, JonM said:

This thread have gone way, way off-topic, but one thing that strikes me is that Irish seems to be a slowly dying language in spite of the best efforts of politicians since Eamonn de Valera etc. - in the sense that the Gaeltacht is shrinking and many Irish people have a negative view of the language. Other things (e.g. the role of Comhaltas promoting Irish music not just in Ireland but among the wider Irish diaspora) seem to have gone far better in comparison.

I have never lived in Ireland, but I thought the Irish language was near extinct. So when I saw this video, young rugby league players speaking it (regardless of their level) I was pleasantly surprised.

I am also pleased to see they have a channel dedicated to their language too. This gives fluent speakers a clear advantage and a reason to study it, of there are some job prospects and it can set them apart from the crowd. 

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7 hours ago, Keith989 said:

A bizarre response indeed. I would love to be fluent in Irish but unfortunately I didn't grow up in a gaeltacht and the way it's thought in most schools here is a joke.

You’d think that internationally there’d be plenty of experience in teaching languages appropriately in a school environment that the Irish government could harness. To continually fail to achieve decent outcomes tells me they aren’t trying very hard.

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15 minutes ago, langpark said:

Bit that is also the fault of the student. I did French at school for 3 years and learnt minimal, because I had such an indifferent attitude towards it. It is one of my biggest regrets. I since went back and learnt it to a decent conversational level. Everyone seems to blame the system, rather than themselves. 

Language teaching in Australia is appalling. The kids only get a few hours a week in high school and the teachers sometimes struggle with the language.

I studied Indonesian at university and also studied at an Indonesian university. My language skills are at a decent level.

I’ve met Indonesian language teachers in Australia who learn the lesson themselves the night before they teach it! When I was attending high school open nights with my kids, if they had an Indonesian language teacher I’d just start chatting to them in Indonesian with no warning and watch their reaction. Only one guy was able to keep up... he still looked startled though.

Fortunately I’m in a position where I can send my children overseas to the countries that use the language they are studying to help improve their fluency. I’m determined to ensure all my kids leave high school with a second language that they can use at a decent level.

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