Eddie Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 Considering how few games England play, is having a full time manager a costly luxury or would it be better to have a club manager filling in when needed? Shaun Wane is a top manager imho, but he seemed wasted in his current role and of course it’s costing the impoverished RFL too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnM Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 Part time manager...part time performances...part time results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 22, 2020 Author Share Posted October 22, 2020 29 minutes ago, JohnM said: Part time manager...part time performances...part time results. What is Shaun Wane doing though, other than watching players? We probably won’t have a game until the opener vs Samoa in over a year’s time. Wouldn’t he be better off managing at club level still, as well as managing England? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 Like many people at the moment - particularly those in leadership roles - his effectiveness is being hamstrung by the lack of games and the lack of opportunity to bring his squad together. But I would say that the success of the 2021 World Cup and, in particular, the success of the England team is probably the most important factor for our sport in decades. The enthusiasm and awareness that success would bring is invaluable. I am happy for Wane to be 100% focused on this and doing what he can. "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 Maybe he's been on furlough so maybe hasn't been quite as costly.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hela Wigmen Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 There’s a lot more to a full time role than just the actual end bit of it - taking charge of a game. Especially as you head into a World Cup year. He would have been taking charge of three, possibly four games this year, in a “normal” year. I’m pretty certain there was a mid-season international planned this year, I seem to remember Warrington v Saints was due to be moved to a midweek to fit this in, though opponents for England were never announced and he’d be coaching in the Ashes series around this time. Who knows, we may have even squeezed in a friendly prior to the Ashes starting, though that might have been a bit much. The talk of a game this year seems to have died down now so I don’t know if we can take that as it’s definitely not happening or he’s just been quiet for a period due to him coming down with Covid. I’m sure he’ll make a case next year for a mid-season International prior to the World Cup starting, where he’ll be hoping to take charge of six games. Again, we might even have a pre-World Cup friendly, as we did against Italy in 2013, where we lost at Salford (IIRC), so he could be coaching up to eight times next year and I would hope he is behind a lot of ambassadorial stuff prior to the World Cup as well as having to watch games and pick his side, so I think he definitely has his worth as a full time employee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Prince Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 2 hours ago, JohnM said: Part time manager...part time performances...part time results. Yes. To be pedantic he is coach. Generally we have an additional 'Manager' on tour don't we? I'm guessing that a tour manager might be appointed for the WC. On a similar vein Mal Meninga must be one of the most unemployed national managers in world sport (on a par with the stylist for Porsche).. on the basis that NRL have no interest in international rugby... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 I made a deal with the RFL and Shaun Wane to become England head coach during the tricky July-September period. I am pleased to report that I ended my tenure unbeaten and that we coped admirably without the injured Josh Hodgson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hela Wigmen Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 33 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said: Yes. To be pedantic he is coach. Generally we have an additional 'Manager' on tour don't we? I'm guessing that a tour manager might be appointed for the WC. On a similar vein Mal Meninga must be one of the most unemployed national managers in world sport (on a par with the stylist for Porsche).. on the basis that NRL have no interest in international rugby... The NRL who are behind more International rugby league than anyone else? Them? Yeah? But they’re the ones with the problem, not us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Prince Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 14 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said: The NRL who are behind more International rugby league than anyone else? Them? Yeah? But they’re the ones with the problem, not us. In 2018 Australia played 2 internationals. In 2019 they played 2 internationals. In 2018 we, England, played 4 internationals. In 2015 Australia played 1 game. England played 4 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marklaspalmas Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 4 hours ago, Rupert Prince said: Yes. To be pedantic he is coach. Generally we have an additional 'Manager' on tour don't we? I'm guessing that a tour manager might be appointed for the WC. On a similar vein Mal Meninga must be one of the most unemployed national managers in world sport (on a par with the stylist for Porsche).. on the basis that NRL have no interest in international rugby... That's not pedantry. https://www.fevarchive.co.uk/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 22, 2020 Author Share Posted October 22, 2020 4 hours ago, Rupert Prince said: In 2018 Australia played 2 internationals. In 2019 they played 2 internationals. In 2018 we, England, played 4 internationals. In 2015 Australia played 1 game. England played 4 games. Why pick those two years of the last six Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davo5 Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 On 21/10/2020 at 11:41, Eddie said: Considering how few games England play, is having a full time manager a costly luxury or would it be better to have a club manager filling in when needed? Shaun Wane is a top manager imho, but he seemed wasted in his current role and of course it’s costing the impoverished RFL too. No & No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Kevin Sinfield Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 On 21/10/2020 at 11:41, Eddie said: Considering how few games England play, is having a full time manager a costly luxury or would it be better to have a club manager filling in when needed? Shaun Wane is a top manager imho, but he seemed wasted in his current role and of course it’s costing the impoverished RFL too. Good point. Does any other Nation have a full time coach? Seems a complete waste of money, Wane has been in the job, supposedly working full time for not far off a year and he hasn’t even coached a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Prince Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 2 hours ago, Eddie said: Why pick those two years of the last six Because for one we had a world cup. But do you want to ignore the single game Australia played and we played 4? Its not me who is claiming Australia are so wonderful and we are not. And going back to the point... Australia have a full time coach and their team play very few games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hela Wigmen Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 7 hours ago, Rupert Prince said: In 2018 Australia played 2 internationals. In 2019 they played 2 internationals. In 2018 we, England, played 4 internationals. In 2015 Australia played 1 game. England played 4 games. Nice selection of random years, pal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Prince Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 26 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said: Nice selection of random years, pal. Not as random as your suggestion that Australia contribute more to the International Game that we do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted October 22, 2020 Author Share Posted October 22, 2020 7 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said: Not as random as your suggestion that Australia contribute more to the International Game that we do. Of course they do, without them there would be no Tongan, Fijian or Samoan national team, and probably no NZ either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Prince Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 35 minutes ago, Eddie said: Of course they do, without them there would be no Tongan, Fijian or Samoan national team, and probably no NZ either. It certainly helps keep SOO competitive. How often do Papua New Guinea play? How often do Fiji play. How often do Tonga v Samoa play each other? There is no doubt that i would welcome all the nations you mention play each other more. But they don't. And ... and this has all come from my earlier somewhat throw away comment ... despite all these nations, Mal Meninga is no more exercised than Shaun Wane. And one problem is that whilst NRL clubs benefit from overseas players in their own competition, they they have little interest in supporting International matches. They are parochial. Their god is Origin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhw Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 16 hours ago, Rupert Prince said: Not as random as your suggestion that Australia contribute more to the International Game that we do. ... but Australia does, it even produces international players for the second best resourced sporting body in Rugby League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exiled Wiganer Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 It depends what hours mean by Australia, doesn’t it? If you mean “does the Australian game produce and the NRL employ loads of players who fill the top international teams”, then Australia does masses, but if you mean “do the Kangaroos do much for the international game”, which is what this thread is about (I think) then I think England do more, and would do even more if given the chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 34 minutes ago, Exiled Wiganer said: It depends what hours mean by Australia, doesn’t it? If you mean “does the Australian game produce and the NRL employ loads of players who fill the top international teams”, then Australia does masses, but if you mean “do the Kangaroos do much for the international game”, which is what this thread is about (I think) then I think England do more, and would do even more if given the chance. Good point and it's an important distinction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RigbyLuger Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 Thought this was a thread about Colin Maskill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Prince Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 20 minutes ago, RigbyLuger said: Thought this was a thread about Colin Maskill. Isn't he that weatherman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UTK Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 On 23/10/2020 at 06:37, Rupert Prince said: It certainly helps keep SOO competitive. How often do Papua New Guinea play? How often do Fiji play. How often do Tonga v Samoa play each other? There is no doubt that i would welcome all the nations you mention play each other more. But they don't. And ... and this has all come from my earlier somewhat throw away comment ... despite all these nations, Mal Meninga is no more exercised than Shaun Wane. And one problem is that whilst NRL clubs benefit from overseas players in their own competition, they they have little interest in supporting International matches. They are parochial. Their god is Origin. Each of those sides plays every single year, and last year the Oceania Cup format began where each of those sides played multiple times in the same year. Due to obvious circumstances we haven't had the fortune of that competition returning this season, but given the emergence of Tonga (and their fandom) and the high chance of Samoa/Fiji/PNG doing similar things in the near future it's likely that comp will continue as planned moving forward. Could Australia/The NRL do more for international RL - Undoubtedly, but steps in the right direction are being taken. Australian systems have been creating development pathways for other countries for years now and additional developments are being made in that area now more than ever. Parochialism is a code-wide problem. Can't get much more parochial than having your entire comp based on the same road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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