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34 minutes ago, POR said:

I'm pretty sure they didn't have any plans on show, just a few promotional cgi videos and stills from those. Click through on the links in the article you've linked and.... there are no plans to be seen. 

If you can provide a link to any plan(s) I'd be both grateful and surprised. 

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8 minutes ago, Les Tonks Sidestep said:

I'm pretty sure they didn't have any plans on show, just a few promotional cgi videos and stills from those. Click through on the links in the article you've linked and.... there are no plans to be seen. 

If you can provide a link to any plan(s) I'd be both grateful and surprised. 

Let's not forget the 'plans' from a few years before this axiom site, where they reckoned on they were building a stadium at other side of xscape. 

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3 hours ago, paulwalker71 said:

Hard to say. We've had so many punches to the gut in past 10 years, I don't know how many people will have just drifted away, never to return. Like many clubs we have a very ageing fanbase. A lot would need to be done to re-engage the city.

Assuming Odsal, I would expect roughly 6-8K, with considerably more for the Leeds derby and possibly a couple of other big games. There might a bit of an initial bounce for the nostalgia of Odsal, but it might dissipate if we are being hammered every week which we would with our current squad.

As for travelling support, well, that's always been good, and has stayed proportionately good. Certainly higher than most other SL teams for sure, which would leave certain SL chairman rubbing their hands with glee

FWIW I hope we don't get the nod. We simply aren't ready, either on or off the field. It would simply be a one-year stay to give the other teams a boost from our travelling support and probably end with us relegated with zero (or close to it) points and back in Administration  (again) 

I think those two final scenarios of boosting home gates of lower Super League clubs while being certainties to get relegated will both be seen as plus points for some in all of this.

Obviously we should want what’s best for Bradford ultimately.

What’s the position of the club itself?

 

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3 hours ago, paulwalker71 said:

Hard to say. We've had so many punches to the gut in past 10 years, I don't know how many people will have just drifted away, never to return. Like many clubs we have a very ageing fanbase. A lot would need to be done to re-engage the city.

Assuming Odsal, I would expect roughly 6-8K, with considerably more for the Leeds derby and possibly a couple of other big games. There might a bit of an initial bounce for the nostalgia of Odsal, but it might dissipate if we are being hammered every week which we would with our current squad.

As for travelling support, well, that's always been good, and has stayed proportionately good. Certainly higher than most other SL teams for sure, which would leave certain SL chairman rubbing their hands with glee

FWIW I hope we don't get the nod. We simply aren't ready, either on or off the field. It would simply be a one-year stay to give the other teams a boost from our travelling support and probably end with us relegated with zero (or close to it) points and back in Administration  (again) 

I think you have to take the opportunity when it arises. I think the advantages way outweigh any negatives. 

I think Bradford are as ready as any other club. 

I think there is a chance of avoiding relegation with an enthusiastic squad and good coach. 

If you look at it the other way around,  Bradford would be the club most missed by the other championship clubs.

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4 hours ago, Bulls2487 said:

Our League/Twitter/Facebook numbers.

Bradford         10385(1) 34.5k 28k
York                 4832(5) 15.9k 5k
Toulouse         2188 (15) 8.2k 11k
Leigh               7268(2) 23.2k 11k
Featherstone 5249 (4) 15.6k 14k
London           2907 (8) 25.6k 12k

These numbers are misleading and not a good reflection of Toulouse support. Twitter is not popular in France and Our League will naturally be less so, given the English commentary

Any social media comparisons really ought to involve insta as that’s where the future supporters will engage and we know that many clubs in the sport have a problem with ageing supporter bases

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49 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

These numbers are misleading and not a good reflection of Toulouse support. Twitter is not popular in France and Our League will naturally be less so, given the English commentary

Any social media comparisons really ought to involve insta as that’s where the future supporters will engage and we know that many clubs in the sport have a problem with ageing supporter bases

I've enjoyed the Batley versus Toulouse games so best wishes with your application.

 

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1 hour ago, DoubleD said:

These numbers are misleading and not a good reflection of Toulouse support. Twitter is not popular in France and Our League will naturally be less so, given the English commentary

Any social media comparisons really ought to involve insta as that’s where the future supporters will engage and we know that many clubs in the sport have a problem with ageing supporter bases

Are Toulouse's Insta followers enough to make up the shortfall in this category?

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Firstly, the absence of any meaningful grading or weighting makes the criteria a little bit of a joke. I get they don't want to back themselves into a corner as they have probably already decided but why go to the effort of the sham detailed criteria. It's clearly not a serious evaluation process.

I've been thinking about this a lot and it would have been interesting to make the bids anonymous and given them to a panel of selectors who didnt know anything about RL. I suspect the ranking would be a lot different than people are expecting it will be.

The big question for me is what SL (because let's face it they are choosing) think of Toulouse. The leaked Toronto assessment which concluded that having Catalans in SL had no positive impact on SL's bottom line could be damning. No French sponsors for SL, extremely poor TV deals and no improvement in national team don't really help. COVID is another big issue given there is a question on how clubs will respond if COVID continues. 'Not well' is clearly the answer in this case. 

The majority seem to want Toulouse to continue the expansion dream but during these times of retraction and isolationism I'm not sure this is their time. They don't really stand out on any other criteria either, whilst holding their own. I think the SL clubs (who have apparently voiced who they want to Elstone) will want income and the best opportunity to avoid relegation. This is obvious from the funding debacle. Could London be the expansion alternative? Well maybe but their bid must come across incredibly weak if you take location and their SL 2019 performance out of the equation. The stadium alone should preclude them, playing there they do more to damage the image of SL than build it. 

Objectively, someone without any knowledge of the game might look at Bradford as by far the best candidate if they weren't playing at Dewsbury and dont go bust every year. On field hasnt been great in the past 2 seasons either but more than that, it just can't be them this time. Widnes also look strong on paper but I think their finances probably rule them out and I would be surprised if they bid. Fax I dont consider a serious chance, as much as I respect their right to bid.

So, what of the 'heartland' teams, Fev, Leigh and York? I think all three will come across quite well and have reasonably good bid, all with different strengths and weaknesses. Fev - runners-up, own the stadium, good facilities but close to cas/wakey, Leigh - good facilities, FT squad ready to go but recent financial troubles and less on field success in last 2 years, York - exciting location, new stadium, team on the up but only recently promoted and still a small operation off the field.

I think this will come down to do SL want an expansion team to placate the progressives after Toronto, i.e. a statement promotion, or do they want to retract and bring in a safer team who bring fans and are more likely to be able to play if COVID continues. And of course the main criteria - how likely are they to finish bottom.

Toulouse/London or Leigh/Fev/York

I honestly think theyll go Fev or York and whoever it is will be on a hiding to nothing.

Formerly Alistair Boyd-Meaney

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10 minutes ago, Tex Evans Thigh said:

Firstly, the absence of any meaningful grading or weighting makes the criteria a little bit of a joke. I get they don't want to back themselves into a corner as they have probably already decided but why go to the effort of the sham detailed criteria. It's clearly not a serious evaluation process.

I've been thinking about this a lot and it would have been interesting to make the bids anonymous and given them to a panel of selectors who didnt know anything about RL. I suspect the ranking would be a lot different than people are expecting it will be.

The big question for me is what SL (because let's face it they are choosing) think of Toulouse. The leaked Toronto assessment which concluded that having Catalans in SL had no positive impact on SL's bottom line could be damning. No French sponsors for SL, extremely poor TV deals and no improvement in national team don't really help. COVID is another big issue given there is a question on how clubs will respond if COVID continues. 'Not well' is clearly the answer in this case. 

The majority seem to want Toulouse to continue the expansion dream but during these times of retraction and isolationism I'm not sure this is their time. They don't really stand out on any other criteria either, whilst holding their own. I think the SL clubs (who have apparently voiced who they want to Elstone) will want income and the best opportunity to avoid relegation. This is obvious from the funding debacle. Could London be the expansion alternative? Well maybe but their bid must come across incredibly weak if you take location and their SL 2019 performance out of the equation. The stadium alone should preclude them, playing their they do more to damage the image of SL than build it. 

Objectively, someone without any knowledge of the game might look at Bradford as by far the best candidate if they weren't playing at Dewsbury and dont go bust every year. On field hasnt been great in the past 2 seasons either but more than that, it just can't be them this time. Widnes also look strong on paper but I think their finances probably rule them out and I would be surprised if they bid. Fax I dont consider a serious chance, as much as I respect their right to bid.

So, what of the 'heartland' teams, Fev, Leigh and York? I think all three will come across quite well and have reasonably good bid, all with different strengths and weaknesses. Fev - runners-up, own the stadium, good facilities but close to cas/wakey, Leigh - good facilities, FT squad ready to go but recent financial troubles and less on field success in last 2 years, York - exciting location, new stadium, team on the up but only recently promoted and still a small operation off the field.

I think this will come down to do SL want an expansion team to placate the progressives after Toronto, i.e. a statement promotion, or do they want to retract and bring in a safer team who bring fans and are more likely to be able to play if COVID continues. And of course the main criteria - how likely are they to finish bottom.

Toulouse/London or Leigh/Fev/York

I honestly think theyll go Fev or York and whoever it is will be on a hiding to nothing.

I kind of agree, if they do want to placate the expansionists, and also continue to offer Sky something a little more exotic then they will go for Toulouse. If on the other hand they decide to circle the wagons and stay in the heartland I really wouldn’t be surprised to see Bradford as the choice knowing that there’s no way they could put together a SL squad on reduced funding so odds on to finish bottom, plus they would offer the highest chance of increasing average attendances, at least until the Bulls have gone halfway through the season and still don’t have a point. I just suspect that they will reject Fev based on location, and the same for Leigh, although in the case of the latter I think they would be worried that if Leigh came up they might just stay up, which could be terrifying for Wakey, Hull KR and possibly Salford without Watson.

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27 minutes ago, Oldbear said:

I kind of agree, if they do want to placate the expansionists, and also continue to offer Sky something a little more exotic then they will go for Toulouse. If on the other hand they decide to circle the wagons and stay in the heartland I really wouldn’t be surprised to see Bradford as the choice knowing that there’s no way they could put together a SL squad on reduced funding so odds on to finish bottom, plus they would offer the highest chance of increasing average attendances, at least until the Bulls have gone halfway through the season and still don’t have a point. I just suspect that they will reject Fev based on location, and the same for Leigh, although in the case of the latter I think they would be worried that if Leigh came up they might just stay up, which could be terrifying for Wakey, Hull KR and possibly Salford without Watson.

I would assume that it looks like Leigh are capable of building a squad capable of staying up with Degsy's funding which might put teams off. As I said on another thread though, Leigh are kind of building a squad to win the championship so I'm not sure how much space they have on the cap. Fev and York may be able to better spend the million but I'm not sure. Both would need to transition from hybrid/PT which would be more difficult.

I doubt Sky are overly fussed about Toulouse or London, at least not to the point they would push them. Neither bring in more viewers and certainly not more subscribers despite what people would like to think. Heartland teams will likely increase Sky viewers and subscriptions albeit only a small amount.

Bradford probably do look the best bet, but they'd have to back to Odsal and...well we just can't can we if have a shred of integrity! Nothing against Bradford btw but they deserve to be where they are at the moment and have to build organically.

Formerly Alistair Boyd-Meaney

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14 hours ago, Dave T said:

This is a dishonest point. They aren't looking for a club to deliver 2k crowds in SL. 

If your going to call someone or something dishonest I suggest you read more carefully.

The minimum criteria is 2k , although feel free to twist comments to suite your argument .

 

14 hours ago, Dave T said:

This is a dishonest point. They aren't looking for a club to deliver 2k crowds in SL. 

 

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1 minute ago, snoopdog said:

If your going to call someone or something dishonest I suggest you read more carefully.

The minimum criteria is 2k , although feel free to twist comments to suite your argument .

 

 

So what exactly is the issue with demanding that lower league teams have 2k crowds? It's a perfectly reasonable number for lower league RL. 

It was a dishonest point. 

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Fair play to the level headed Bradford fans on here who are saying their Club isn't ready to go in to the SL. It is a big ask for any of the applicants to go in at such short notice and be competitive. Although there is a groundswell of support for Toulouse on here it doesn't mean they will be a success. Regular heavy beatings will soon put any Johnny Come Lately's off. Whoever is selected, let's hope they can be competitive, and the selection process does have a degree of fairness.

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I don’t see how any part time sides can seriously be considered. They may have to recruit a completely new team in a very short space of time, for what may be a one season wonder. It would create huge instability. For that reason, I can only see Toulouse, Leigh and London as credible possibilities.

If teams had more time to prepare in a licensing format, then that would allow PT teams to prepare accordingly but not in this situation 

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1 minute ago, DoubleD said:

I don’t see how any part time sides can seriously be considered. They may have to recruit a completely new team in a very short space of time, for what may be a one season wonder. It would create huge instability. For that reason, I can only see Toulouse, Leigh and London as credible possibilities.

If teams had more time to prepare in a licensing format, then that would allow PT teams to prepare accordingly but not in this situation 

I notice Toulouse have signed Joseph Paulo, whats happening with all the Wolfpack players, any word on where they will end up. I'm assuming that whoever goes up will be looking at these players to improve their squad.

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25 minutes ago, Balmain1969 said:

I notice Toulouse have signed Joseph Paulo, whats happening with all the Wolfpack players, any word on where they will end up. I'm assuming that whoever goes up will be looking at these players to improve their squad.

Gone to Leigh,they are all great players now,apparently.

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Pete Smith in the YEP podcast very wary of the low expectations - particularly acknowledging the weaknesses of SL clubs.

Also raises the valid point that there seems to be no strategy or vision. Comparing Toulouse and Leigh and Bradford for example is a bit odd. Those 3 offer totally separate visions and the criteria, only through its low bar, enables all to enter.

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29 minutes ago, Balmain1969 said:

I notice Toulouse have signed Joseph Paulo, whats happening with all the Wolfpack players, any word on where they will end up. I'm assuming that whoever goes up will be looking at these players to improve their squad.

Dissapated across a number of SL and Championship sides, with Leigh taking a few on. There might be less than 10 unsigned now

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2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Pete Smith in the YEP podcast very wary of the low expectations - particularly acknowledging the weaknesses of SL clubs.

Also raises the valid point that there seems to be no strategy or vision. Comparing Toulouse and Leigh and Bradford for example is a bit odd. Those 3 offer totally separate visions and the criteria, only through its low bar, enables all to enter.

In an ideal world it may also give Super League the chance to talk to prospective entrants about what they need to be successful in the top flight.

It should really be an exercise also in discussing a Super League pathway for clubs in various states of readiness as well deciding on the 12th club this time.

The opportunity is there, but as I say that’s in an ideal world.

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