World Cup Warm Up Games

[langpark]

17 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

Does that not devalue the Australian brand if you’re picking your 2nd or 3rd best XIII (which, could still beat most nations)?

It would never come to that. It was only Smith and maybe a few others. So whenever that happens, I say the show must go on. Throw them overboard and get on with it. 99% of players do not need any begging to play for their country. 

[The Rocket]

23 minutes ago, langpark said:

Yes but the depth in their ranks is insane, they could pick literally 3 squads capable of competing with and probably beating NZ and England. So if Cameron is tired, the answer should have been simple; step aside. There are dozens of others behind you in the queue keen and willing. 

Just for the sake of balance, I have been following League down here intently for 45 years, not uncommon in the past for me to listen to ABC Grandstand for 10 hours on a saturday and a sunday, and I have never, ever, ever heard anyone say that Australia didn`t play internationals because Cam Smith was tired. If he had, Warren Ryan, Dave Morrow or more lately Mathew Elliot or David Moore would have blown their top, so I`m not quite sure where you get that information from.

[Scotchy1]

Just now, langpark said:

I think you will find those big crowds were for matches played in France too. 

As they should be.

France has shown an ability to sell their games. A two or three week European comp before the autumn cross hemisphere games could be built in to something great.

[Eddie]

17 minutes ago, Scotchy1 said:

The last 5 france v Wales games have had 4k, 1k and 5k, 11k  1.5k  and 10k.

Is this in West Yorkshire, France or Wales? 

[Scotchy1]

1 minute ago, Eddie said:

Is this in West Yorkshire, France or Wales? 

Why would they play in west Yorkshire?

[Hela Wigmen]

1 minute ago, Eddie said:

Is this in West Yorkshire, France or Wales? 

Carcassonne, Cardiff Arms Park, Albi, Lens and Wrexham. 

[Oxford]

14 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

You’ve slept through your alarm. It’s happening now. 

No they've made sure their hegemony is assured by providing tough opposition and getting a good look at possible rivals if that's your definition of leading the International Game that's great.

The international game, because of attitudes on boths sides of the planet, is so much of a backwater it could be division 27 of the Pennine League.

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

17 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

As high as that? 1,178 watched Jamaica v Wales at Wakefield in 2016. 

 

23 minutes ago, Eddie said:

True that. If France v Wales was played at Batley what would the crowd be, 1,500? 

Maybe it’s Wakefield and Batley that are the problem, not France and Wales. 
France v Wales got over 4000 in Carcassonne, France v Ireland got 4700 in Albi and France v Scotland got 5700 in Avignon.

[Tommygilf]

10 minutes ago, The Rocket said:

Just for the sake of balance, I have been following League down here intently for 45 years, not uncommon in the past for me to listen to ABC Grandstand for 10 hours on a saturday and a sunday, and I have never, ever, ever heard anyone say that Australia didn`t play internationals because Cam Smith was tired. If he had, Warren Ryan, Dave Morrow or more lately Mathew Elliot or David Moore would have blown their top, so I`m not quite sure where you get that information from.

What about the insistence on "fallow years" like 2015?

[Keith989]

44 minutes ago, langpark said:

Again, not to be negative, but they are two completely different scenarios. Tonga has such a big and passionate diaspora in Aus and NZ, they are guaranteed sellouts wherever they go and all their players are already based in those 2 countries anyway. So it is a no-brainer. France, Wales etc will struggle to fill Batley's ground.

Tonga's games are anything but a guaranteed sell out. They only got sell outs at the last world cup.

[Davo5]

1 hour ago, Eddie said:

True, it is concerning though, would surely be massively beneficial for Wane, as well as the players. Can’t imagine a team rocking up to a World Cup having not played a game for two years in any other sport. 

Not only will England rock up to a home World Cup under prepared,they are likely to be limping and missing key players.

[langpark]

20 minutes ago, The Rocket said:

Just for the sake of balance, I have been following League down here intently for 45 years, not uncommon in the past for me to listen to ABC Grandstand for 10 hours on a saturday and a sunday, and I have never, ever, ever heard anyone say that Australia didn`t play internationals because Cam Smith was tired. If he had, Warren Ryan, Dave Morrow or more lately Mathew Elliot or David Moore would have blown their top, so I`m not quite sure where you get that information from.

It was 2015. I cannot find a direct quote from Smith but I did find this article after a quick search: https://www.couriermail.com.au/sport/nrl/anzac-test-kangaroos-say-only-have-one-test-in-2015-doesnt-affect-importance-of-representing-australia/news-story/4a2701ae1d41ddb6d132ef5682d628db

[Eddie]

17 minutes ago, Scotchy1 said:

Why would they play in west Yorkshire?

The point was, that Tonga can attract big crowds in Australia and NZ but France or Wales can’t attract big crowds in England. 

[Eddie]

11 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

 

Maybe it’s Wakefield and Batley that are the problem, not France and Wales. 
France v Wales got over 4000 in Carcassonne, France v Ireland got 4700 in Albi and France v Scotland got 5700 in Avignon.

Is that a serious comment? 

[Scotchy1]

Just now, Eddie said:

The point was, that Tonga can attract big crowds in Australia and NZ but France or Wales can’t attract big crowds in England. 

Maybe so, but the reasons why tonga have to play in Australia aren't reasons Wales or France would need to play in England

[langpark]

10 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Maybe it’s Wakefield and Batley that are the problem, not France and Wales. 

France v Wales got over 4000 in Carcassonne, France v Ireland got 4700 in Albi and France v Scotland got 5700 in Avignon.

I think you may have missed the point. I was saying that Tonga are able to pull in 20k fans when not even playing in their home country. There is no Europe equivalent that mirrors this in the slightest. I chose two European nations at random and said if they played in England, they would not get a big crowd, and randomly used Batley as an example if a tiny stadium. 

NRL is not doing charity by hosting Tonga matches, but profiting handsomely from it.

[Eddie]

1 minute ago, Scotchy1 said:

Maybe so, but the reasons why tonga have to play in Australia aren't reasons Wales or France would need to play in England

There is a 10,000 capacity stadium in Tonga, where their Union side play. Why don’t the RL side play there now and again? 

[Tommygilf]

2 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

Not only will England rock up to a home World Cup under prepared,they are likely to be limping and missing key players.

Even with the pre covid plans we had a 3 game series against Oz and that was it, for what should be the number 1 priority for the English game

[Scotchy1]

2 minutes ago, Eddie said:

There is a 10,000 capacity stadium in Tonga, where their Union side play. Why don’t the RL side play there now and again? 

Because they regularly sell more than that in Australia. 

[Hela Wigmen]

3 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

What about the insistence on "fallow years" like 2015?

Honestly, I don’t see a major issue with it. I’m prepared to be unpopular.

They played 14 Internationals between 2012-2014, on top of the commitments at club level and with State of Origin. 2016 and 2017 saw them play 13 Internationals on top of the club commitments, State of Origin and three clubs coming to the UK for the World Club Series. 

I’ve no problem with the occasional “off year” with minimal games played. We moan about player welfare at club level but expect Australia to play multiple games every year on top of their players playing higher intensity games more often at club level. 

I maintain England’s problem lies at our own door, not that of Australia, the NRL or anyone else. I don’t think our “off year” or years, is due to player welfare, it’s down to incompetence, greed and a lack of a plan for the game. 

[The Rocket]

9 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

What about the insistence on "fallow years" like 2015?

The end of Ashes Tours in 2006 coincided with the rise of the great Queensland side and understandably the main representative focus became whether NSW would ever win a series again, these two things wouldn`t have helped. One thing I do know for sure was that when Mal Meninga became Kangaroos coach in 2015 he said that his aim was to put the pride back into wearing the jumper again, even though at that stage we really still had no credible opposition, he just wanted blokes to still strive to get it. And by and large he has been successful, even better now it`s starting to look like we may have someone to test us.

[Tommygilf]

12 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

Honestly, I don’t see a major issue with it. I’m prepared to be unpopular.

They played 14 Internationals between 2012-2014, on top of the commitments at club level and with State of Origin. 2016 and 2017 saw them play 13 Internationals on top of the club commitments, State of Origin and three clubs coming to the UK for the World Club Series. 

I’ve no problem with the occasional “off year” with minimal games played. We moan about player welfare at club level but expect Australia to play multiple games every year on top of their players playing higher intensity games more often at club level. 

I maintain England’s problem lies at our own door, not that of Australia, the NRL or anyone else. I don’t think our “off year” or years, is due to player welfare, it’s down to incompetence, greed and a lack of a plan for the game. 

I agree, I was just contesting the point that Australian's have never said they're too tired to play post season internationals.

FWIW, we should have been developing the teams on our doorstep and once again are being left in the cold as a result of our own short termism. It happened in 2019 with the Aussies turning us down with the GB tour too.

[Tommygilf]

13 minutes ago, The Rocket said:

The end of Ashes Tours in 2006 coincided with the rise of the great Queensland side and understandably the main representative focus became whether NSW would ever win a series again, these two things wouldn`t have helped. One thing I do know for sure was that when Mal Meninga became Kangaroos coach in 2015 he said that his aim was to put the pride back into wearing the jumper again, even though at that stage we really still had no credible opposition, he just wanted blokes to still strive to get it. And by and large he has been successful, even better now it`s starting to look like we may have someone to test us.

That's all great but a simple, "oh yeah I forgot about that and was wrong", would have sufficed. Whether it was lethargy or lack of pride in the jersey or whatever, the excuse of fallow off seasons was made for why Australia played only 1 mid year test in 2015.

The Kangaroos should be a fundamental part of the game's international future. With the help of New Zealand they now have 5 serious tests on their doorstep with Tonga, Samoa, Fiji and PNG. With the Oceania cup they're advancing that too.  

[thirteenthman]

4 minutes ago, Eddie said:

There is a 10,000 capacity stadium in Tonga, where their Union side play. Why don’t the RL side play there now and again? 

Finance. The Tongan RL have always relied on the NZ and Aussie RL's to stage their games for them. It's highly unlikely that a game staged in Tonga would make money so until such time as the Tongans can organise their own games, or the IRL have enough money to help out, it's not going to happen. And the last I heard, the old Tongan RL body were taking the IRL to a court of arbitration over their expulsion, so it's all a bit messy really. 

[Tommygilf]

Just now, thirteenthman said:

Finance. The Tongan RL have always relied on the NZ and Aussie RL's to stage their games for them. It's highly unlikely that a game staged in Tonga would make money so until such time as the Tongans can organise their own games, or the IRL have enough money to help out, it's not going to happen. And the last I heard, the old Tongan RL body were taking the IRL to a court of arbitration over their expulsion, so it's all a bit messy really. 

Also, there's more Tongans in New Zealand than in Tonga