Elstone gone (Merged threads)

[Oxford]

3 minutes ago, The Future is League said:

The more you read and hear about Elstones tenure the more you realise what a total failure he was for the money he was getting was.

Fighting I think the problem is SL and it's structure, in all the years I've watched RL I honestly can't recall one club, aministrator that wasn't either totally self serving and the few who've suggested  anything beyond their own club being ignored or powerless to change anything. Sadly the TWP story characterises SL and RL generally and historically only too well.

[Oxford]

33 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Obviously there is a huge risk covid will balls it all up. 

The economic effects will if the virus doesn't!

[Exiled Wiganer]

54 minutes ago, Clogiron said:

By different I mean the total lack of any follow up on the pluses from that 2013 event, how long was it before another international was played, what happened in Bristol or the South West or Cumbria or Scotland? All the game's were on TV but most were buried away on Premier sports, even with Andrew Voss they were unlikely to attract a substantial audience to the game. Even under a convaluted qualifying system the '92 final at Wembley was a National event with a 72,000+ crowd and true big ticket atmosphere. Australia V New Zealand at Old Trafford couldn't and won't match that.

But what was the follow up in 92? When we had 2/3 international sides. As a game we are so far ahead of that it may as well be a different sport. 

We now have 4 yearly multi team World Cups, with a lot of competitive teams. 2013 was the most ambitious tournament we have ever put on and it was a triumph. To such an extent that we have World Cups inked in every 4 years as a given, which in a sport where nothing else aside from SoO is certain, is a complete triumph. I was at Wembley for the 2 semis and at OT for the final, and there was no way on earth we could have sold an average of 70k tickets at any time in our history for events which did not feature Australia playing England/GB. There are a lot of things I miss about that period, especially the BBC exposure we used to get, but our international set up is light years away from where it was.

[Blind side johnny]

5 hours ago, Angelic Cynic said:

Yet he doesn't seem to be in a position to ask Elstone to change his mind.

Lenagan himself does seem to change his mind.From this...

https://www.thedrum.com/news/2014/02/04/wigan-warriors-chairman-asks-why-200m-sky-sports-tv-rights-deal-didn-t-go-out-tender

To being satisfied with Sky...Lenagan added: “In terms of the TV deal, Sky is a great partner. I think we’ve done well with them.

“The increases in television audience, particularly in 2019, were quite dramatic and we survived extremely well through 2020.

Is there any money left in the pot for Super League clubs to fund a replacement?

They don't seem to have paid Rothschilds Bank,yet.

He wouldn't want to talk down the value of Wigan RFL though, would he?

Not that he is planning to sell it or anything, you understand.

[Yakstorm]

How old is Richard Lewis? Can we convince him to come back? At least when he was in, everyone in Rugby League knew the direction he wanted to push the game in.

One thing Wood, Rimmer and Elston all have in common is they had no vision or direction to push the sport towards, which is what has created this underwhelming hodge-podge approach to everything.

Are we trying to be a northern powerhouse sport? Are we trying to be a sport played all over England? Are we trying to create a European Super League or International League? No one knows and hence we do a little of everything poorly and often end up worse than what we started with.

Scenarios like Toronto and Toulouse in SL and even the debacle with Catalans almost not taking part in the Challenge Cup could have been handled so much better if there was this direction, even if the direction was "they're not part of the plan"

I hope, whoever takes up the role next, just makes a call and sticks with it.  It's the only way we can pull ourselves out of the mess we are in.

[briggyq]

3 hours ago, paulwalker71 said:

And the plot thickens even more .....

Not really that was in the press release yesterday wasn't it that it was an intention to resign?

[Oxford]

25 minutes ago, Yakstorm said:

Are we trying to be a northern powerhouse sport?

No.

25 minutes ago, Yakstorm said:

Are we trying to be a sport played all over England?

No!

25 minutes ago, Yakstorm said:

Are we trying to create a European Super League or International League?

No

 

Oh, sorry i thought it was a TotalRL surveY!

[Robthegasman]

For the money he”earned”and I use the term loosely he has been a total failure and flop.

On his watch we have seen Super League basically take control of the whole sport but not only that but on his watch he has”negotiated”a deal with Sky from which I understand is going to see them pay a lot less than what they pay now.Now that to me is failure,and frankly I don’t care what the circumstances are or aren’t.The day you accept lesser and poorer terms is the day you are on a slippery slope to decline.

And now this useless penis is going I hope that we see a huge change in the way the RFL is run.

 I hope we see the whole game run by the RFL once again,at ALL levels,like dare I say rugby union in England is at all levels by the RFU.The game(rugby league)is nowhere near big enough to have different governing bodies.

 And in my opinion I think there should be a”general manager”who is in charge of the relevant divisions ie Super League,Championship etc with an amount of autonomy to help guide the clubs in the relevant division(s)

 

 

[clogdance]

So it's Robert Elstone's fault most Super League games are boring, and the nearest thing to excitement or skill you get, is a winger doing an acrobatic dive in the corner to score a try.

[rlfan2020]

On 09/02/2021 at 15:19, Damien said:

I was full of hope and optimism when he started. I genuinely believed he was going to change things and despite a few improvements, such as the new programmes we saw at the start of the season, he has added little and has been a major disappointment. On things like expanding Super League's footprint and appeal he has been a disaster and the way he handled the likes of Toronto and Toulouse was very poor. Ultimately what we ended up with was little more than we were getting before and that just cannot justify his huge salary.

He did nothing at Huddersfield prior or Everton... Why he was given the opportunity begs belief!! Maybe a puppet of SL clubs comes to mind!

[MattSantos]

10 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

No they didn't, they divided out control to the NRL clubs who run the reserve grades and junior grades and divided up what was left to the ARLC.

Because it's in a terrible state the game in Australia. The clubs have a say as a stakeholder, as do the states. Ultimately, its run by an independent board. 

[Tommygilf]

7 hours ago, MattSantos said:

Because it's in a terrible state the game in Australia. The clubs have a say as a stakeholder, as do the states. Ultimately, its run by an independent board. 

The NRL runs the game in Australia, everyone else follows its decisions whilst retaining control over their specific area and how that feeds into the NRL system.

[DimmestStar]

13 hours ago, Robthegasman said:

from which I understand is going to see them pay a lot less than what they pay now.

 

 

What do you mean by 'you understand'. It sort of implies you have some credible source. This is at odds with what Ian Lenagan said recently he point blank denied that there would be a significant reduction.
 

[Angelic Cynic]

37 minutes ago, DimmestStar said:

What do you mean by 'you understand'. It sort of implies you have some credible source. This is at odds with what Ian Lenagan said recently he point blank denied that there would be a significant reduction.
 

Lenagan point blank sang the praises of Elstone,was going to make Wigan Warriors the biggest name in rugby league,take home games to London and Australia, link Wigan with Cumbria,and in Wales etc..

https://www.skysports.com/rugby-league/news/12532/9946788/phil-clarke-wigan-can-make-capital-gains-with-london-home-game

Seems to get it right about as often as Pearson and his ' bigger than rugby union' quote.

I wonder if Elstone has been head hunted? Return to soccer,perhaps?  

[lucky 7]

50 minutes ago, Angelic Cynic said:

Lenagan point blank sang the praises of Elstone,was going to make Wigan Warriors the biggest name in rugby league,take home games to London and Australia, link Wigan with Cumbria,and in Wales etc..

https://www.skysports.com/rugby-league/news/12532/9946788/phil-clarke-wigan-can-make-capital-gains-with-london-home-game

Seems to get it right about as often as Pearson and his ' bigger than rugby union' quote.

I wonder if Elstone has been head hunted? Return to soccer,perhaps?  

I can't imagine he would get a stint at a premier league club as Everton were glad to see the back of him.

He certainly fooled Lenagan and many others, but not the really smart one's like Eamonn McManus and Gary heatherington

[lucky 7]

21 hours ago, Blind side johnny said:

Good question. No doubt 12 months contract at least given how anxious some clubs were to appoint him.

= it shows how desperate they were and still are for money and got hoodwinked into believing he was some sort of messiah with a silver bullet to cure all the games ills.

[Tommygilf]

1 hour ago, Angelic Cynic said:

Lenagan point blank sang the praises of Elstone,was going to make Wigan Warriors the biggest name in rugby league,take home games to London and Australia, link Wigan with Cumbria,and in Wales etc..

https://www.skysports.com/rugby-league/news/12532/9946788/phil-clarke-wigan-can-make-capital-gains-with-london-home-game

Seems to get it right about as often as Pearson and his ' bigger than rugby union' quote.

I wonder if Elstone has been head hunted? Return to soccer,perhaps?  

No chance, Everton have gone from mid table basket case to European football contenders since he left

[Rupert Prince]

6 minutes ago, lucky 7 said:

I can't imagine he would get a stint at a premier league club as Everton were glad to see the back of him.

He certainly fooled Lenagan and many others, but not the really smart one's like Eamonn McManus and Gary heatherington

Elstone was at Everton since 2005.  He became deputy CEO then chief in 2009.  His replacement as deputy was Denise Barrett-Baxendale.  I can't think he did not have some involvement in that, and worked with her for some 8 years. But were on the board together for some time.  She then became chief, and still is, after he left.  So to invent as you do that they were glad he left them is stretching your prejudice.

What I suggest to you is that the SL and the wider RL do not want to be managed and governed.

What ever happens to the game depends on what happens about half way through the season after the next.  If that later season gets SL 30 million as suggested then they have 12 months to sort themselves out.

[M j M]

23 minutes ago, lucky 7 said:

He certainly fooled Lenagan and many others, but not the really smart one's like Eamonn McManus and Gary heatherington

Hmmmm.

McManus gives backing to new Super League CEO Robert Elstone

Quote

"I have never known Super League clubs to be more unified and to have such a sense of purpose to improve the quality, performance and value of Super League.

"To achieve this we must have a dedicated senior professional staff whose only focus is to improve Super League in every respect, and also to work with our governing body, the RFL, in ensuring that the wider game benefits consequently.

"The vast majority of Super League clubs strongly believe that the previous singular and overreaching management of the RFL of all aspects and all components of rugby league, including Super League, resulted in too many serious conflicts of interest and a lack of transparency and adequate accountability.

"This has resulted in a consequent commercial underperformance of the principal commercial driver of our sport, namely Super League.

"The appointment of a new, highly capable, respected and experienced senior executive in Robert Elstone represents a first and critical step to produce a bigger, better and brighter future for Super League.

"He has the full support of the board of Super League who appointed him, and who are absolutely confident in him and in the dedicated focus which he will bring to our business.

"Our vision and strategy will be unashamedly Super League led, as it is by far the principal commercial driver and funder of our sport: it needs to be strengthened and maximised.

"A dedicated management, led by Robert, is critical to the delivery of a thriving and more strongly funded Super League which in turn will benefit the wider game."

 

[Dave T]

1 minute ago, M j M said:

Hmmmm.

McManus gives backing to new Super League CEO Robert Elstone

 

The rewriting of history that appears to be standard nowadays within the game never fails to surprise me. 

[Tommygilf]

27 minutes ago, lucky 7 said:

I can't imagine he would get a stint at a premier league club as Everton were glad to see the back of him.

He certainly fooled Lenagan and many others, but not the really smart one's like Eamonn McManus and Gary heatherington

Tbf only Hetherington has been against the split from the start. Though losing the faith of a key backer in McManus and appearing not to inspire much confidence from Warrington didn't bode well for Elstone.

[lucky 7]

10 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

Elstone was at Everton since 2005.  He became deputy CEO then chief in 2009.  His replacement as deputy was Denise Barrett-Baxendale.  I can't think he did not have some involvement in that, and worked with her for some 8 years. But were on the board together for some time.  She then became chief, and still is, after he left.  So to invent as you do that they were glad he left them is stretching your prejudice.

What I suggest to you is that the SL and the wider RL do not want to be managed and governed.

What ever happens to the game depends on what happens about half way through the season after the next.  If that later season gets SL 30 million as suggested then they have 12 months to sort themselves out.

Go the Everton FC fans forum and read what the fans thought of him if it ls still on there. 

 

[M j M]

4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The rewriting of history that appears to be standard nowadays within the game never fails to surprise me. 

Of course on the same day there was this response which I thought misguided at the time, and still do (in terms of tone if not underlying message).

Statemen from Gary Hetherington regarding plans for changes to Super League format

Quote

Today’s announcement regarding plans for next season appear to be an absurd grab for power for the game by a small group of men who think they own the game.

 

[Dave T]

6 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Tbf only Hetherington has been against the split from the start. Though losing the faith of a key backer in McManus and appearing not to inspire much confidence from Warrington didn't bode well for Elstone.

This point keeps being rolled out about Warrington - what have they said? Because the only thing I have ever seen is that they abstained from the TWP vote because they felt there was a conflict and didn't want to be TWP's executioner, but similarly found the bid so poor that they couldn't vote positively for it unlike Saints did who also claimed a conflict.

[Dave T]

double