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Latest update on upgrade to Wakefield's ground


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16 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

Unfortunately this is true.  Some of that 60 million that (some) SL clubs turned down might have helped leverage some investment for Cas.  But Hetherington helped stop it.  Not that it did not stop him from getting private investment for Headingly.

When will you ever get the point. Only a madman would spend £mmm on stadium redevelopment by using money provided at loan shark rates.

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22 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

Unfortunately this is true.  Some of that 60 million that (some) SL clubs turned down might have helped leverage some investment for Cas.  But Hetherington helped stop it.  Not that it did not stop him from getting private investment for Headingly.

Castleford's issue is that they've been relying on a dying retail sector to anchor every possible proposal they've put forward, not because not enough clubs voted to accept private equity funding.

The days of supermarkets and big-box retailers being strong-armed into building stadiums by S106 agreements are long-since over. 

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8 minutes ago, Josef K said:

I might start visiting Wakey again when my club play there. But first they have to sort out the dreadful flat terracing or at least give out milk crates for everyone to stand on. 

If everyone is stood on a crate you still won't be able to see 🤔😀

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2 hours ago, whatmichaelsays said:

Castleford's issue is that they've been relying on a dying retail sector to anchor every possible proposal they've put forward, not because not enough clubs voted to accept private equity funding.

The days of supermarkets and big-box retailers being strong-armed into building stadiums by S106 agreements are long-since over. 

They need to anchor it to warehousing then. But there is leisure as well as retail.

Or simply build a modest stadium  ... if there was investment available.

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4 hours ago, whatmichaelsays said:

Castleford's issue is that they've been relying on a dying retail sector to anchor every possible proposal they've put forward, not because not enough clubs voted to accept private equity funding.

The days of supermarkets and big-box retailers being strong-armed into building stadiums by S106 agreements are long-since over. 

I’m not sure that’s completely true. I seem to recall they had a deal with Ben Bailey homes to purchase Wheldon Road, which would provide funding for a new basic stadium around 2008 time. Then came the credit crunch

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6 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

I’m not sure that’s completely true. I seem to recall they had a deal with Ben Bailey homes to purchase Wheldon Road, which would provide funding for a new basic stadium around 2008 time. Then came the credit crunch

I'd be surprised to say the least if the value of land around Wheldon Road for housing would even touch the sides of the cost of a new stadium. Cas always relied on a retail element. 

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1 hour ago, Rupert Prince said:

They need to anchor it to warehousing then. But there is leisure as well as retail.

Or simply build a modest stadium  ... if there was investment available.

Warehousing isn't the sort of development that is difficult enough or contentious enough to get through planning to make that viable. Warehouse developers don't need to sweeten the deal with the offer of a stadium. And even when they do, Wakefield found out the hard way that it's far from a safe bet. 

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Never understood the obsession with pandering for new stadiums. Most of them are soulless bland flatpacks totally lacking character.

There appears to be a bandwagon that continually slams Castlefords Wheldon Road ground? I'd much sooner watch a game there than some of the legoland jobs that flood the market.

I miss the old places such as Central Park, Knowsley Road & Wilderspool, even the more quirky settings such as The Willows & The Boulevard were much better for atmosphere and the true spirit of our game.

Sadly Wakefield never had a ground to qualify for this nostalgic status. The viewing is appalling and the best thing to say about the cramped main stand is that at least it's got a roof. Don't get me going about the block of flats behind the posts 🤪

Be great if we could've kept all the old grounds and had a whip round to build a proper one for Trinity 👍🏉

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31 minutes ago, Ramon Rojo said:

Never understood the obsession with pandering for new stadiums. Most of them are soulless bland flatpacks totally lacking character.

There appears to be a bandwagon that continually slams Castlefords Wheldon Road ground? I'd much sooner watch a game there than some of the legoland jobs that flood the market.

I miss the old places such as Central Park, Knowsley Road & Wilderspool, even the more quirky settings such as The Willows & The Boulevard were much better for atmosphere and the true spirit of our game.

Sadly Wakefield never had a ground to qualify for this nostalgic status. The viewing is appalling and the best thing to say about the cramped main stand is that at least it's got a roof. Don't get me going about the block of flats behind the posts 🤪

Be great if we could've kept all the old grounds and had a whip round to build a proper one for Trinity 👍🏉

I posted a thread a while back about whether people would prefer their teams ground to be total new builds or gradual redevelopments. The whole new builds are often the most cost effective for clubs and as we've seen has been the route the majority of clubs have gone down - holding out for a new build as Cas and Wakey have done has been part of that too.

Central Park is the major loss imo - as Wigan have gone from owning and being sole occupiers of their own ground to tennants with minimal assets. Fartown is a smaller but similar example.

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Two major problems I can think of re the Cas ground;

1) They spend a good deal of their limited income merely maintaining a grossly sub standard ground that wasn't fit for premier sport back in 1970.

2) They cant generate much non match day income from the ground as they simply dont have the facilities,so they have little or no chance of challenging the bigger clubs. In a decent ground,capable of generating additional match day and mon match day revenue,there is no reason why Castleford couldn't regularly challenge Warrington and St. Helens.

The image the ground portrays to broadcasters and potential major sponsors,is truely shambolic.

 

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1 hour ago, Ramon Rojo said:

Never understood the obsession with pandering for new stadiums. Most of them are soulless bland flatpacks totally lacking character.

There appears to be a bandwagon that continually slams Castlefords Wheldon Road ground? I'd much sooner watch a game there than some of the legoland jobs that flood the market.

I miss the old places such as Central Park, Knowsley Road & Wilderspool, even the more quirky settings such as The Willows & The Boulevard were much better for atmosphere and the true spirit of our game.

Sadly Wakefield never had a ground to qualify for this nostalgic status. The viewing is appalling and the best thing to say about the cramped main stand is that at least it's got a roof. Don't get me going about the block of flats behind the posts 🤪

Be great if we could've kept all the old grounds and had a whip round to build a proper one for Trinity 👍🏉

I miss Knowsley Road as much as any Saints fan and evenings on that terrace watching big games with players like Long, Cunningham and the like are great memories, the place wasn’t fit for purpose anymore and Rugby League clubs are businesses that need to generate income 365 days a year, or as close to that number as possible, and The E-Cig Arena offers that possibility while also offering attendees far better facilities than Knowsley Road could. 

 

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5 hours ago, cookey said:

Two major problems I can think of re the Cas ground;

1) They spend a good deal of their limited income merely maintaining a grossly sub standard ground that wasn't fit for premier sport back in 1970.

2) They cant generate much non match day income from the ground as they simply dont have the facilities,so they have little or no chance of challenging the bigger clubs. In a decent ground,capable of generating additional match day and mon match day revenue,there is no reason why Castleford couldn't regularly challenge Warrington and St. Helens.

The image the ground portrays to broadcasters and potential major sponsors,is truely shambolic.

 

Also I seem to remember reading that the pitch technically isn't long enough to meet SL standards, which begs the question as to why nothing's been done about this one way or the other if true. Also on the pitch front, I'm with Sweaty Craig about artificial pitches, but I suspect that that battle's long lost.

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On 09/03/2021 at 08:53, Wholly Trinity said:

Previous projects were always 100% dependent on a third party providing a new stadium. The club couldn't (and didn't) promise anything as they were not in control of any aspect. For the Newmarket project, the club were not involved at all except for agreeing to be anchor tenants in a community stadium.

I'm sure it's a complete coincidence that real progress only took place when the council leader (Cas fan and shareholder) stepped down. 

Thank you very much for the information and the considered view. It's pot luck who get's almost gifted a stadium and who may struggle in the face of resistance or lack of finance. Not fair to bash Wakey who were IIRC cheated at Newmarket and told by the council they could not help Wakey and not equally help Cas (did you see this as fair or unfair, I can't tell from your post?).

I think it will be brilliant to have another modern stadia in SL and I think it will boost gates which seems to have happened at other clubs who have got modern facilities?. Look forward to it..... 

 

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6 hours ago, steve oates said:

Thank you very much for the information and the considered view. It's pot luck who get's almost gifted a stadium and who may struggle in the face of resistance or lack of finance. Not fair to bash Wakey who were IIRC cheated at Newmarket and told by the council they could not help Wakey and not equally help Cas (did you see this as fair or unfair, I can't tell from your post?).

I think it will be brilliant to have another modern stadia in SL and I think it will boost gates which seems to have happened at other clubs who have got modern facilities?. Look forward to it..... 

 

The land proposed for Castleford's new ground is full of gypsy caravans at the moment.

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On 10/03/2021 at 10:02, cookey said:

Two major problems I can think of re the Cas ground;

1) They spend a good deal of their limited income merely maintaining a grossly sub standard ground that wasn't fit for premier sport back in 1970.

2) They cant generate much non match day income from the ground as they simply dont have the facilities,so they have little or no chance of challenging the bigger clubs. In a decent ground,capable of generating additional match day and mon match day revenue,there is no reason why Castleford couldn't regularly challenge Warrington and St. Helens.

The image the ground portrays to broadcasters and potential major sponsors,is truely shambolic.

 

You know what I bet nobody's thought of that - I'll suggest a new stadium to the club

Now then, it's a race between Sandie....and Fairburn....and the little man is in........yeees he's in.

I, just like those Castleford supporters felt that the ball should have gone to David Plange but he put the bit betwen his teeth...and it was a try

Kevin Ward - best player I have ever seen

DSC04156_edited-1_thumb.jpg

The real Mick Gledhill is what you see on here, a Bradford fan ........, but deep down knows that Bradford are just not good enough to challenge the likes of Leeds & St Helens.
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2 minutes ago, Kenilworth Tiger said:

You know what I bet nobody's thought of that - I'll suggest a new stadium to the club

Well in fairness the club hasn't done anything about it, they've held onto repeated wishes for a flatpack ground that haven't materialised and let the current ground decay (the taped off section of terrace in the railway end for example).

Either Cas turn around and say "Wheldon Road is beyond reprieve, we have to move" or they start doing up that ground as best they can. The temporary stuff Leeds had when the North stand was being rebuilt surely isn't beyond reasonably achievable?

Waiting for a hero to come along with a new ground is not an excuse for a continuous and extended period of under investment.

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1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

Well in fairness the club hasn't done anything about it, they've held onto repeated wishes for a flatpack ground that haven't materialised and let the current ground decay (the taped off section of terrace in the railway end for example).

Either Cas turn around and say "Wheldon Road is beyond reprieve, we have to move" or they start doing up that ground as best they can. The temporary stuff Leeds had when the North stand was being rebuilt surely isn't beyond reasonably achievable?

Waiting for a hero to come along with a new ground is not an excuse for a continuous and extended period of under investment.

 

Perhaps Salford, Wigan, Huddersfield or Hull could tell Cas exactly what to do in order to raise funds and get a shiny new stadium like they did

Now then, it's a race between Sandie....and Fairburn....and the little man is in........yeees he's in.

I, just like those Castleford supporters felt that the ball should have gone to David Plange but he put the bit betwen his teeth...and it was a try

Kevin Ward - best player I have ever seen

DSC04156_edited-1_thumb.jpg

The real Mick Gledhill is what you see on here, a Bradford fan ........, but deep down knows that Bradford are just not good enough to challenge the likes of Leeds & St Helens.
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Anyway - this is a Wakey thread

 

Good luck to 'em!

Now then, it's a race between Sandie....and Fairburn....and the little man is in........yeees he's in.

I, just like those Castleford supporters felt that the ball should have gone to David Plange but he put the bit betwen his teeth...and it was a try

Kevin Ward - best player I have ever seen

DSC04156_edited-1_thumb.jpg

The real Mick Gledhill is what you see on here, a Bradford fan ........, but deep down knows that Bradford are just not good enough to challenge the likes of Leeds & St Helens.
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