Match Thread: Challenge Cup Third Round, Featherstone Rovers v Hull Saturday-10th-April-2021

[RobLambert]

42 minutes ago, gazza77 said:

I suggested that last week, and got shot down in flames.

Still disagree but I bet you loved it when the hit the post.  (The only real sitter he's missed imo). He had a shocker all round so when do you drop him ?

[RobLambert]

2 hours ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

It's really not!

Collateral form is not really a guide of course but I'm making the point that Salford are nowhere near as good as Hull at the moment.

So given tonights result can we beat Salford - I'm confused

[gazza77]

14 minutes ago, RobLambert said:

Still disagree but I bet you loved it when the hit the post.  (The only real sitter he's missed imo). He had a shocker all round so when do you drop him ?

Strangely, I "love it" when we play well. 

To answer your question, I'd have had Chizzy goal kicking from the outset tonight. After poor performances from Hall in each game I've seen this season however, I'd also be starting with Whitton at fullback next week. 

[haskey]

So you would drop Hall on one bad performance----- would you ???

[gazza77]

1 minute ago, haskey said:

So you would drop Hall on one bad performance----- would you ???

No. I'd drop him for what, in my opinion, has been poor form all season. 

[The Phantom Horseman]

1 hour ago, POR said:

I agree but would suggest on their  performance widnes are nowhere near as good as FEV at the moment.

That I agree with. Salford posed little threat to Hull but scored 68 against Widnes, albeit Widnes were missing a number of starters. 

[The Phantom Horseman]

59 minutes ago, RobLambert said:

So given tonights result can we beat Salford - I'm confused

I doubt it but we'd have a better chance against them than against Hull. 

[RobLambert]

1 hour ago, gazza77 said:

Strangely, I "love it" when we play well. 

To answer your question, I'd have had Chizzy goal kicking from the outset tonight. After poor performances from Hall in each game I've seen this season however, I'd also be starting with Whitton at fullback next week. 

Wow

[RobLambert]

2 hours ago, gazza77 said:

No. I'd drop him for what, in my opinion, has been poor form all season. 

I take it you're excluding his man of the match performance v Bradford in that analysis.  Personally I don't think it would be too over the top to have Day castrated for dropping that pass early doors.

[sentoffagain2]

12 hours ago, gazza77 said:

Strangely, I "love it" when we play well. 

To answer your question, I'd have had Chizzy goal kicking from the outset tonight. After poor performances from Hall in each game I've seen this season however, I'd also be starting with Whitton at fullback next week. 

  I think you are right.Hall has had three average to poor games and his goal kicking not up to scratch,let Chissy take them.We did play well in the second half but HullFC took theirr foot off the gas knowing the game was won in the first half.And they played without their first choice half backs which does make a difference.Hull FC  will beat S.L.  teams by more than 20 this season so we do need to recognise the effort our lads put in .

[lingaro]

Day lloked to getting his timing right when entering collision, glimpses of his best. 

I was pleasantly suprised by the second half, the team showed lots of character and finally got into a rhythm, which has been lacking all season. 

Best game I've seen Childs ref. 

[Rarefrith]

When we getting those floodlights sorted? Seen better at high school pitches etc. 

[wasginger]

1 hour ago, Rarefrith said:

When we getting those floodlights sorted? Seen better at high school pitches etc. 

All contributions will be greatly appreciated. i admit they're not good, but with what's gone on this past year, I'm sure money was required elsewhere.

[Steve Slater]

The ball retention wasn't good, especially in the first half, and too many missed tackles, but yesterday proved that this side can score against anyone.

[Steve Slater]

I slipped up with the bookies, I had a fiver on Parata to score the last try at 33/1, which by judging on previous games seemed a good value bet as he always came off the bench and played until the end. So what happens? Webbo has him starting for the first time instead!

I should have taken notice of the signs from the Missus - She backed the winner of the Grand National because of the jockey - A woman called Blackmore.

[The Phantom Horseman]

Watched the game back last night. It was a lot easier watching the first half when you know what the limitation of the damage was, compared with watching it live when you were thinking, crikey, Hull are going put 70 or 80 on us aren't they?

They were just too direct and strong for us in the first half - winning the collisions, playing the ball and over the gain line in a flash, and too big to prevent offloads or landing on their front foot. The slope always accentuates this kind of advantage too.

We actually defended manfully for the main part considering how overwhelmed we were, four of their six tries came on the last tackle, one was a fortunate rebound from a kick and the other was a gift following an error from Hall. Didn't help that Connor was in great kicking form too.

It's hard to quantify how much Hull "took their foot off the gas" in the second half, but we were clearly much improved and it didn't look anything like the mismatch of the first half. I'm sure I wasn't the only one who thought that with a 34-4 half time score we were staring down the barrel of a huge scoreline such as the ones we suffered in a number of the Middle 8s games so we deserve some credit, as must our conditioner Greg Stebbings, nilling a good, full-time SL team in the 2nd half is no mean feat.

Hall's taken a lot of criticism and in fairness he did have a shocker. Talk of dropping him is another matter though in my view, at this stage anyway. I wouldn't drop him any more than I'd drop Gaz Gale who was tackled into touch twice, or Brad Day, who has dropped more passes in half a dozen games this year than in the whole of his first season here, you pick the best players at their positions and for now at least I still think Hall's our best option at full back. Whether he should retain the goalkicking job I'm not so sure, he was brilliant last year but hasn't been hitting it as well this year.

If there is a discussion about someone losing their place it's at least as viable to discuss Chisholm, who was taken off after some very weak defensive efforts at a time when his team mates were putting their bodies on the line. He did play very well when he came back on so I'd probably still start him, but I don't think it's out of the question that his place could come under pressure with Holmes and Brown both high quality options at half back.

Parata has been a revelation this year and there can't be many of us who don't think he's been our best 9 so far. The question really is when to play him, he was great starting on Saturday but if he's going to share the hooking role with Jones or Brown I'd probably rather he came on after say 25 mins and played 15 mins and then 30 mins in the 2nd half with his breather coming at half time.

Welham and Moors haven't really lit it up yet, I thought Welham was at fault for one of Hull's tries and with Hardcastle playing well and Minns waiting in the wings I don't think his place should be guaranteed either. Moors looks like he's steadily finding his way to full fitness and should play a more influential role as the season progresses.

Harrison and Halton were both terrific, Harrison plays huge minutes every week without his impact dropping off, and Halton went surprisingly well playing middle rather than on the edge, he's already looking a really good signing. Rightly or wrongly, I think Ferres will be playing left edge back row - for me he's been steady but again I don't think his place should be beyond question - but Halton looks to have booked his place in our best 17 as he can clearly cover 2 positions if he's on the bench.

Have seen a few people on social media gunning for Webster already (after his first competitive defeat!), in fairness I can't remember the last Fev coach who didn't have people moaning about him from an early stage. There are a lot of fond reminiscences about the Ryan Carr year in 2019 but people forget we got stuffed at home by both Dewsbury and Barrow under Carr, we only really hit form in the play-offs and as long as we reach them that will be the crucial time again this year.

 

[lingaro]

Another pivot at loose forward for me when defences are tiring. 

[marklaspalmas]

6 hours ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

Watched the game back last night. It was a lot easier watching the first half when you know what the limitation of the damage was, compared with watching it live when you were thinking, crikey, Hull are going put 70 or 80 on us aren't they?

They were just too direct and strong for us in the first half - winning the collisions, playing the ball and over the gain line in a flash, and too big to prevent offloads or landing on their front foot. The slope always accentuates this kind of advantage too.

We actually defended manfully for the main part considering how overwhelmed we were, four of their six tries came on the last tackle, one was a fortunate rebound from a kick and the other was a gift following an error from Hall. Didn't help that Connor was in great kicking form too.

It's hard to quantify how much Hull "took their foot off the gas" in the second half, but we were clearly much improved and it didn't look anything like the mismatch of the first half. I'm sure I wasn't the only one who thought that with a 34-4 half time score we were staring down the barrel of a huge scoreline such as the ones we suffered in a number of the Middle 8s games so we deserve some credit, as must our conditioner Greg Stebbings, nilling a good, full-time SL team in the 2nd half is no mean feat.

Hall's taken a lot of criticism and in fairness he did have a shocker. Talk of dropping him is another matter though in my view, at this stage anyway. I wouldn't drop him any more than I'd drop Gaz Gale who was tackled into touch twice, or Brad Day, who has dropped more passes in half a dozen games this year than in the whole of his first season here, you pick the best players at their positions and for now at least I still think Hall's our best option at full back. Whether he should retain the goalkicking job I'm not so sure, he was brilliant last year but hasn't been hitting it as well this year.

If there is a discussion about someone losing their place it's at least as viable to discuss Chisholm, who was taken off after some very weak defensive efforts at a time when his team mates were putting their bodies on the line. He did play very well when he came back on so I'd probably still start him, but I don't think it's out of the question that his place could come under pressure with Holmes and Brown both high quality options at half back.

Parata has been a revelation this year and there can't be many of us who don't think he's been our best 9 so far. The question really is when to play him, he was great starting on Saturday but if he's going to share the hooking role with Jones or Brown I'd probably rather he came on after say 25 mins and played 15 mins and then 30 mins in the 2nd half with his breather coming at half time.

Welham and Moors haven't really lit it up yet, I thought Welham was at fault for one of Hull's tries and with Hardcastle playing well and Minns waiting in the wings I don't think his place should be guaranteed either. Moors looks like he's steadily finding his way to full fitness and should play a more influential role as the season progresses.

Harrison and Halton were both terrific, Harrison plays huge minutes every week without his impact dropping off, and Halton went surprisingly well playing middle rather than on the edge, he's already looking a really good signing. Rightly or wrongly, I think Ferres will be playing left edge back row - for me he's been steady but again I don't think his place should be beyond question - but Halton looks to have booked his place in our best 17 as he can clearly cover 2 positions if he's on the bench.

Have seen a few people on social media gunning for Webster already (after his first competitive defeat!), in fairness I can't remember the last Fev coach who didn't have people moaning about him from an early stage. There are a lot of fond reminiscences about the Ryan Carr year in 2019 but people forget we got stuffed at home by both Dewsbury and Barrow under Carr, we only really hit form in the play-offs and as long as we reach them that will be the crucial time again this year.

 

As you say, very difficult to judge to what extent our second half revival was due to Hull adopting a 'job-done' mentality. Either way, it made for better watching and was a positive to take from the game.

I'm not worried that Hall, Day, Chizz and Gale will continue to make the same errors in the future, and if they do, they are unlikely to be as ruthlessly punished as they were by Hull.

Impressed with Halton as a middle forward. Good game.

Moors shows signs of his strength and impact. We can hope for more.

Welham quiet so far.

Brown was interesting as I thought he did ok off the bench. Holmes was understandably quiet, and Brown looked ok, although he's not a middle defender for mine.

Lockwood, Ferguson, and above all Kopczak will make us a different team up front on Sunday.

Ill be interested to see where Minns and Jones fit in.

[tms]

now the dust has settled it makes me laugh when there's all the talk about hull taking their foot off the gas and hull having a 'job-done' mentality. rugby league doesn't work like that every player who crosses the white wash wants to score a try and Hull  were ho different in  that second half they all  would have loved to put more points past us and finish up in the 70's but by hook or by crook FEV stopped them and should be applauded for their second half performance

[marklaspalmas]

5 minutes ago, POR said:

now the dust has settled it makes me laugh when there's all the talk about hull taking their foot off the gas and hull having a 'job-done' mentality. rugby league doesn't work like that every player who crosses the white wash wants to score a try and Hull  were ho different in  that second half they all  would have loved to put more points past us and finish up in the 70's but by hook or by crook FEV stopped them and should be applauded for their second half performance

Yes and no. They are human beings, and their desperation to win the game mentally and psychologically may not not there if they are leading comfortably. However, it may. We don't know. But the second half has to be judged in context.

FWIW I thought we played much better and things felt much more positive on 80 minutes than 40 minutes. Hull, for whatever season, made many more mistakes in the second half than the first.

[tms]

2 minutes ago, marklaspalmas said:

Yes and no. They are human beings, and their desperation to win the game mentally and psychologically may not not there if they are leading comfortably. However, it may. We don't know. But the second half has to be judged in context.

FWIW I thought we played much better and things felt much more positive on 80 minutes than 40 minutes. Hull, for whatever season, made many more mistakes in the second half than the first.

possible but I think  if you are leading comfortably at half time you know you have won  you still want to rub their noses in it and show the opposition how good you are in the 2nd 

 If you haven't scored in the first half you desperately want to score in the second especially against a team that appears to be falling off tackles and more importantly if scoring tries is not your forte I would be surprised if Hull didn't come out with the idea of putting FEV to the sword in the second half

[The Phantom Horseman]

19 minutes ago, POR said:

now the dust has settled it makes me laugh when there's all the talk about hull taking their foot off the gas and hull having a 'job-done' mentality. rugby league doesn't work like that

Of course it does sometimes, we've all seen games where Fev and other teams are totally up for it and have a tremendous attitude and others where the effort isn't quite 100%, indeed we saw one of our players subbed on Saturday for this very reason.

Of course pro and semi-pro players can't go on the field with a lackadaisical attitude in such a fierce contact sport and Hull would have still wanted to score more points and defend their line in the second half but that extra 1% urgency and also concentration can make a big difference.

As I said, it's hard to quantify how much  Hull "took their foot off the gas" because there were so many other variables - Fev probably getting a roasting at half time and just playing better in the 2nd half, Fev going downhill 2nd half etc. But to me Hull didn't have quite the same intensity as they did in the first half, which isn't at all to detract from a much-improved 2nd half effort from us.

[The Phantom Horseman]

One interesting thing about Challenge Cup games is that we get the individual stats that SL teams get all year.
https://www.rugby-league.com/match_report/134215

Great work from Harrison making 41 tackles with only 2 misses and also the most yardage amongst the forwards with 113 yards on 19 carries. Hardcastle led the way in yardage gained with 153 on 17 carries though interestingly they had him down as making the same number of errors as Hall (3), I guess they weren't quite such crucial ones. Ferres had the most missed tackles with 7.

[marklaspalmas]

5 hours ago, POR said:

possible but I think  if you are leading comfortably at half time you know you have won  you still want to rub their noses in it and show the opposition how good you are in the 2nd 

 If you haven't scored in the first half you desperately want to score in the second especially against a team that appears to be falling off tackles and more importantly if scoring tries is not your forte I would be surprised if Hull didn't come out with the idea of putting FEV to the sword in the second half

Agreed

[RobLambert]

14 hours ago, POR said:

possible but I think  if you are leading comfortably at half time you know you have won  you still want to rub their noses in it and show the opposition how good you are in the 2nd 

 If you haven't scored in the first half you desperately want to score in the second especially against a team that appears to be falling off tackles and more importantly if scoring tries is not your forte I would be surprised if Hull didn't come out with the idea of putting FEV to the sword in the second half

Salford didn't take their foot off the gas against Widnes.  Most of their 68 points were scored in the last quarter.