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Putting Leigh in SL is the biggest mistake RL ever made (Merged threads)


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7 hours ago, Scubby said:

Toulouse will hopefully get promoted on the back of a winning season which also helps selling tickets and corporates for their first season in the big time. I have no problem with Leigh being promoted, they were willing to step up.

Once Toulouse and Catalans are both in SL however, there should be exemption from relegation for both clubs indefinitely. If you want to relegate a French club then you have to have another French club willing to take their place. We have just got to cut this #### out. The Championship is a penniless pit of teams that has survived on handouts and duel registration for years and years. It doesn't have enough organic vibrancy to have Anglo-French representation. We need to move on from this. 

Organic vibrancy 😂

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3 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

I can't quite remember the timeline but when was it announced that "Team 12" would receive less TV money? Before or after applications opened

Before. Teams knew the terms they were applying under.

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5 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Doesn't make it right though, sort of Hobdons choice. 

I never said it did and I have always said I don't agree with it. Teams did know what they were signing up for though, they didn't need to apply. It would have been interesting if all clubs had stuck together and refused to apply under the condition of less money.

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Just now, Damien said:

I never said it did and I have always said I don't agree with it. Teams did know what they were signing up for though, they didn't need to apply. It would have been interesting if all clubs had stuck together and refused to apply under the condition of less money.

Fair point. 

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3 minutes ago, Damien said:

I never said it did and I have always said I don't agree with it. Teams did know what they were signing up for though, they didn't need to apply. It would have been interesting if all clubs had stuck together and refused to apply under the condition of less money.

Less money or full money makes no difference if there's nobody to sign 

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CALM DOWN EVERYONE.

 

It is well know on this forum that I am pro Toulouse and French Rugby League, however with the pandemic far from over putting Toulouse in SL this season would not have had the lift that any expansionist would have wanted.

Leigh was a sensible option and if they go down and Toulouse go up (Or anyone else thats life:)

 

Paul

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There is going to be a lot of upset people when Fev replace Leigh at the end of this season and Leigh likely go back up the year after. Degsy might be a person who I hold in very low esteem but I don't think he is a total fool and would have planned that relegation would be likely this season and from the squad put together you would imagine they will make a healthy profit this year ready to build on the next couple of years.

Most SL teams are in such bad shape they are essentially bankrupt without the sky money, its such a shame the top league of such a great sport is such a mess but while the teams make the decisions all we will have is self preservation.

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I don't agree it's the biggest mistake that SL ever made

For the likes of Salford and Wakefield it's the best possible decision as it lets them avoid relegation for another season. 

It looks like Featherstone could well be next seasons cannon fodder, probably replaced by Leigh again in 2023...

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1 hour ago, ShropshireBull said:

Thats where a 14 SL comes in.  Loop fixtures gone but both French teams have a third game Magic weekend they take on the road. 

Removing the loop fixtures should be core aim for the authorities because they fundamentally undermine the competion.

However, it difficult to justify 14 teams in terms of playing quality. Are there really enough players to populate more top grade teams ? The evidence would suggest that there is a competitive Top 8 and a competitive Next 8 [where an additional 2 teams could be added without completely compromising the divsion]

Which leaves a 18 team comp.

Top 8 play each other home and away + the Next 10 once

The Next 10 play each other home and away + the Top 8 once

Looping back to the subject of the topic ...

Leigh & Toulouse get to play in the Next 10 ... with teams & clubs of similar strength, building towards the Top 8 .. while also playing super meanigful league derby's and big games against the likes of Wigan / Saints etc and of course Catalan

 

 

 

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12 minutes ago, paulwalker71 said:

I don't agree it's the biggest mistake that SL ever made

For the likes of Salford and Wakefield it's the best possible decision as it lets them avoid relegation for another season. 

It looks like Featherstone could well be next seasons cannon fodder, probably replaced by Leigh again in 2023...

Nail on the head. Just to make sure let them in without the full funding as well. 🤣

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4 minutes ago, JT RL said:

Removing the loop fixtures should be core aim for the authorities because they fundamentally undermine the competion.

However, it difficult to justify 14 teams in terms of playing quality. Are there really enough players to populate more top grade teams ? The evidence would suggest that there is a competitive Top 8 and a competitive Next 8 [where an additional 2 teams could be added without completely compromising the divsion]

 

 

 

I think adding more clubs to SL at the moment just spreads the player pool more thinly. 

Clubs like Newcastle can hopefully be added in the future as they might have 25+ community clubs feeding into their youth system which opens up a new source of players and allows them to be competitive rather than just signing players and juniors from the same pot as everyone else

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22 minutes ago, paulwalker71 said:

I don't agree it's the biggest mistake that SL ever made

For the likes of Salford and Wakefield it's the best possible decision as it lets them avoid relegation for another season. 

It looks like Featherstone could well be next seasons cannon fodder, probably replaced by Leigh again in 2023...

Toulouse have won 26 of their last 33 Championship games yet people conveniently keep it local. There's no dual reg anymore propping up some also rans, Toulouse must be clear favourites.

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33 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

Going to 14 is based on the new clubs that come in having the commercial firepower to attract enough money to bring in players. If that means pinching a few half backs from the other code then the player pool is there. 

The problem is that no matter how much money they have they'll still be signing existing players that already play in SL so it just spreads the quality more thinly. I think any extra clubs and also existing clubs need to be actively looking to expand the junior game which is why I mentioned Newcastle as they've got the North East to themselves

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3 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

Friday or Saturday night it would be at least 80% full,  mínimum. Thats over 15000 for a game of RL in France.  I think you might get a few from Carcassone who want to witness a bit of French RL history too. 

Why do they get less than 1,000 for a play off game vs Fev then? Serious question btw, I don’t know where these fans are coming from. 

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3 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

The same place they emerge from when Wigan play Saints at home.  Not saying Toulouse are going to get that every game but I certainly think it becomes the game that Toulouse sports fans pencil in their diary every year. 

 

It’s the third ticket in town in Toulouse, at best. Wigan get 18,000 at home to Saints because they’re a few miles apart and it’s a century plus old rivalry between two of the three biggest clubs in the country. To assume TO v CD would do the same is just fantasy. 

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50 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

Going to 14 is based on the new clubs that come in having the commercial firepower to attract enough money to bring in players. If that means pinching a few half backs from the other code then the player pool is there. 

The player pool simply isn’t there and the idea we can just “pinch players from the other code” really exacerbates this. 

Fourteen sounds like a good idea. In principal, it is. However, in reality, it’s far from that. Issues around the player pool, the quality of stadia, the development pathway, the commercial aspects around adding clubs, the funding available to clubs and TV negotiations are still there, they’re not going to be magically solved by placing two clubs in, whether those clubs are slightly more exotic than places you see only on signs on the M62 or whether they’re former pit towns whose halcyon days as rugby clubs were in the 70’s or 80’s. 

I don’t disagree that fourteen is a good number. However, with a plan that’s nothing more than “let’s just promote two teams and just carry on as normal” as was the case last time we went to fourteen (and in Rugby League fashion, would likely be the case again), it’s simply not going to work. I don’t want to draw too many comparisons to other sports or other leagues as they’re entirely different but it’s noticeable in both the NFL (and other leagues that have grown eg MLB, MLS etc) and the NRL, that while certain clubs or cities may well be good places for that respective league or sport, they can’t, and don’t, just drop these clubs into their competitions prematurely. “Brisbane 2” has been spoke about for a few years now, as has London in the NFL but neither have just been dropped into the NRL or NFL under-prepared (as Super League and Rugby League have done with nearly every ‘new’ team in the modern era). 

While extending Super League sounds good, I think it’s a long term project where the first objectives should be critiquing our own members rather than critiquing other clubs wanting to join the fold, “get your own house in order” as the old saying goes. 

 

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19 minutes ago, Eddie said:

It’s the third ticket in town in Toulouse, at best. Wigan get 18,000 at home to Saints because they’re a few miles apart and it’s a century plus old rivalry between two of the three biggest clubs in the country. To assume TO v CD would do the same is just fantasy. 

You have seen the video on the previous page with 13k+ for a Catalans game in Toulouse from a few years ago? 

They used to play in a tiny stadium in the middle of nowhere. They have just signed a 10 year deal to play at the 19k Wallon stadium which is used by Stade Toulousain. They had planned a double header with Catalans last May at EW before Covid.

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37 minutes ago, Scubby said:

Toulouse got 6400 for a league game against Toronto in 2019 at EW

Ok, so why does that make anyone think they’d get 3x that for a game versus Catalans? The equivalent is like saying if Sheffield Eagles played Wigan or Leeds at Bramall Lane they’d get 19,000 there - they wouldn’t. 

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39 minutes ago, Scubby said:

You have seen the video on the previous page with 13k+ for a Catalans game in Toulouse from a few years ago? 

They used to play in a tiny stadium in the middle of nowhere. They have just signed a 10 year deal to play at the 19k Wallon stadium which is used by Stade Toulousain. They had planned a double header with Catalans last May at EW before Covid.

What sort of crowds were they getting at the Wallon for the few games they played there before Covid stopped play last season? 

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14 minutes ago, Eddie said:

What sort of crowds were they getting at the Wallon for the few games they played there before Covid stopped play last season? 

According to Wiki (which admittedly suggests the York game was at Blagnac which I don’t think was the case)

3,151 v York

2,318 v Oldham

Nothing listed for the game against Batley

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