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Putting Leigh in SL is the biggest mistake RL ever made (Merged threads)


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4 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

There is no issue around stadia.  York Newcastle Toulouse Fev even Broncos have stadia better than several SL clubs. 

Last time Newcastle and Toulouse werent knocking on the Door with academies and commercial opportunities. 

Keeping SL at 12 exists for no logical reason.  

Keeping Super League at 12 exists for no logical reason, however, with a proper plan, a long-term strategy to implement greater minimum standards and eventually growth to 14, Super League would be in a greater position. It cannot be implemented overnight again, it’ll be doing exactly the same as we’ve done before and unsurprisingly, we’ll end with the same outcome. 

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13 hours ago, The Daddy said:

I just want to understand the logic for putting Leigh in SL coz I still don't understand. 

Toulouse has just signed a 9 year deal with Stade Toulousain that not just allows them to play at the iconic ground but gives them a major presence at the complex. In addition to that they now have backing from the various local authorities which in France is significant. With the partnerships they have in place  I'm confident in saying that over the next few years Toulouse will quickly become one of the biggest clubs in Europe.

The commercial partnerships that Toulouse have are on a different scale to Leigh's and it gives the RL exposure to the 4th biggest city in France that has a population in the  metropolitan area of over 1.3 million, plus many more across the South West region. It would have increased the competition's presence in France and the number of professional players which allows the France national team to become more and more competitive and create a natural rival for England on its doorstep, that has so many commercial benefits in itself to UK RL. 

We were told over and over that they had an 'oven baked squad' ready to compete. If that's the case why are they now loaning a player from another SL club? On paper, their squad wasn't any better than Toulouse's and they finished below them in the league table in recent seasons.

Apparently the bids were assessed by an 'independent panel of experts' yet there has been no explanation into the reasoning behind the decision. 

To top it all off the majority of people in this country don't even know where Leigh is and thought that the parish of Leigh-on-Sea in Essex had entered a team into SL.

It was a terrible decision which says so much about the mindset of people running the sport here. It's several months on and I'm still disgusted 

Does Toulouse have a train station?

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11 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

Keeping Super League at 12 exists for no logical reason, however, with a proper plan, a long-term strategy to implement greater minimum standards and eventually growth to 14, Super League would be in a greater position. It cannot be implemented overnight again, it’ll be doing exactly the same as we’ve done before and unsurprisingly, we’ll end with the same outcome. 

The logicsl reason is that the pie is cut into bigger pieces

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20 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

There is no issue around stadia.  York Newcastle Toulouse Fev even Broncos have stadia better than several SL clubs. 

Last time Newcastle and Toulouse werent knocking on the Door with academies and commercial opportunities. 

Keeping SL at 12 exists for no logical reason.  

Keep at 12 for financial reasons.

Truth be told theres a few SL clubs that shouldnt be in there and a 12 team league with stronger clubs in would be better

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2 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

No because the teams who would be involved are different.  Toulouse and Newcastle are both running academy systems and the commercial opportunities would be there to get part time playes who are good enough to movefull time.  Plus with a reduced TV deal I dont think RL can wait.  We need to strike soon. 

That’s the sort of thinking that’s seen the game in a place where it’s currently at. You’re relying heavily on Toulouse and Newcastle being some form of metaphorical “golden goose”, completely ignoring the various issues the game has, hoping they’ll mysteriously vanish or sort themselves out, without their being any plan or strategy to address these issues and pinning your hopes on these clubs somehow growing the sport on and off the pitch, again, without any plan or strategy. 

If Ken Davy announced Toulouse and Newcastle right now for 2022, Super League clubs would still have issues around it for the following areas;

- Stadia. 
- Declining crowds. 
- Player Pathway. 
- Player Pool. 
- Commercially. 
- Central Funding. 
- TV negotiations.

Toulouse and Newcastle may have their club in order in some of those areas, that’s great but overall, not enough clubs in Super League presently do, so brushing that under the carpet and placing ill prepared clubs into Super League doesn’t actually help solve anything.

Without Super League getting its house in order first, any change to 14 would be as unsuccessful as the last time we expanded the league. 14 is a pipe dream. We don’t have 12 strong enough clubs for Super League, expanding would mean we’d have fewer strong clubs and would create more issues than it solves. We have 14 professional clubs at present (of which Newcastle isn’t one). Of the two outside Super League, one of them is unlikely to play a home game this year and the other is haemorrhaging the few fans it does have to move into a stadium that based off the projections we’re seeing, is unsustainable, at best. 

14 is the long term aim. Or at least should be. Getting our ducks in order should be the short to medium term aims. 

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16 minutes ago, Hela Wigmen said:

That’s the sort of thinking that’s seen the game in a place where it’s currently at. You’re relying heavily on Toulouse and Newcastle being some form of metaphorical “golden goose”, completely ignoring the various issues the game has, hoping they’ll mysteriously vanish or sort themselves out, without their being any plan or strategy to address these issues and pinning your hopes on these clubs somehow growing the sport on and off the pitch, again, without any plan or strategy. 

If Ken Davy announced Toulouse and Newcastle right now for 2022, Super League clubs would still have issues around it for the following areas;

- Stadia. 
- Declining crowds. 
- Player Pathway. 
- Player Pool. 
- Commercially. 
- Central Funding. 
- TV negotiations.

Toulouse and Newcastle may have their club in order in some of those areas, that’s great but overall, not enough clubs in Super League presently do, so brushing that under the carpet and placing ill prepared clubs into Super League doesn’t actually help solve anything.

Without Super League getting its house in order first, any change to 14 would be as unsuccessful as the last time we expanded the league. 14 is a pipe dream. We don’t have 12 strong enough clubs for Super League, expanding would mean we’d have fewer strong clubs and would create more issues than it solves. We have 14 professional clubs at present (of which Newcastle isn’t one). Of the two outside Super League, one of them is unlikely to play a home game this year and the other is haemorrhaging the few fans it does have to move into a stadium that based off the projections we’re seeing, is unsustainable, at best. 

14 is the long term aim. Or at least should be. Getting our ducks in order should be the short to medium term aims. 

Your points a contradiction,

Newcastle and Toulouse improve Stadia, improves dwindling attendances, improves player pathways with 2 new academys, Toulouse even have a second string in the french league, Commecial improves as new areas therefore new sponsors spread across tge 12 teams, cenreal funding is an odd one, should this be shared from internationals, if so regular inrernationals with france would increase the central pot of both govening bodies. TV negotiations.. Well 2 french clubs would mean a free stream / production every week from France instead of every other week, thus making us more attractive to sky, not to mention the potential of increased interest within France

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1 hour ago, Eddie said:

What sort of crowds were they getting at the Wallon for the few games they played there before Covid stopped play last season? 

in the Championship. Again, Catalans got 13k there a few years ago. For top division rugby. Please do read the thread before commenting.

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7 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

So my comment about players from the other code gets ignored then. 

A couple of players maybe but two extra clubs requires around 50 players so there's still a lot of extra  players to find

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7 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

No Sheffield vs Wigan isnt even close to a legitimate comparison.  Toulouse vs Catalán would be a rivalry game massively promoted.  It's the Saints vs Wigan of French RL. 

 

It’s not though is it, Saints and Wigan are a stones throw apart with 100+ years of history. CD v TO would be a fabricated rivalry, initially at least, it takes years to develop proper rivalries. 

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7 hours ago, egm said:

in the Championship. Again, Catalans got 13k there a few years ago. For top division rugby. Please do read the thread before commenting.

Well Avignon got 14k for a France game against England in 2016, get them in SL they’d sell out every week using your logic. 

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7 hours ago, yipyee said:

Keep at 12 for financial reasons.

Truth be told theres a few SL clubs that shouldnt be in there and a 12 team league with stronger clubs in would be better

They should be in there because they haven’t been relegated ffs. 

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3 minutes ago, Eddie said:

It’s not though is it, Saints and Wigan are a stones throw apart with 100+ years of history. CD v TO would be a fabricated rivalry, initially at least, it takes years to develop proper rivalries. 

Rivalry for over 80 years... 

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20 hours ago, Scubby said:

Toulouse will hopefully get promoted on the back of a winning season which also helps selling tickets and corporates for their first season in the big time. I have no problem with Leigh being promoted, they were willing to step up.

Once Toulouse and Catalans are both in SL however, there should be exemption from relegation for both clubs indefinitely. If you want to relegate a French club then you have to have another French club willing to take their place. We have just got to cut this #### out. The Championship is a penniless pit of teams that has survived on handouts and duel registration for years and years. It doesn't have enough organic vibrancy to have Anglo-French representation. We need to move on from this. 

Never ever can or would I agree (again) that teams playing in the same competition recieving preferential treatment in respect of exemption from relegation. 

There is another excellent thread live at the moment started by Tommygilf re 'Is the season already over some clubs' can you imagine how the competition could be manipulated if teams are not playing by the same rules - I guess you and the 15 or so likes your suggestion received can't.

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20 hours ago, The Daddy said:

Leigh are cannon fodder right now 

Totally agree,

I wonder which player's at Saint's, Wigan, Wire and Hull for example have their wages covered by the difference in the central funding they recieve more than what Leigh get?

The Bronco's recieved full funding 2 years ago and they couldn't stave of relegation, even with 2 fixtures when the eventual champions selected teams with lets say of a benevolent nature.

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2 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Totally agree,

I wonder which player's at Saint's, Wigan, Wire and Hull for example have their wages covered by the difference in the central funding they recieve more than what Leigh get?

The Bronco's recieved full funding 2 years ago and they couldn't stave of relegation, even with 2 fixtures when the eventual champions selected teams with lets say of a benevolent nature.

I don’t know why they (or any team) applied, with such a ridiculously uneven playing field. 

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18 hours ago, Just Browny said:

Put Toppy on ignore, will do you all the world of good.

I harbour no ill will against Leigh who have put their money where their mouth is and stepped up. I also agree that Toulouse wouldn't have worked this year: not because of anything to do with that club, but because of Covid.

So I hope Toulouse's time will come. That said, someone on here got taken to the wrong ground in a taxi a couple of times (just a guess: maybe you gave the taxi driver the wrong address?) so maybe they are not such a big prospect after all.

How hard is it to say Toulouse Olympique to a taxi driver?

If you were going to a theatre you would just give that name not its address, jeez Browny talk about excuses to substansiate an argument, scraping the barrel with that one.

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Just now, Harry Stottle said:

How hard is it to say Toulouse Olympique to a taxi driver?

If you were going to a theatre you would just give that name not its address, jeez Browny talk about excuses to substansiate an argument, scraping the barrel with that one.

I'll bet you a shiny farthing that the taxi driver was asked to go to "the rugby".

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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1 minute ago, gingerjon said:

I'll bet you a shiny farthing that the taxi driver was asked to go to "the rugby".

No , we were all full aware we had to ask for ' Olympic ' Rugby team , total blank faces whenever we asked , even literally a couple of hundred yards from the stadium 

Have you ever been ?

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3 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Have you ever been ?

Nope. But, given that anecdote is not data, your complete failure to convince the locals that you weren't a raving madman is charming but irrelevant.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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14 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

Friday or Saturday night it would be at least 80% full,  mínimum. Thats over 15000 for a game of RL in France.  I think you might get a few from Carcassone who want to witness a bit of French RL history too. 

How good is this crystal ball of yours? no maybe's in your first statement, albeit you do 'think' in terms of the Carcassone public, how long will they keep making the near 200Km round trip?

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