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Putting Leigh in SL is the biggest mistake RL ever made (Merged threads)


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7 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

This thread is better than a monty python sketch. All RL problems can be seen in just a few posts, we still have fools thinking because they are located in a city the crowds and sponsors will come, so let’s kill a few of the foundations to make way for them.

London is a big place and has had a club for 40 years with tens of thousands of RL folk in residence, 20000 gates every week and no need for a philanthropist to fight the wolves off.

Any one who has been to TO knows they have very few fans and are almost unknown in the city, we have been taken to the wrong ground twice via taxi!! The long term deal SHOULD help them, and indeed I hope it will, but my greatest hope in all this is the sport see’s the need for expanding SL not destroying its foundations, two tens is a must not an option.

Specifically on the selection process, Leigh were the easy option and far ahead of the rest at that stage. The Championship squad is thin for SL, even before missing 7/8 players but there is cash in the bank and no borders to cross

Yes including your example of building strawmen when people have explained why there's a difference between them.  London, the club that is permenantly moving and miles away from the heartlands with no derby compared to Toulouse, who will have a derby game and are in the heartlands of the sport in France. 

Yes,  that was an excellent example...

 

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I just want to understand the logic for putting Leigh in SL coz I still don't understand.  Toulouse has just signed a 9 year deal with Stade Toulousain that not just allows them to play at the ic

Toulouse will hopefully get promoted on the back of a winning season which also helps selling tickets and corporates for their first season in the big time. I have no problem with Leigh being promoted

If I were at Toulouse, I wouldn't have been too anxious to get a free ticket into $uperleague for 2021. Too many obstacles to international travel at the moment, too much uncertainty, too little

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2 hours ago, The Daddy said:

I just want to understand the logic for putting Leigh in SL coz I still don't understand. 

Toulouse has just signed a 9 year deal with Stade Toulousain that not just allows them to play at the iconic ground but gives them a major presence at the complex. In addition to that they now have backing from the various local authorities which in France is significant. With the partnerships they have in place  I'm confident in saying that over the next few years Toulouse will quickly become one of the biggest clubs in Europe.

The commercial partnerships that Toulouse have are on a different scale to Leigh's and it gives the RL exposure to the 4th biggest city in France that has a population in the  metropolitan area of over 1.3 million, plus many more across the South West region. It would have increased the competition's presence in France and the number of professional players which allows the France national team to become more and more competitive and create a natural rival for England on its doorstep, that has so many commercial benefits in itself to UK RL. 

We were told over and over that they had an 'oven baked squad' ready to compete. If that's the case why are they now loaning a player from another SL club? On paper, their squad wasn't any better than Toulouse's and they finished below them in the league table in recent seasons.

Apparently the bids were assessed by an 'independent panel of experts' yet there has been no explanation into the reasoning behind the decision. 

To top it all off the majority of people in this country don't even know where Leigh is and thought that the parish of Leigh-on-Sea in Essex had entered a team into SL.

It was a terrible decision which says so much about the mindset of people running the sport here. It's several months on and I'm still disgusted 

He’s taken London’s first 2 thumpings really badly........

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17 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

This thread is better than a monty python sketch. All RL problems can be seen in just a few posts, we still have fools thinking because they are located in a city the crowds and sponsors will come, so let’s kill a few of the foundations to make way for them.

London is a big place and has had a club for 40 years with tens of thousands of RL folk in residence, 20000 gates every week and no need for a philanthropist to fight the wolves off.

Any one who has been to TO knows they have very few fans and are almost unknown in the city, we have been taken to the wrong ground twice via taxi!! The long term deal SHOULD help them, and indeed I hope it will, but my greatest hope in all this is the sport see’s the need for expanding SL not destroying its foundations, two tens is a must not an option.

Specifically on the selection process, Leigh were the easy option and far ahead of the rest at that stage. The Championship squad is thin for SL, even before missing 7/8 players but there is cash in the bank and no borders to cross

Yep, Leigh was the easy option. Exactly my point 

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18 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

This thread is better than a monty python sketch. All RL problems can be seen in just a few posts, we still have fools thinking because they are located in a city the crowds and sponsors will come, so let’s kill a few of the foundations to make way for them.

London is a big place and has had a club for 40 years with tens of thousands of RL folk in residence, 20000 gates every week and no need for a philanthropist to fight the wolves off.

Any one who has been to TO knows they have very few fans and are almost unknown in the city, we have been taken to the wrong ground twice via taxi!! The long term deal SHOULD help them, and indeed I hope it will, but my greatest hope in all this is the sport see’s the need for expanding SL not destroying its foundations, two tens is a must not an option.

Specifically on the selection process, Leigh were the easy option and far ahead of the rest at that stage. The Championship squad is thin for SL, even before missing 7/8 players but there is cash in the bank and no borders to cross

Double post 

Edited by The Daddy
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2 hours ago, The Daddy said:

Leigh are cannon fodder right now 

That just reinforces the point really, if Leigh are cannon fodder having invested such a sum then what would the others have been without it ?

What good would it have done any of those clubs to be the whipping boys of SL, doomed to cricket scores against them every week and certain relegation ?

There's an old saying among club chairmen - it takes years of good results to build up a fan base but it only takes a few bad results to lose one.

Edited by Derwent

I’m not prejudiced, I hate everybody equally

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2 hours ago, Saint 1 said:

How many Super League quality players did France have before Catalans were admitted to Super League? 

This is a fair point. Les Dracs have certainly brought through alot of SL players down the years. For both themselves and other clubs.

Escare, Gigot, Navarette, Pellisier etc all playing or recently played SL for English clubs.

TO in SL will be likely to increase this pool of Players and that will help France.

Edited by Southerner80
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Put Toppy on ignore, will do you all the world of good.

I harbour no ill will against Leigh who have put their money where their mouth is and stepped up. I also agree that Toulouse wouldn't have worked this year: not because of anything to do with that club, but because of Covid.

So I hope Toulouse's time will come. That said, someone on here got taken to the wrong ground in a taxi a couple of times (just a guess: maybe you gave the taxi driver the wrong address?) so maybe they are not such a big prospect after all.

I can confirm 30+ less sales for Scotland vs Italy at Workington, after this afternoons test purchase for the Tonga match, £7.50 is extremely reasonable, however a £2.50 'delivery' fee for a walk in purchase is beyond taking the mickey, good luck with that, it's cheaper on the telly.

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2 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

Because one French club with no rival games in one of the poorest parts of France and fear of relegation means that it isnt as good.  

Two teams, locked in with minimum French players in matchday squad and we have: Two sellouts plus one game that French RL can take on the road and enough French RL players getting regular games for an annual Eng vs France match in France not to be a blowout. 

Commercial opportunities explode.

You think Toulouse would sell out the Wallon for a league game against Catalans? 

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40 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said:

That was a fun read especially the parts mentioning production of players. 
 

Halifax has not had a SL team in over 15 years but the area of Calderdale still produces more SL players than the whole of France. 😂

Not wanting to split hairs but Calderdale is a fairly short drive from about 4 SL clubs. Five before the Bulls self destructed and about an hour from Salford and Wigan. It is hardly Dick Wittington stuff for a local player to sign with a regional SL club.

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11 minutes ago, Eddie said:

You think Toulouse would sell out the Wallon for a league game against Catalans? 

As much as Saints would sell out Wigan and Warrington these days. Sadly neither Saints or Warrington can put the house full signs up anymore.

TO v Catalans first ever French SL derby would push the 19k capacity for sure. Catalans have got five figures for a SL home game at Wallon. Perpignan is 2 hours from Toulouse too.

Edited by Scubby
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4 hours ago, The Daddy said:

I just want to understand the logic for putting Leigh in SL coz I still don't understand. 

Toulouse has just signed a 9 year deal with Stade Toulousain that not just allows them to play at the iconic ground but gives them a major presence at the complex. In addition to that they now have backing from the various local authorities which in France is significant. With the partnerships they have in place  I'm confident in saying that over the next few years Toulouse will quickly become one of the biggest clubs in Europe.

The commercial partnerships that Toulouse have are on a different scale to Leigh's and it gives the RL exposure to the 4th biggest city in France that has a population in the  metropolitan area of over 1.3 million, plus many more across the South West region. It would have increased the competition's presence in France and the number of professional players which allows the France national team to become more and more competitive and create a natural rival for England on its doorstep, that has so many commercial benefits in itself to UK RL. 

We were told over and over that they had an 'oven baked squad' ready to compete. If that's the case why are they now loaning a player from another SL club? On paper, their squad wasn't any better than Toulouse's and they finished below them in the league table in recent seasons.

Apparently the bids were assessed by an 'independent panel of experts' yet there has been no explanation into the reasoning behind the decision. 

To top it all off the majority of people in this country don't even know where Leigh is and thought that the parish of Leigh-on-Sea in Essex had entered a team into SL.

It was a terrible decision which says so much about the mindset of people running the sport here. It's several months on and I'm still disgusted 

IF Leigh beat the Castleford Tigers this evening it will give the whole club a boost and then perhaps they won't be favourites for relegation, which they are at the moment

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3 hours ago, DavidM said:

And Manfred gets stick for his exaggerated thread titles 

In fairness Manfred gets more stick for his style of content deluvery

Personally I love it's uniqueness and the response he always gets

I say 'he' but he is of course not actually a person though 

Edited by Bedfordshire Bronco
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31 minutes ago, Scubby said:

As much as Saints would sell out Wigan and Warrington these days. Sadly neither Saints or Warrington can put the house full signs up anymore.

TO v Catalans first ever French SL derby would push the 19k capacity for sure. Catalans have got five figures for a SL home game at Wallon. Perpignan is 2 hours from Toulouse too.

I think they'd sell the first few out for sure. Plenty of union fans would be interested in going too

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2 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

In fairness Manfred gets more stick for his style of content deluvery

Personally I love it's uniqueness and the response he always gets

I say 'he' but he is of course not actually a person though 

What is he the a robot?

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33 minutes ago, Scubby said:

As much as Saints would sell out Wigan and Warrington these days. Sadly neither Saints or Warrington can put the house full signs up anymore.

TO v Catalans first ever French SL derby would push the 19k capacity for sure. Catalans have got five figures for a SL home game at Wallon. Perpignan is 2 hours from Toulouse too.

I don’t know where the 18,000 additional fans would come from, certainly not from Perpignan, but of course it would be great if I’m wrong and they did get 19k through the gate. 

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2 minutes ago, Eddie said:

I don’t know where the 18,000 additional fans would come from, certainly not from Perpignan, but of course it would be great if I’m wrong and they did get 19k through the gate. 

Catalans held a SL game there in Toulouse a few years ago. It got over 10,000 at Wallon. There is an appetite for top class sport in France. Like anywhere, there is less of an appetite for a game against Dewsbury (sorry just off the top of my head) in the lower leagues.

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45 minutes ago, Scubby said:

It is hardly Dick Wittington stuff for a local player to sign with a regional SL club.

Are you new to RL?

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I can confirm 30+ less sales for Scotland vs Italy at Workington, after this afternoons test purchase for the Tonga match, £7.50 is extremely reasonable, however a £2.50 'delivery' fee for a walk in purchase is beyond taking the mickey, good luck with that, it's cheaper on the telly.

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Adding Leigh to SL made sense now, but I do think there’ll come a point soon when we should see what kind of commercial advantage can be gained by having two French clubs in the northern hemisphere club top flight.

The reason for me is that if we see the England national side and international rugby league as growth opportunities then we need as stronger opposition in the northern hemisphere as we can get for England to test themselves against regularly.

France look to have more potential than Wales, Scotland or Ireland as things stand on this basis.  Also tying in a French club boom to possible future French govt investment in a French hosted World Cup makes strategic sense.

Basically I’m saying that to help ourselves and compete with the Southern Hemisphere, we need to help the French help themselves (while not forgetting the others of course).

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3 hours ago, Spidey said:

Talk about over dramatic. Leigh haven’t played any of their relegation rivals yet.  I don’t think it’d do SL any harm them replacing Wakey, Hull KR or Salford for instance

I wouldn’t lump Hull KR or Salford in with Wakey. HKR are well supported and have some good ideas to build (listen to this week’s By the Balls Podcast for info) and Salford have made two finals in two seasons. I don’t think SL would miss Wakey at all, though of course that is a rubbish thing to say when considering their fans, who while limited in number are as passionate as any, and have to watch the game from a shed. 

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1 minute ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

Adding Leigh to SL made sense now, but I do think there’ll come a point soon when we should see what kind of commercial advantage can be gained by having two French clubs in the northern hemisphere club top flight.

The reason for me is that if we see the England national side and international rugby league as growth opportunities then we need as stronger opposition in the northern hemisphere as we can get for England to test themselves against regularly.

France look to have more potential than Wales, Scotland or Ireland as things stand on this basis.  Also tying in a French club boom to possible future French govt investment in a French hosted World Cup makes strategic sense.

Basically I’m saying that to help ourselves and compete with the Southern Hemisphere, we need to help the French help themselves (while not forgetting the others of course).

Very good points there. A lot of people bemoaning French progress are the same ones that have enjoyed memorable summer trips to France. It also provides another opportunity for quality English players to enjoy a change of scenery without having to go to the NRL. Variety is the spice and all that.

If French players are good enough they will break through. If not, they too have the opportunity to sample life playing in England. We are working with a tiny footprint and pool of talent. 

Leigh was a short term fit this time. Beyond this we have to grow or the commercial income will keep shrinking and it will be the same mice fighting over the ever dwindling cheese.

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1 hour ago, Scubby said:

As much as Saints would sell out Wigan and Warrington these days. Sadly neither Saints or Warrington can put the house full signs up anymore.

 

Taking nothing away from the french element but the biggest draw against full houses is respective fixtures 

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6 minutes ago, Eddie said:

I wouldn’t lump Hull KR or Salford in with Wakey. HKR are well supported and have some good ideas to build (listen to this week’s By the Balls Podcast for info) and Salford have made two finals in two seasons. I don’t think SL would miss Wakey at all, though of course that is a rubbish thing to say when considering their fans, who while limited in number are as passionate as any, and have to watch the game from a shed. 

It's simply grouping the teams I feel are at risk of relegation as well as Leigh.... if Leigh start beating those teams then they edge closer to safety

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  • John Drake changed the title to Putting Leigh in SL is the biggest mistake RL ever made (Merged threads)

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