champ. table

[tandle]

reading the champ

 

 

 

 

reading the champ.table oldham are fourth from the bottom with 4 points, newcastle are 8th of the the bottom with 3 points. 

there are 4 teams above oldham all on less points,oldham are minus 40 points.against.

so if you are forced to field a  weak team through injuries lets say for 4 games and get thrashed, but you win all the other games you could still get relegated very odd typical rugby league

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dave Naylor]

15 hours ago, tandle said:

reading the champ

reading the champ.table oldham are fourth from the bottom with 4 points, newcastle are 8th of the the bottom with 3 points. 

 

I think you're looking at the table on the BBC site. It's incorrect.

The table on the Oldham site accurately reflects the true standings based on %Win.  We're in 8th place as of this morning, we may well move a little after today's games.

https://roughyeds.co.uk/fixtures-and-results/league-table

[shaw llewellyn]

This % win is utter rubbish. You win a game and get points. That should be it. 

[jroyales]

I am not clear about this % idea. Looking at the table, Sheffield have 5 points but are below us on 4 points.

Can someone explain ie. Tandle what the hell is going on!!!!!

[Dave Naylor]

 

6 minutes ago, jroyales said:

I am not clear about this % idea. Looking at the table, Sheffield have 5 points but are below us on 4 points.

Can someone explain ie. Tandle what the hell is going on!!!!!

During this season, it's possible some games may be lost due to Covid.  So, the league will be decided on percentage of games won rather than points.  If teams are on the same percentage, then the points difference described as a percentage will decide who sits where in the table.

Newcastle, having lost this afternoon sit one place below us on 37.5%. We're on 50% (Won 2 out of 4).

London are also on 37.5% but they have an inferior points percentage, so sit below Newcastle.

The league table on our site is a feed from a Google Spreadsheet.  I just punched in the equations and the thing just creates the table for us.

https://roughyeds.co.uk/fixtures-and-results/league-table

[jroyales]

So if we take Covid out of the equation is just points won.

[Dave Naylor]

Points don't mean anything this year.  It's all on the ratio of games won/drawn against games played.

[shaw llewellyn]

You might want to explain that to BBC who appear to have no idea.

[roughyed1064]

bbc have never had any idea on just about everything.

[jroyales]

Thanks Dave it's very clear about win/game percentage, but how do they bring a draw into the equation?

Also, with London being prevented of travelling to Toulouse last month does that mean Toulouse also lose out?

Why does the RL keep messing things up? I long for good old days.

[The Art of Hand and Foot]

TBH there is a tradition of odd tables in RL. Even in the early days northern union, not every team was played. More recently, remember the 1989-90 season!? We didn't play all teams home and away. I think that's why they originally introduced the premiership play offs. 

[Dave Naylor]

18 minutes ago, jroyales said:

Thanks Dave it's very clear about win/game percentage, but how do they bring a draw into the equation?

Let's take Sheffield for example.  So far they've Played 4: W2, L1, D1

So each of their 4 games is worth 25% of the 100% available. (100 / 4 )

You get a full 25% for the win, half of 25% for the draw. Nothing for the loss.

2 x 25% =50%

1  x 25% / 2 = 12.5%

So Sheffield currently have a Win% of 62.5%

27 minutes ago, jroyales said:

Also, with London being prevented of travelling to Toulouse last month does that mean Toulouse also lose out?

Ha.  I was all over this like a rash last week.  

London chose not to travel to France so they forfeited the game 24-0.  At the time that left Toulouse with 3 wins out of 3 and a 100% Win%.

Oddly, after London beat us last week, they were showing a Win% of 50% but only two games played when technically it was three, counting the forfeited game.  They should have been on 1 out of 3 wins, so 33.3%.

I pointed this out and the response I received was that they didn't count the forfeited game as a "played" game because to qualify for the play-offs you need to have completed a certain number of games (off the top of my head I can't remember how many that is right now).

If the RFL included the forfeited game, London could have an advantage over another club at the end of the season to qualify for the play-offs.  So they'd decided not to count it.

I pointed out that in order to impose a punishment on London by not including the game, the RFL were actually improving London's Win% because of the fewer games played.  This meant that they sat above Oldham in the League table and it was Oldham who were suffering through no fault of their own and through London's refusal to travel.

CH pointed this out to the RFL and later that day London dropped down the table below us — because I was right.

Clear as mud eh!

 

[jroyales]

We'll just have to keep winning!

[OL14.yeds]

38 minutes ago, jroyales said:

We'll just have to keep winning!

Exactly. The only reason the league is going with win percentages is because of potential Covid issues, and fingers crossed, everything will be back to normal for next season.

Although I’ve still not got my head around the points percentage part of it.

[tandle]

i see that the bbc and sky sports have now put their champ tables correctly based on points. but when i came on here first they both had  oldham 4th from the bottom, they must have got the original information from someware. trust the rugby league never, and i suggest after the dirty tricks they have done on oldham in the past that oldham watches their backs on this one.  

[RogerT]

Good on yer Dave, Oldham have no fear Dave is here.

[moorside roughyed]

5 hours ago, OL14.yeds said:

Exactly. The only reason the league is going with win percentages is because of potential Covid issues, and fingers crossed, everything will be back to normal for next season.

Although I’ve still not got my head around the points percentage part of it.

I'm not either. Maths has never been my strongest subject. I'll just read the table and go "oh yeah"

[Ainley Top]

Blimey, me 'ed hurts!

[The Art of Hand and Foot]

10 hours ago, jroyales said:

We'll just have to keep winning!

Love that attitude! Let's just keep winning. The thing is it's a game of psychology. Swinton are devastated. They are wondering where their first win is going to come from.  Halifax are dumbfounded,  after all they hammered us pre season.  Their fans are blaming the wrong people. It's not their coaches who are to blame, it's the pundits who had us down as whipping boys. Our dressing room must be buzzing. Let's hope it really is back to the future. But let's not get too cocky. Let's be pragmatic. Come on Oldham,  come on Oldham!

 

[moorside roughyed]

Teletubbies laughing at people again. 

[Nicomachus]

On 03/05/2021 at 11:08, Dave Naylor said:

Let's take Sheffield for example.  So far they've Played 4: W2, L1, D1

So each of their 4 games is worth 25% of the 100% available. (100 / 4 )

You get a full 25% for the win, half of 25% for the draw. Nothing for the loss.

2 x 25% =50%

1  x 25% / 2 = 12.5%

So Sheffield currently have a Win% of 62.5%

Ha.  I was all over this like a rash last week.  

London chose not to travel to France so they forfeited the game 24-0.  At the time that left Toulouse with 3 wins out of 3 and a 100% Win%.

Oddly, after London beat us last week, they were showing a Win% of 50% but only two games played when technically it was three, counting the forfeited game.  They should have been on 1 out of 3 wins, so 33.3%.

I pointed this out and the response I received was that they didn't count the forfeited game as a "played" game because to qualify for the play-offs you need to have completed a certain number of games (off the top of my head I can't remember how many that is right now).

If the RFL included the forfeited game, London could have an advantage over another club at the end of the season to qualify for the play-offs.  So they'd decided not to count it.

I pointed out that in order to impose a punishment on London by not including the game, the RFL were actually improving London's Win% ÷because of the fewer games played.  This meant that they sat above Oldham in the League table and it was Oldham who were suffering through no fault of their own and through London's refusal to travel.

CH pointed this out to the RFL and later that day London dropped down the table below us — because I was right.

Clear as mud eh!

 

Oh Lordy, where to start.

OK, first let me clarify:

When I refer to Points Earned, I mean 2 for a win, 1 for a draw, to differentiate from Points Scored and Points Conceded during a game.

Given the possibility of games being affected by Covid, RFL opted to base league places on:

First, Win %, that is (Points Earned / Games Played) x 50% -  e.g. ORLFC have 4 points from 4 games played, (4 / 4) x 50% = 50%, Widnes 3 from 4, (3 / 4) x 50% = 37.5%, etc.

then Points Ratio, simply: (Points Scored / Points Conceded) again ORLFC 78 / 118 = 66.1%

Games played: Sounds obvious right? It isn't. The RFL Covid Regulatory Framework states that in order to qualify for the play-offs, clubs are "required to have played in 70% of their scheduled fixtures" (16 in Championship). "Where a club is unable (or unwilling) to fulfil... the Match shall be forfeit and the points awarded to the opposition with a deemed score of 24-0". "The match shall not count towards the number of matches required to qualify for the play-offs".

As Dave quite rightly pointed out, this would have had the effect of improving Broncos’ Win %, because of their refusal to travel to France. The RFL have now remedied the situation, so it is better to think of the Win % as:

            (Points Earned / Points Available) x 100% - so ORLFC 4 points from a possible 8 = 50%.

Hence Broncos, who have 3 points from an available 8, have a 37.5% Win%, but for the purpose of qualifying for play-offs have only completed 75% of their match schedule. However, when it comes to TOXIII, RFL seem to want to have their gateau and eat it; TOXIII are “deemed” to have played 3 games (although it is currently only 2), because they did not forfeit the match against Broncos.

Given that TOXIII have agreed to play their next “home” game vs Widnes at Heywood Rd as part of a double header with Swinton vs Bradford, we will have to wait and see how this scenario pans out. Certainly, if I were in CH’s shoes, I would refuse to travel to France, incurring huge financial cost not only to the club but also to the players who are not full-time pros (unlike Broncos).  Again, the soon-to-be-announced ‘green list’ for travel may change the situation, but I’d be tempted to take the 24-0 hit and give the players a week off (not in a quarantine hotel).

Just my two penn’orth…

[Nicomachus]

I should have added, there is no similar cut-off point (in terms of matches played) when it comes to relegation. There is a corollary here with the Association Football National League: Dover Athletic furloughed its entire staff and had any early season results expunged, knowing they would finish bottom of the league having technically played no games, but having been assured that they would not be relegated. I'll bet Barnet FC and Kings Lynn Town are less than happy about that...