V’landys Faces NRLs Biggest Test: Blowout Scores (Merged threads)

[Graham]

14 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

@Graham, maybe a merger of Blowout Scores threads?

Done SP

[Sports Prophet]

11 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

I wish you would learn to say "fewer" rather than "less".

Move on please. I stand by my right to say “18 points or less”.

[Sports Prophet]

Rd 1 - TWM 143 / twelve or < 2 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 2 - TWM 85 / twelve or < 5 / eighteen or < 6

Rd 3 - TWM 129 / twelve or < 4 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 4 - TWM 209 / twelve < 1 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 5 - TWM 136 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 6 - TWM 121 / twelve or < 5 / eighteen  or < 5

Rd 7 - TWM 156 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 8 - TWM 128 / twelve or < 4 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 9 - TWM 154 / twelve or <  4 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 10 - TWM 179 / twelve or < 2 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 11 - TWM 138(not including 1pt ET win for Sharks) / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 12 - TWM 153 / twelve or < 2 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 14 - TWM - 146 / twelve or < 2 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 15 - TWM - 188 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 16 - TWM - 214 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 4

Rds 13 & 17 (1/2 Rds) - TWM 144 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 18 - TWM 148 / twelve or < 1 / eighteen or < 7

Rd 19 - TWM 132 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 20 - TWM 168 / twelve or < 1 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 21 - TWM 96 / twelve or < 6 / eighteen or < 6

Rd 22 - TWM 129 / twelve or < 4 / eighteen of < 6

Rd 23 - TWM 100 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 7

A fantastic round I thought. Is it perhaps teams are starting to learn how to wrestle back momentum? I don’t think there are anywhere near the same number of six again calls, that we saw earlier in the season. I think this has had a huge effect in evening the contest, but think teams are getting better at game management.

100 point total winning margin is the third lowest of the season. 

@unapologetic pedant, you may also have some “relevant” feedback on the fantastic AFL round that that also took place last weekend? Something about the Demons? Something about the Cats. Bachar Houli ending his career in such circumstances? The Lions race to top 4? Or maybe Port powering their way to a Qualifying Final?

[unapologetic pedant]

7 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

@unapologetic pedant, you may also have some “relevant” feedback on the fantastic AFL round that that also took place last weekend? Something about the Demons? Something about the Cats. Bachar Houli ending his career in such circumstances? The Lions race to top 4? 

 

On 16/08/2021 at 00:30, Sports Prophet said:

That would be a great talking point on a “Fumbleball Blowout Scores” thread.

[unapologetic pedant]

7 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

@unapologetic pedant, Or maybe Port powering their way to a Qualifying Final?

 

On 21/08/2021 at 12:26, unapologetic pedant said:

Incidentally, last night`s Bulldogs 64 (10 goals, 4 misses) Power 66 (9 goals, 12 misses), was one of those enhanced-absurdity AFL games where the winning team kicked fewer goals than their opponents.

[unapologetic pedant]

On 23/08/2021 at 23:18, Sports Prophet said:

@unapologetic pedant, you may also have some “relevant” feedback on the fantastic AFL round that that also took place last weekend? Something about the Demons? Something about the Cats. Bachar Houli ending his career in such circumstances? The Lions race to top 4? Or maybe Port powering their way to a Qualifying Final?

Revisiting your invitation to get excited about the AFL finals, I have to report I`m still distinctly underwhelmed. I have a hunch it might have something to do with the game itself.

However, one advantage AFL does have over NRL in my eyes is that 8 from 18 better preserves the integrity of a finals series than 8 from 16. A club who make the finals should be perceived as having had a successful year. That principle can only be credibly maintained if under half of the teams in the comp qualify. 

The flaws can be obfuscated in years when the comp is more even, but half of the teams making the finals risks a scenario like this year where the Knights have won 12, lost 12, with a for and against of -143, and the Titans have won 10, lost 14, with a for and against of -3. Patently, neither deserve to be playing finals football. Aside from the stats, anyone who has seen their games knows they haven`t sufficiently cut the mustard through the regular season.

When I first started following Aussie RL in the late 80s, it was 5 from 16. When traditional underdogs like the Bears and Magpies made the finals, or the Knights and Steelers secured a place for the first time, it was justifiably covered as a story of major accomplishment.

A 17th franchise will help, although if PVL is still at the helm, given his record of rule-change gimmickry, it would not be a surprise if he tried to resurrect the tawdry wild-card play-off idea.

[The Rocket]

On 16/08/2021 at 09:30, Sports Prophet said:

That would be a great talking point on a “Fumbleball Blowout Scores” thread.

As an afl fan Sports Prophet I am more interested in your take on the continued decline in afl matchday scores.

After the precipitous drop from 89 points per team per match (ptpm) in 2017 to 83 points ptpm in 2018 a raft of changes were brought in to stem and reverse that trend ( remembering that was on the back of a decrease from around the turn of the millenium where it stood at around 100 ptpm ) only to see it drop to 80 ptpmin 2019. Ignoring 2020 with its` shortened quarters, we saw a drop to 79 ptpm this year, interestingly the last 10 rounds averaged 76.

Considering that most of my afl watching consists of a quick flick over to Ch 7 to hopefully see how bad the afl game is going, ( and also of course to have a chuckle and invariably think to myself how do people take this stuff seriously ) throughout the course of the year I do pick up the odd afl tidbit here and there. One thing I have noticed is that there does seem to be more discussion of the tackle as a part of the game. I saw a debutant being lauded for making 14(?)tackles recently and also that the number of tackles per match had doubled in the last twenty years.

My question to you is how low do you think scores could go; given the up-roar in 2020 with the low scoring could it become an existential threat ; is this seemingly new found interest in tackle symptomatic of afl`s cultural cringe in that it needs to have all the best bits of other sports in order to boost its` own credibility and more importantly does the growth in the tackles per match have much further potential to grow. 

[Sports Prophet]

@The Rocket I think the continued drop in scores, lower season hauls for Coleman medalists, have been equally criticised by fans and media as have the changes implemented by the AFL in a bid to turn the decline of both statistics.

AFL is not immune from blowouts and non competitive fixtures. This seems to give detractors of AFL some sort of comfort, when that focus should be more about what can be done to fix the lack of competitiveness between clubs of their own chosen sport.

Tackling has long been a heralded statistic in a match, so nothing new there as far as I am concerned.

Personally, I don’t necessarily think it’s the low scoring that is the threat to enjoyability of a match, but the increasingly condensed nature of the ball at contests that results in defensive 50m zones being flooded with defenders. Clean possession is even harder to come by (much to the delights of those denouncing the sport as “fumbleball”), but getting the ball clear in tight, hotly contested spaces is a very enjoyable strong team skill in itself. It’s the prominence that this type of play has dominated matches these days, that it does minimise the opportunities for classic “Champagne Football” moments that has impressed so many fans in days gone by.

That’s my take at least. 

From a Rugby League point of view, I furiously turned the Titans v Warriors game off very early as the game turned into a procession. For at kick off of that game, there was still a chance of the Sharks sneaking into the finals. Although, similar to@unapologetic pedant, the Sharks 2021 didn’t deserve to be in a post season series anyway.

I think a finalist should be a serious premiership contender. I have long said there are only two clubs in the race for the 2021 NRL Premiership which makes me sad. Having seven serious contenders for the 2021 AFL Premiership up to a week and a half ago at the start of the finals series doesn’t give me any comfort. Nothing that happens in one sport, gives me comfort from the frustrations I experience in my fandom of another.

[Sports Prophet]

Seems like you lads have been a little lost on this thread without my enthralling weekly NRL statistic updates. So let me catch-up…

Rd 1 - TWM 143 / twelve or < 2 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 2 - TWM 85 / twelve or < 5 / eighteen or < 6

Rd 3 - TWM 129 / twelve or < 4 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 4 - TWM 209 / twelve < 1 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 5 - TWM 136 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 6 - TWM 121 / twelve or < 5 / eighteen  or < 5

Rd 7 - TWM 156 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 8 - TWM 128 / twelve or < 4 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 9 - TWM 154 / twelve or <  4 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 10 - TWM 179 / twelve or < 2 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 11 - TWM 138(not including 1pt ET win for Sharks) / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 5

Rd 12 - TWM 153 / twelve or < 2 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 14 - TWM - 146 / twelve or < 2 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 15 - TWM - 188 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 16 - TWM - 214 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 4

Rds 13 & 17 (1/2 Rds) - TWM 144 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 4

Rd 18 - TWM 148 / twelve or < 1 / eighteen or < 7

Rd 19 - TWM 132 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 20 - TWM 168 / twelve or < 1 / eighteen or < 3

Rd 21 - TWM 96 / twelve or < 6 / eighteen or < 6

Rd 22 - TWM 129 / twelve or < 4 / eighteen of < 6

Rd 23 - TWM 100 / twelve or < 3 / eighteen or < 7

Rd 24 - TWM 119 / twelve or < 5 / eighteen or < 7

Rd 25 - TWM 197 / twelve or < 2 / eighteen or < 3

Another competitive week in Rd 24 was succeeded by Rd 25’s emphatic signature to end a very non-competitive 2021 NRL regular season. Let’s hope the finals series bring some surprises to my hopelessly pessimistic view on the competitiveness of the 2021 season.

[unapologetic pedant]

10 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

Seems like you lads have been a little lost on this thread without my enthralling weekly NRL statistic updates.

If you intend enthralling us next year, why not just post the latest round, rather than regurgitate the whole lot every time.

Maybe add each week`s AFL winning margin stats for a bit of texture and colour. 

[unapologetic pedant]

10 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

 but getting the ball clear in tight, hotly contested spaces is a very enjoyable strong team skill in itself. 

In what way?

 

10 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

I think a finalist should be a serious premiership contender. I have long said there are only two clubs in the race for the 2021 NRL Premiership which makes me sad. Having seven serious contenders for the 2021 AFL Premiership up to a week and a half ago at the start of the finals series doesn’t give me any comfort. Nothing that happens in one sport, gives me comfort from the frustrations I experience in my fandom of another.

By any objective measure there are more random elements in AFL than NRL. For good or ill, that makes AFL games more unpredictable and the competition more open. RL is a mathematical purer game, where the cream usually rises to the top.

Having said that, I think any of the top 6 are capable of winning the NRL premiership. Parra have beaten the Storm twice this year, Manly can be red hot with Tommy Turbo fit and firing, Souths and Easts can beat anyone when they click. The fallout from the Latrell/Joey incident is a great pity vis-a-vis the prospects of the latter two.

[Sports Prophet]

In what way you ask @unapologetic pedant?

Well one of the critical points of Australian Rules is that if you get tackled with the ball and have had a prior opportunity to correctly dispose of the ball (must be a hand pass or kick, you cannot simply drop the ball), then you concede a free kick. These tightly congested contests means players must have fast actions, the quickest of decision making and peripheral vision rarely required in other sports.

I can appreciate the skill it takes to gain clear possession. I find it similar to the skill it takes of a RL backline to navigate and overcome a defensive line that starts equal in numbers and finishes in an overlap. Eyes up footy as they call it.

[Sports Prophet]

10 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

If you intend enthralling us next year, why not just post the latest round, rather than regurgitate the whole lot every time.

Maybe add each week`s AFL winning margin stats for a bit of texture and colour. 

I find posting the whole season good for highlighting how one week compares to other weeks in the season.

Also spotting trends. For example, the number of tight games (twelve or less) pre SOO is a little over three games a week. Very similar, but slightly less than the number of wins by twelve or less post Origin. Funny enough, during Origin, where you would expect a more balanced competition, the number of games won by twelve or less during Origin dropped well below three games a week.

When we look at games that can be considered very competitive down to vaguely competitive and everywhere between (won by eighteen or less), about 4.5 fixtures per week satisfied this criteria pre-SOO, and post-SOO, that average improved to well over five games a week. Again during Origin, where I would have expected a more even competition, the facts demonstrate otherwise with well less than four games a week fitting this category. Significantly worse than outside Origin commitments.

One might conclude that as the season progressed and when teams were back to full strength (of fit players at least), the competitiveness of the NRL increased. Perhaps lesser coaches/players/squads were learning from the others and improving at a faster rate than the teams above them. I must admit, my overall enjoyment of the NRL season as a whole improved post Origin and the facts presented lend me reason why that was.

Then again, others say that you can manipulate statistics to tell you any story you want. Maybe you can come up with a conclusion on the competitiveness of the NRL over the regular season based on the rounds presented.

[unapologetic pedant]

1 hour ago, Sports Prophet said:

In what way you ask @unapologetic pedant?

Well one of the critical points of Australian Rules is that if you get tackled with the ball and have had a prior opportunity to correctly dispose of the ball (must be a hand pass or kick, you cannot simply drop the ball), then you concede a free kick. These tightly congested contests means players must have fast actions, the quickest of decision making and peripheral vision rarely required in other sports.

I can appreciate the skill it takes to gain clear possession. I find it similar to the skill it takes of a RL backline to navigate and overcome a defensive line that starts equal in numbers and finishes in an overlap. Eyes up footy as they call it.

Myself and The Rocket attempted to make sense of this on the dedicated Fumble thread. My conclusion was, and remains, that "holding the ball" and "legally disposing of the ball", like similar notions in RU, cannot credibly pass muster. People just have to suspend their critical faculties and go with the flow, because ultimately there is no alternative to such dubious regulations in a handling code unless possession is limited as in RL and Gridiron.

I`m pleased though that you`ve posted an account of an aspect of AFL play you can appreciate irrespective of the closeness of a game. My main contention with you on blowout threads is that I similarly enjoy many aspects of RL irrespective of the closeness of a game. The most plausible explanation is that I am primarily a RL fan, you are primarily an AFL fan.

Being a lukewarm NRL fan or fervent AFL fan are not hanging offences. If you were before my court, you could be out on parole within 5 to 10 years. But your conception and portrayal of what constitutes a "competitive" RL game has to be seen in this context.

Saturday`s Cowboys/Sea-Eagles game, with a final score of 18 - 46, comfortably failed to meet your acceptable winning-margin criterion. Yet the game had everything a RL fan could wish for.

[unapologetic pedant]

On 05/09/2021 at 11:41, The Rocket said:

One thing I have noticed is that there does seem to be more discussion of the tackle as a part of the game. I saw a debutant being lauded for making 14(?)tackles recently and also that the number of tackles per match had doubled in the last twenty years.

Maybe the solution to increased congestion around the ball is for the umpire to make a quick call of "Held" when any defender comes within a 5m radius of the player in possession?

[Sports Prophet]

9 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

Myself and The Rocket attempted to make sense of this on the dedicated Fumble thread. My conclusion was, and remains, that "holding the ball" and "legally disposing of the ball", like similar notions in RU, cannot credibly pass muster. People just have to suspend their critical faculties and go with the flow, because ultimately there is no alternative to such dubious regulations in a handling code unless possession is limited as in RL and Gridiron.

I`m pleased though that you`ve posted an account of an aspect of AFL play you can appreciate irrespective of the closeness of a game. My main contention with you on blowout threads is that I similarly enjoy many aspects of RL irrespective of the closeness of a game. The most plausible explanation is that I am primarily a RL fan, you are primarily an AFL fan.

 

Well I have witnessed and participated in far more RL fixtures than I have AFL.  Your assertion that I am primarily an AFL fan is wide of the mark. I am a fan equally of both and I’ve told you this before. I don’t participate in any AFL forums and I visit the NRL site far more than the rare occasions I visit the AFL version. 

I’ve never said that there are no aspects of a non-competitive matchup that I cannot enjoy. But I liken blowout fixtures to a movie with a stellar cast but poor storyline. It will have moments of brilliance, but overall, I’m very disinterested. If I have turned off a NRL or AFL match early because there is no meaningful contest and I miss the greatest try or goal in the history of either sport, that’s ok, I’ll see it on replay and very much appreciate it then.

The fundamental principle of sport is to contest for the win, be it personal or in competition. Sure, there will always be favourites and I consider it a personal victory and very much appreciate it when rank outsiders keep clinging on to a margin against a favourite that keeps them within reasonable reach of an upset, yet in all likelihood, I know that will not happen.

When that primary piece of competitiveness is non-existent, my attention will swiftly wane. I’m not the only one. Think of the thousands that leave a live sporting event early when the result has become a foregone conclusion and just because other individuals can sit through a load of fixtures where the match is of absolute no contest, that doesn’t make those individuals any more a supporter or knowledgeable fan of the game than myself. 

As to legally disposing of the ball in AFL not being a credible law, then I guess there is little I can do to change that opinion. I certainly don’t have any overwhelming desire to change it. However the hundreds of thousands watching an AFL game both live and at home that unanimously roar or appeal “BAAAALLLL” to the umpires whilst a player is tackled in possession, clearly demonstrates the law is justifiable and neither is it a complex theory.

[unapologetic pedant]

1 hour ago, Sports Prophet said:

I’ve never said that there are no aspects of a non-competitive matchup that I cannot enjoy. 

Sharks piling up the points is the only one I can remember you mentioning.

1 hour ago, Sports Prophet said:

The fundamental principle of sport is to contest for the win, be it personal or in competition. 

I follow more amateur and junior RL, including in recent years a lot of female RL, where the "fundamental principle" is to enjoy playing and watching the game. Winning is an important detail, but not the be all and end all.

Those values inform my appraisal of an NRL game. In rudimentary terms, I want to see lots of what I consider to be good play. If the game is close, that`s a bonus.

1 hour ago, Sports Prophet said:

Think of the thousands that leave a live sporting event early when the result has become a foregone conclusion and just because other individuals can sit through a load of fixtures where the match is of absolute no contest, that doesn’t make those individuals any more a supporter or knowledgeable fan of the game than myself. 

I disagree. Those who leave early are fans of something, maybe their local club or their local club winning, but not the game itself. 

In retrospect, the day I felt the impulse to go home at half-time from a Soccer match was the moment I knew I was losing interest. I would never have left early in the erstwhile mad-keen years.

When I see a Shakespeare play at the theatre, my appreciation is undiminished by prior knowledge of the ending.

2 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

 However the hundreds of thousands watching an AFL game both live and at home that unanimously roar or appeal “BAAAALLLL” to the umpires whilst a player is tackled in possession, clearly demonstrates the law is justifiable and neither is it a complex theory.

AFL fans only bawl when an opposition player is in possession. In the same way RL fans howl "Forward" at any opposition pass that fails to travel at least a metre backwards. Just a dumb-ass reflex.

I can categorically assert that I have never described any element of AFL as a "complex theory". 

[unapologetic pedant]

Melbourne 40 Manly 12

Melbourne 125 Geelong 42

TRL is currently looking to recruit a curator for our dedicated Melbourne blowout thread.

The successful candidate will have wide experience in the evolving science of comparative blowout analytics and a boredom threshold that reaches to the sky.

As a concession, the successful candidate will not be required to understand the grammatical difference between "less" and "fewer". We can`t afford to set the bar too high. 

[unapologetic pedant]

On 08/09/2021 at 12:25, Sports Prophet said:

 Maybe you can come up with a conclusion on the competitiveness of the NRL over the regular season based on the rounds presented.

Continuing the theme from the Broadcasting thread, I noticed an instance of another of my pet bugbears in the Melbourne/Manly game.

When Manly were 18-0 down and trying to get back in the game DCE batted the ball on to Morgan Harper who scored. The Touch Judge, to everyone`s bemusement, came up with a forward pass. In this case, it didn`t matter much, since Saab scored on the next set, but it still illustrated a major problem in RL.

Had it been a regulation pass with DCE in control of the ball, I`m confident it would have been seen as back out of the hands and not called forward. I reckon the Touch Judge was applying the deranged knock-on version of "forward", i.e. the ball didn`t go clearly backwards - therefore it must be a knock-on. So because it was a tap on rather than a pass, any hope of the benefit of the doubt went out the window.

As I said up the page, I believe Manly have the ammunition to beat Melbourne, but not through a strategy of tightly-controlled football. They have to open up, move the ball around, pass out of the tackle. But more adventurous play risks punishment in the form of phantom knock-on, phantom obstruction, or phantom forward pass calls.

This is the obstacle for a trailing team when they chance their arm. Everything has to be perfect or conform to a rigid view of acceptable patterns. Anything loose or intricate could trigger a call from the ref and turn the ball over in dangerous field position. So then more points are conceded and the score blows out.

Like the charge down rule, the obsessive illogical application of knock-on, obstruction, and forward pass rules profoundly affects the way the game is played. It makes it harder to overcome deficits with creative expansive play, and favours those teams who have ruthless risk-assessment down to a fine art.

[unapologetic pedant]

On 07/09/2021 at 14:42, Sports Prophet said:

This seems to give detractors of AFL some sort of comfort

You must be even more relieved than I am that the NRL has relented and brought the Storm`s prelim final forward a few hours.

Although I think it will still clash with the "Are you ready to Fumble" pre-match show.

BTW, has it always been the AFL practice to have a fortnight between prelim and GF? What`s the rationale?

I could work up a few wise-ass theories, but you`d find those all too tedious and tiring.

[Sports Prophet]

18 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

Continuing the theme from the Broadcasting thread, I noticed an instance of another of my pet bugbears in the Melbourne/Manly game.

When Manly were 18-0 down and trying to get back in the game DCE batted the ball on to Morgan Harper who scored. The Touch Judge, to everyone`s bemusement, came up with a forward pass. In this case, it didn`t matter much, since Saab scored on the next set, but it still illustrated a major problem in RL.

Had it been a regulation pass with DCE in control of the ball, I`m confident it would have been seen as back out of the hands and not called forward. I reckon the Touch Judge was applying the deranged knock-on version of "forward", i.e. the ball didn`t go clearly backwards - therefore it must be a knock-on. So because it was a tap on rather than a pass, any hope of the benefit of the doubt went out the window.

As I said up the page, I believe Manly have the ammunition to beat Melbourne, but not through a strategy of tightly-controlled football. They have to open up, move the ball around, pass out of the tackle. But more adventurous play risks punishment in the form of phantom knock-on, phantom obstruction, or phantom forward pass calls.

This is the obstacle for a trailing team when they chance their arm. Everything has to be perfect or conform to a rigid view of acceptable patterns. Anything loose or intricate could trigger a call from the ref and turn the ball over in dangerous field position. So then more points are conceded and the score blows out.

Like the charge down rule, the obsessive illogical application of knock-on, obstruction, and forward pass rules profoundly affects the way the game is played. It makes it harder to overcome deficits with creative expansive play, and favours those teams who have ruthless risk-assessment down to a fine art.

I really don’t like the six again call in the tackle. I was infuriated when the Storm conceded a set restart at the first tackle of a 20m restart which would have been zero tackle anyway. What advantage was there to Manly? None. The smart clubs and players use the rule and happy to sap momentum by giving away an extra tackle.

[Sports Prophet]

14 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

BTW, has it always been the AFL practice to have a fortnight between prelim and GF? What`s the rationale?

I could work up a few wise-ass theories, but you`d find those all too tedious and tiring.

Any time spent trying to come up with theories either wise-ass or not would be reasonably futile.

This is only temporary this year due to COVID. Don’t know much more than that. 

For the second year in a row and in the sport’s history, the GF will be played to a night time audience on the east coast. The broadcasters would love to make that permanent but one of the things you grow to respect the AFL for is their ability to stand up for what they want. Much like their match scheduling which aside from having the certainty of fixtures played on Thursday and Friday night, the AFL schedule the matches how they like.

[unapologetic pedant]

35 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

For the second year in a row and in the sport’s history, the GF will be played to a night time audience on the east coast. The broadcasters would love to make that permanent but one of the things you grow to respect the AFL for is their ability to stand up for what they want. Much like their match scheduling which aside from having the certainty of fixtures played on Thursday and Friday night, the AFL schedule the matches how they like.

I had a vague idea there had always been a fortnight`s gap somewhere. Either between regular season and start of finals or between prelim and GF.

I don`t think it`s strictly accurate to say the AFL "schedule the matches how they like". They have to abide by the terms of their broadcast deal. But it is true that they "stand up for what they want" when negotiating those deals more than the NRL.

Lots of reasons for that. Probably chief among them is the far stronger "attendance culture". Which means less dependence on the media. When the AFL stand firm and defend their traditions, they know their fans will stand behind them and keep going to the games come what may. As I said on another thread, a "blindly loyal fanbase" is a very useful thing to have.

The NRL are well aware that there isn`t the same goodwill for RL, and that their "fans" are nothing like as reliable.

[Sports Prophet]

7 minutes ago, unapologetic pedant said:

I had a vague idea there had always been a fortnight`s gap somewhere. Either between regular season and start of finals or between prelim and GF.

I don`t think it`s strictly accurate to say the AFL "schedule the matches how they like". They have to abide by the terms of their broadcast deal. But it is true that they "stand up for what they want" when negotiating those deals more than the NRL.

Lots of reasons for that. Probably chief among them is the far stronger "attendance culture". Which means less dependence on the media. When the AFL stand firm and defend their traditions, they know their fans will stand behind them and keep going to the games come what may. As I said on another thread, a "blindly loyal fanbase" is a very useful thing to have.

The NRL are well aware that there isn`t the same goodwill for RL, and that their "fans" are nothing like as reliable.

It’s said far too often that the NRL and the clubs do not make enough big events out of their regular season.

Another long held opinion (one I disagree with) is that there are too many Sydney clubs. Not that I am advocating for any more.

Its time the NRL really turn the congested Sydney market into a positive. It is well known that with the entry of Brisbane 2, that a game in Brisbane almost every Friday night is a formality. It’s good that it won’t be the Broncos every week though. What I think the NRL is missing is maximising Sydney derbies and the SFS.

When the SFS is completed, I think a great idea would be to interchange the 8pm kick off on Friday nights between Brisbane and Sydney each week. When in Sydney it would be a Friday Night City Showdown played only between Sydney clubs and played only at the SFS or Parramatta Stadium, capturing the post work crowd, and incentivise neutrals to attend by making an event out of the fixture. Tickets starting at $15. Pre-match entertainment. A festival of Sydney Rugby League every Friday fortnight. Targeting a minimum 75% capacity for every match. Making it a not to be missed event.

[unapologetic pedant]

9 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

When the SFS is completed, I think a great idea would be to interchange the 8pm kick off on Friday nights between Brisbane and Sydney each week. When in Sydney it would be a Friday Night City Showdown played only between Sydney clubs and played only at the SFS or Parramatta Stadium, capturing the post work crowd, and incentivise neutrals to attend by making an event out of the fixture. Tickets starting at $15. Pre-match entertainment. A festival of Sydney Rugby League every Friday fortnight. Targeting a minimum 75% capacity for every match. Making it a not to be missed event.

I like the sound of it, but would NRL "fans" respond? On Aussie RL forums when the subject of poor finals attendances at the old SFS came up, the posts were all grumbles about the public transport system.

I continue to believe that the absence of a NRL "attendance culture" derives from the generally miserable and negative culture of RL. And that in turn derives from our resolutely working-class history.

I grew up in a household where we habitually ran out of money before pay day. I can testify to the truth of the Micawber Principle -

"Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen pounds nineteen and six, result happiness.

Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery."

Sports that draw their support from right across the socio-economic spectrum have a healthier balance between negative and positive sentiment. It`s hard to conjure up an "attendance culture" when your fanbase has on average traditionally had less money and whose outlook on life is consequently dismal.

"Physician, heal thyself" - You`d be in a delicate position if someone told you they didn`t think it was worth attending your "festival of Sydney RL" because the game might be uncompetitive, defined as a winning margin greater than 12.