NARL (Merged threads)

[langpark]

5 hours ago, gingerjon said:

"One of the reasons for that decision was that two of the three people originally appointed to source additional sponsorships for the league pulled out at the eleventh hour."

So the money was never there and these guys weren't investors.

Indeed. How they were able to fool so many people though is what annoys and saddens me the most.

I cannot see them (NARL) doing anything in 2022 either. They will have an enormous task rebuilding trust. 

Sadly USA seems to be the land of "here today,gone tomorrow"... Denver test, NARL, RLWC2021 (11th hour) bid, just to name a few examples.

Given their sheer size and population, I really think they'd be best off focusing on running state leagues. Florida and California already seem like they could field quite a few teams. Then some of the smaller states can run a combined league, with as little as four teams. Then have occasional crossovers or run a national cup, for any times that can afford the travel costs.

Nothing is gained by Jacksonville flying to Cleveland (for example) when both teams can play a team of similar standard closer to home. It costs a fortune and that money would be much better spent on other things like equiment and recruiting players, then eventually adding youth and/or womens teams.

Time for USA to consilidate and focus on the grassroots rather than crazy ideas that are a century ahead of their time. 

[Cumbrian Mackem]

15 minutes ago, langpark said:

Indeed. How they were able to fool so many people though is what annoys and saddens me the most.

I cannot see them (NARL) doing anything in 2022 either. They will have an enormous task rebuilding trust. 

Sadly USA seems to be the land of "here today,gone tomorrow"... Denver test, NARL, RLWC2021 (11th hour) bid, just to name a few examples.

Given their sheer size and population, I really think they'd be best off focusing on running state leagues. Florida and California already seem like they could field quite a few teams. Then some of the smaller states can run a combined league, with as little as four teams. Then have occasional crossovers or run a national cup, for any times that can afford the travel costs.

Nothing is gained by Jacksonville flying to Cleveland (for example) when both teams can play a team of similar standard closer to home. It costs a fortune and that money would be much better spent on other things like equiment and recruiting players, then eventually adding youth and/or womens teams.

Time for USA to consilidate and focus on the grassroots rather than crazy ideas that are a century ahead of their time. 

Exactly. Florida and California seem to be building something albeit very slowly but it’s still growth.

Texas could be promising as well. All three of these states have huge populations and dozens of cities and towns that could be potential targets.

[Wellsy4HullFC]

17 minutes ago, langpark said:

Indeed. How they were able to fool so many people though is what annoys and saddens me the most.

I cannot see them (NARL) doing anything in 2022 either. They will have an enormous task rebuilding trust. 

Sadly USA seems to be the land of "here today,gone tomorrow"... Denver test, NARL, RLWC2021 (11th hour) bid, just to name a few examples.

Given their sheer size and population, I really think they'd be best off focusing on running state leagues. Florida and California already seem like they could field quite a few teams. Then some of the smaller states can run a combined league, with as little as four teams. Then have occasional crossovers or run a national cup, for any times that can afford the travel costs.

Nothing is gained by Jacksonville flying to Cleveland (for example) when both teams can play a team of similar standard closer to home. It costs a fortune and that money would be much better spent on other things like equiment and recruiting players, then eventually adding youth and/or womens teams.

Time for USA to consilidate and focus on the grassroots rather than crazy ideas that are a century ahead of their time. 

This. America is HUGE. California and Florida have huge populations and huge cities. State/regional leagues and a national/continental playoff (perhaps held in one location to save money) could save loads of travel costs and be more attractive considering the level they're at.

Regular internationals between Canada, Jamaica and USA plus some of the European nations could help keep those of a higher level interested. But sporadic matches organised at a whim that are nothing but glorified friendlies aren't going to build anything.

[Smudger06]

Don't forget, these states are also big, for example, Florida alone is about the size of England. What they need is a series of Leagues on the model of the Auckland RL & the old Brisbane RL. So about 6 teams in each, all within a couple of hours road trip (at most) of each other. 

Don't have a national Playoffs, instead have a Champions League type comp, for the Chsmpions of each of these Lesgues, held the following season. This CL type comp could be played at neutral centralised venues spaced out through the next season. Then bring in a State of Orgin  if there's 16 Leagues, in 16 US States, that could turn into something pretty good.

Basically travel costs are pretty demanding not just nationally but also within state, both in time and money. 

[Whippet13]

Good to see Eddy Pettybourne has quickly found himself something else to do this summer following the demise of the NARL: https://www.loverugbyleague.com/post/eddy-pettybourne-links-up-with-red-star-belgrade/

[Izmir Zaferi]

Two games have been played between NARL teams and USARL teams so far. 

The NARL teams have obliterated the USARL teams. What this does show is the ability to really increase the standard of RL nearly overnight in the USA. 

The NARL teams will continue even if not in the same shape this year. 

DC Cavalry (NARL) v Philly (USARL)- 86 - 6

Atlanta (NARL) v Delaware (USARL) - 76 - 6 ? (Something like that) 

[GUBRATS]

18 minutes ago, Izmir Zaferi said:

Two games have been played between NARL teams and USARL teams so far. 

The NARL teams have obliterated the USARL teams. What this does show is the ability to really increase the standard of RL nearly overnight in the USA. 

The NARL teams will continue even if not in the same shape this year. 

DC Cavalry (NARL) v Philly (USARL)- 86 - 6

Atlanta (NARL) v Delaware (USARL) - 76 - 6 ? (Something like that) 

It would be interesting to see the makeup of the teams involved 

[langpark]

1 hour ago, Izmir Zaferi said:

Two games have been played between NARL teams and USARL teams so far. 

The NARL teams have obliterated the USARL teams. What this does show is the ability to really increase the standard of RL nearly overnight in the USA. 

The NARL teams will continue even if not in the same shape this year. 

DC Cavalry (NARL) v Philly (USARL)- 86 - 6

Atlanta (NARL) v Delaware (USARL) - 76 - 6 ? (Something like that) 

I am not convinced about your theory, though it is possible. 

Cleveland were on the receiving end of a similar score a few months ago against North Virginia and would probably not have improved much over these few months (let alone "overnight") given that no imports or marquee players will be coming in. 

[Izmir Zaferi]

1 hour ago, langpark said:

I am not convinced about your theory, though it is possible. 

Cleveland were on the receiving end of a similar score a few months ago against North Virginia and would probably not have improved much over these few months (let alone "overnight") given that no imports or marquee players will be coming in. 

İt will be interesting to see the development of Cleveland. The advantage of the other NARL teams that I am not sure of with Cleveland is that they have all recruitment top athletes from Rugby Union and even American Football.

[Sammo]

6 minutes ago, Izmir Zaferi said:

İt will be interesting to see the development of Cleveland. The advantage of the other NARL teams that I am not sure of with Cleveland is that they have all recruitment top athletes from Rugby Union and even American Football.

I’m not sure I would describe any of the Union players brought across as ‘top athletes’, mostly they have been MLR squad players at best, some of whom never even made a regular season appearance.

[Cumbrian Mackem]

17 minutes ago, Sammo said:

I’m not sure I would describe any of the Union players brought across as ‘top athletes’, mostly they have been MLR squad players at best, some of whom never even made a regular season appearance.

Compared to the league players they might be having come from a professional union competition in MLR.

[Damien]

On 05/06/2021 at 06:51, gingerjon said:

"One of the reasons for that decision was that two of the three people originally appointed to source additional sponsorships for the league pulled out at the eleventh hour."

So the money was never there and these guys weren't investors.

That's the most annoying thing reading that. If the money was there and people pulled out that's one thing but this certainly doesn't sound like that. It sounds like the money was never there and they were hoping to entice investors through the initial hype. That's real wing and a prayer stuff. 

[Big Picture]

55 minutes ago, Damien said:

That's the most annoying thing reading that. If the money was there and people pulled out that's one thing but this certainly doesn't sound like that. It sounds like the money was never there and they were hoping to entice investors through the initial hype. That's real wing and a prayer stuff. 

I highly doubt that it was there.  I saw a video on Facebook a little while ago now of Rob Curtis speaking to the players at (if I recall correctly) Cleveland's combine.  He told them that he decided to get involved because the league's principals "cashed in their mortgages and their kids' education funds" for this.  That doesn't really sound like well-heeled backers does it?

[thebrewxi]

1 hour ago, Damien said:

That's the most annoying thing reading that. If the money was there and people pulled out that's one thing but this certainly doesn't sound like that. It sounds like the money was never there and they were hoping to entice investors through the initial hype. That's real wing and a prayer stuff. 

Particularly as the hype and marketing was all pretty lame. One of the main social media videos was just that rib curtis guy in a gym, stepping off some weights, and saying how great it was going to be. The club logos were mainly poor. The website rubbish and mainly illegible. And the statements being made about details on various podcasts by the main organisers confusing, at best. 

If that was their shot at bringing money in that vital for it to go ahead, it really does come across as wing and a prayer stuff 

Has anyone heard how chasing g kangaroos or Rugby League in the Americas people have come out about this yet? I've not spotted it  but interesting how supportive they were, and disparaging about Usarl in terms of the latter.

[langpark]

2 hours ago, thebrewxi said:

Has anyone heard how chasing g kangaroos or Rugby League in the Americas people have come out about this yet? I've not spotted it  but interesting how supportive they were, and disparaging about Usarl in terms of the latter.

That nate fella seems to disappear for months on end, re-emerge, disappear and so on. Right now it seems he is in the disappeared stage of his cycle, as his social media pages show he has not posted any content since January.

[TheReaper]

16 hours ago, Izmir Zaferi said:

Two games have been played between NARL teams and USARL teams so far. 

The NARL teams have obliterated the USARL teams. What this does show is the ability to really increase the standard of RL nearly overnight in the USA. 

The NARL teams will continue even if not in the same shape this year. 

DC Cavalry (NARL) v Philly (USARL)- 86 - 6

Atlanta (NARL) v Delaware (USARL) - 76 - 6 ? (Something like that) 

I would suspect that it has more to do with the type of preseason each team was having. One team preparing for professional level and the other for a more typical amateur club season. 

[Lowdesert]

20 hours ago, Sammo said:

I’m not sure I would describe any of the Union players brought across as ‘top athletes’, mostly they have been MLR squad players at best, some of whom never even made a regular season appearance.

These shouldn’t be neglected.  Quite the opposite.  RU is a different game, requiring different skills.  If it was the case that top ru players were a requirement then we would never have had some of the marvellous cross code players RL has had. 

[Sammo]

38 minutes ago, Lowdesert said:

These shouldn’t be neglected.  Quite the opposite.  RU is a different game, requiring different skills.  If it was the case that top ru players were a requirement then we would never have had some of the marvellous cross code players RL has had. 

Agreed completely, but describing them as ‘top athletes’ is disingenuous - they aren’t. They are former semi-pro union players. There may be some good or very good athletes among them, but I don’t think you would describe even the standout MLR players as ‘top athletes’

[RP London]

On 05/06/2021 at 06:51, gingerjon said:

"One of the reasons for that decision was that two of the three people originally appointed to source additional sponsorships for the league pulled out at the eleventh hour."

So the money was never there and these guys weren't investors.

It almost sounds as though they have read some of the posts that have been on this forum on how American Franchise leagues work (pay to be a part of it etc) and thought "ooh i'll have some of that" and just set it up rather than doing the leg work to do things properly. 

Bad timing, definitely, with a global pandemic but terrible planning by the sounds of it and desperate to get it going far far too early. This should have been "set up" and announced as the plan with "we are inviting bids for a start in 2022 or 2023" as the main thrust and they can then spend time getting the money involved and getting people to bid to buy teams entry etc. 

[RP London]

On 04/06/2021 at 13:40, Hello said:

I don't disagree with anything that you say but I repeat, once again, I haven't blamed the current apparent failure of this league on fans, I have never claimed that this league was definitely going to be a success (on the contrary I thought there was lot to prove), I simply pointed out that a lot on here are very negative about expansion and I find it hard to believe that anyone can seriously disagree with that, whilst recognising that by contrast many others are positive about expansion. I'm not going to repeat myself any more times cos my fingers are starting to turn arthritic

 

 

I have many a disagreement on here about expansion with people but it is very very rare I would blanket suggest that that person does not want to see any expansion. There are people who are very wary of expansion efforts and i understand that and there are many that just cannot see how they are going to work. 

My thoughts tend to be that IF lessons are learnt from the past then there is no reason expansion cannot happen but so often we find that those lessons are not being learnt. 

Those people i tend to "disagree" with are often looking at it with a "they wont learn" hat on where as i hope they do. When these things fail we are both normally correct as they havent learnt. Toronto was the only one where i have seen "glee" around failure and a lot of that was because of the tone of the conversation that was had around it on this board but also the tone that was coming from Toronto. Personally i dont mind trumpet blowing and it can be a very good weapon but I know it also winds people up the wrong way and if you fall they will laugh louder because of it. However, I also know that those same people were sorry for those that would lose their team and a sport they had grown to enjoy. 

I personally think you are wide of the mark on this and that some may be saying it with a little "high horsedness" of "i knew it!" but there is still no glee in it.

[Dave T]

On 05/06/2021 at 00:42, yipyee said:

I would counter that as not all fans want growth, or to rephrase, a lot of fans want growth as long as its at a lower level to their club, this is therefore not adequate growth.

For example Newcastles / NE growth is praised by all but as doon as Newcastle start to properly challenge they will become another Toronto, Toulouse, Crusaders in peoples eyes!

This is just false narrative that is being created so some RL fans can moan about other RL fans. People keep repeating it and it becomes a 'truth' that just isn't the case. 

 I mean let's think it through, why would anybody begrudge a team starting from scratch, doing well, getting promotion and being successful. 

I mean how much hatred do Coventry, Newcastle etc actually get?

Where we do have an issue is when clubs get what is seen as preferential treatment. Plenty of people just don't buy into licensing, franchising, call it whatever you want. Plenty of people don't see the benefits of teams from the other side of the world in the UK pyramid. I don't share those views, but they are fair and valid viewpoints.  

The real division and controversy around all this started in 1995 when clubs were excluded from the top division and Paris and London were elevated. It was all done so clumsily, and we continued to be clumsy around licensing and new teams into the structure ever since. 

People being peed off with that shouldn't be confused with a dislike of new areas playing RL.

To bring it back to the NARL - have a look at the long thread that has now been blocked - the chippiness was not from people slating the NARL, it was from people championing the NARL and slating SL - saying they will soon have a comp that rivals SL and that SL will see it as a missed opportunity etc. The constant attacks on RL fans is tiresome.

[Lowdesert]

2 hours ago, Sammo said:

Agreed completely, but describing them as ‘top athletes’ is disingenuous - they aren’t. They are former semi-pro union players. There may be some good or very good athletes among them, but I don’t think you would describe even the standout MLR players as ‘top athletes’

Hull signed Naulogo from RU.  Top athlete who burned many wingers in his first year but since has gone back to RU for a better pay check.  We also have another Fijian , with a long name! who is learning the game but is a real athlete.  

With the challenges RL has in paying champagne players with beer money, these are the guys we need to be signing.  

 

[Robin Evans]

On 04/06/2021 at 07:16, GUBRATS said:

Fairly sure I saw ' Ace ' Rimmer wearing a Toronto jacket on Red Dwarf a decade ago

Smmmmeeeeeeeg heeeeeeedddddd

[Sammo]

38 minutes ago, Lowdesert said:

Hull signed Naulogo from RU.  Top athlete who burned many wingers in his first year but since has gone back to RU for a better pay check.  We also have another Fijian , with a long name! who is learning the game but is a real athlete.  

With the challenges RL has in paying champagne players with beer money, these are the guys we need to be signing.  

 

I’m talking exclusively about NARL, not denying that it happens in Super League or NRL. Also not denying that they are the guys that need to be signed, only saying that calling the NARL ‘union’ signings top athletes would be wrong

[Cumbrian Mackem]

18 minutes ago, Sammo said:

I’m talking exclusively about NARL, not denying that it happens in Super League or NRL. Also not denying that they are the guys that need to be signed, only saying that calling the NARL ‘union’ signings top athletes would be wrong

I think you’re confusing the term “athlete” with “talented”. There must be tens of thousands of “athletes” leaving the US college system every year but a tiny fraction of them would be considered “talented” Rugby players largely due to them not being exposed to the game of either format.