Rugby League World Cup 2021 (Merged Threads)

[Griff]

7 minutes ago, The Rocket said:

Talks a lot about loving to play for Fiji  and he`s available any time but then mentions Cleary(coach) saying he doesn`t want them to go and a lot of evasive stuff about effects on his family etc. etc.

I

Club v Country is a long-standing battle.

Nothing to do with Covid, other than it's given Cleary another bullet to fire

[dkw]

16 minutes ago, FearTheVee said:

People keep saying this but we don't have the rates post "Freedom Day" - one would expect them to go back up at least briefly before falling again.

People keep saying it because its true, rates are dropping quite significantly. As for your second part, what are you basing that on?

[Dunbar]

7 minutes ago, The Rocket said:

 

About 6 minutes & 30 seconds into this interview the interviewer finally gets around to asking Kikau about his thoughts on participating in the WC.

Talks a lot about loving to play for Fiji  and he`s available any time but then mentions Cleary(coach) saying he doesn`t want them to go and a lot of evasive stuff about effects on his family etc. etc.

It looks very much to me like they`ve been got to and will tow the line, and this is from a bloke, given his age, who will never get another chance again. He does sound disappointed but also resigned.

I sat the whole way through this interminable piece because being on the NRL website I was intrigued to see what he would say, and you don`t get a much bigger star player than Viliame, I should have known.

NRL 2021: Viliame Kikau talks GF rematch, Cleary return and World Cup on Inside The NRL - NRL

 

 

 

I thought that was a pretty sad video to watch.  It was a player who would clearly love to go to the World Cup and play for his country but who was also terrified of saying anything that would go against what his club or coach had stated.

If players like Kikau are being bullied into not playing in a World Cup - the pinnacle of an international sport - then people need to take a good long hard look at themselves because it simply isn't right.

[Cheshire Setter]

18 minutes ago, FearTheVee said:

People keep saying this but we don't have the rates post "Freedom Day" - one would expect them to go back up at least briefly before falling again.

I don’t know about where you were on ‘Freedom Day’ but I was in several locations during that day and since. Things have changed very little. Most wear masks indoors and distance respectfully.

None of that really matters anyway. We’re about as vaccinated as we can hope to be, and the ones awaiting their second dose are statistically very unlikely to be affected by COVID. We have to open up at some stage, and whenever that is, case numbers will rise. It’s deaths and the NHS pressure that really count, and both are relatively low.

[FearTheVee]

6 minutes ago, dkw said:

People keep saying it because its true, rates are dropping quite significantly. As for your second part, what are you basing that on?

A relaxation in restrictions designed to curb circulation of the virus?

I'm on the same side of this as you but saying our (very high) rates are falling when they don't yet reflect the changes in restrictions that have been relatively widely blasted is a bit premature IMO.

Edited July 26, 2021 by FearTheVee

[Man of Kent]

Troy Grant speaks https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/episode-133-troy-grant/id1392281329?i=1000530024945

Italy is ready to step into the breach in the women's tournament. Maori and Indigenous also a possibility (as with the men).

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

14 minutes ago, Southerner said:

This so called risk to the players…… does anyone know of any player that has become seriously ill or lost their life due to covid? 

This is the joke bit.... The average age of a Covid death is 82.....20 something NRL players would not even know they had it without a test

 

[FearTheVee]

2 minutes ago, Cheshire Setter said:

I don’t know about where you were on ‘Freedom Day’ but I was in several locations during that day and since. Things have changed very little. Most wear masks indoors and distance respectfully.

None of that really matters anyway. We’re about as vaccinated as we can hope to be, and the ones awaiting their second dose are statistically very unlikely to be affected by COVID. We have to open up at some stage, and whenever that is, case numbers will rise. It’s deaths and the NHS pressure that really count, and both are relatively low.

I know that - but playing devil's advocate we are talking about the view of people from a population that doens't have the same high vaccination rate and the accompanying acceptance of a level of infections as just normal life.

Of course it's not about Covid anyway, but the reality is we don't know where the rates will go in the short-term so saying they are trending down is premature IMO (but hopefully continues to be true).

[The Rocket]

5 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I thought that was a pretty sad video to watch.  It was a player who would clearly love to go to the World Cup and play for his country but who was also terrified of saying anything that would go against what his club or coach had stated.

If players like Kikau are being bullied into not playing in a World Cup - the pinnacle of an international sport - then people need to take a good long hard look at themselves because it simply isn't right.

I`m really ###### off with Ivan Cleary to be honest. Imagine actively discouraging a young bloke under his tutelage from missing out on a once in a life time experience, it is so bloody selfish I`m dumbfounded. It`s just plain wrong.

One day Kikau and all the other blokes who will miss out on this will look back on this episode and realise they`ve been duped.

 Cleary was a bog average player who I hope goes down as a bog average coach.

 I `m on board the Wayne Bennett`s Rabbitohs band wagon now, the only bloke who will be able to hold his head up after this, everyone else has just covered themselves with shame.

[Gerrumonside ref]

49 minutes ago, Griff said:

The furore is not about them not competing, per se.

It's about the betrayal of entering and then withdrawing at short notice, after arrangements have been made.

It's more akin to your star player saying he'll turn up on Saturday and then you find he's gone to the pub with his girlfriend.

It's about honour - something the Aussies don't seem to understand.

I did mention that in my post to be honest.

And I mean the wider furore not the one by the rugby league hardcore.

If two minor playing nations had bowed out there wouldn’t be anything like the publicity.

Edited July 26, 2021 by Gerrumonside ref

[DavidM]

37 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I thought that was a pretty sad video to watch.  It was a player who would clearly love to go to the World Cup and play for his country but who was also terrified of saying anything that would go against what his club or coach had stated.

If players like Kikau are being bullied into not playing in a World Cup - the pinnacle of an international sport - then people need to take a good long hard look at themselves because it simply isn't right.

What can Penrith do to Kikau ? Nothing . They need him more than he needs them . I agree , the players - especially high profile ones - need to draw a line in the sand , back up the words they’ve spoken before regarding what playing for their island nations means to them , and tell the clubs what’s happening rather than the other way round . 

[Whippet13]

36 minutes ago, The Rocket said:

I`m really ###### off with Ivan Cleary to be honest. Imagine actively discouraging a young bloke under his tutelage from missing out on a once in a life time experience, it is so bloody selfish I`m dumbfounded. It`s just plain wrong.

One day Kikau and all the other blokes who will miss out on this will look back on this episode and realise they`ve been duped.

 Cleary was a bog average player who I hope goes down as a bog average coach.

 I `m on board the Wayne Bennett`s Rabbitohs band wagon now, the only bloke who will be able to hold his head up after this, everyone else has just covered themselves with shame.

Kikau seemed unaware of Cleary's comments and surprised right at the start. He said he'd have to talk to his coach and wife about it. I got the impression it was more about the impact on his personal life from being away for another 6 weeks which would sway his decision and that's fair enough. 

But yeah, Cleary's behaviour is utterly reprehensible.

[Big Picture]

58 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

Troy Grant speaks https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/episode-133-troy-grant/id1392281329?i=1000530024945

Italy is ready to step into the breach in the women's tournament. Maori and Indigenous also a possibility (as with the men).

I note that that he thinks the damage will affect both 2025 and RL's chances of getting into the Brisbane Olympics as a demonstration sport, but it can be contained and/or repaired if the tournament goes ahead.

[jacksy]

I was rooting for the Panthers but not anymore.

Come Saturday i hope that horrible bunch from Melbourne stuff them.

Fingers crossed for the Rabbits for the GF.

[The Rocket]

6 minutes ago, Whippet13 said:

But yeah, Cleary's behaviour is utterly reprehensible.

Could be one of the biggest years of Kikau`s life, they will probably play a GF, could of topped it off by going to England and having the experience of his life and if Cleary was so worried about his welfare let him come back to pre-season late and ease him into the new season, been done plenty of times before. That`d be how a coach would generate loyalty.

What`s happened will slowly dawn on these players, especially as they see the cases start to come down in England, which they are dramatically, at some point the players are going to think whos welfare was Cleary interested in and we was robbed.

 

[JohnM]

Well just fancy that. Horsemeat Vlandis hands another publicity opportunity to union.

Tuivasa-Sheck is hopeful of forcing his way on to the planned end-of-year European Tour with the All Blacks

https://www.totalrl.com/forums/index.php?/topic/362971-roger-tuivasa-sheck-quits-the-nrl-to-play-union-for-nz-union

 

[EastLondonMike]

There are a couple of very emotional videos on youtube on the paths Viliame Kikau and Maika Sivo have taken to get to where they are. The struggles and family sacrifices that have helped them achieve what they have so far in their careers.

I would like to think pulling on a Fiji jersey in a World Cup and representing their country and families., a World Cup that isn't beyond them, is more important than an NRL pre-season.

Same goes for the likes of Justin Olam, Tui Kamikamika and many others.

[RP London]

19 minutes ago, EastLondonMike said:

There are a couple of very emotional videos on youtube on the paths Viliame Kikau and Maika Sivo have taken to get to where they are. The struggles and family sacrifices that have helped them achieve what they have so far in their careers.

I would like to think pulling on a Fiji jersey in a World Cup and representing their country and families., a World Cup that isn't beyond them, is more important than an NRL pre-season.

Same goes for the likes of Justin Olam, Tui Kamikamika and many others.

I would like to think pulling on a Fiji jersey in a World Cup and representing their country and families., a World Cup that isn't beyond them, is more important than an NRL pre-season.

just to highlight the bit i like in your post... that is exactly what this boils down to, no more no less.. and it stinks that these players will feel pressure from the coaches to make a hard decision, one that is probably tough on them anyway with families, they need the support of the coaches and their clubs not the pressure they are getting.. that would be looking after player welfare not all this sh*t that V'landys has stirred up!

[Scubby]

13 minutes ago, RP London said:

I would like to think pulling on a Fiji jersey in a World Cup and representing their country and families., a World Cup that isn't beyond them, is more important than an NRL pre-season.

just to highlight the bit i like in your post... that is exactly what this boils down to, no more no less.. and it stinks that these players will feel pressure from the coaches to make a hard decision, one that is probably tough on them anyway with families, they need the support of the coaches and their clubs not the pressure they are getting.. that would be looking after player welfare not all this sh*t that V'landys has stirred up!

These same coaches enjoy watching Euro 2020 and the Olympics. There is no higher honour than representing your country in any sport! This is not the NFL, MLB or AFL these guys can play international competition. Who would actually deny them when it is written into every NRL contract?

Edited July 26, 2021 by Scubby

[Big Picture]

19 minutes ago, Scubby said:

These same coaches enjoy watching Euro 2020 and the Olympics. There is no higher honour than representing your country in any sport! This is not the NFL, MLB or AFL these guys can play international competition. Who would actually deny them when it is written into every NRL contract?

MLB players can and have played in international competition too, MLB even created one for that very purpose known as the World Baseball Classic which is sanctioned by the World Baseball Softball Confederation.  Gridiron and Aussie Rules stand out as just about the only major team sports which don't have international competition.

Edited July 26, 2021 by Big Picture

[fighting irish]

1 hour ago, The Rocket said:

I`m really ###### off with Ivan Cleary to be honest. Imagine actively discouraging a young bloke under his tutelage from missing out on a once in a life time experience, it is so bloody selfish I`m dumbfounded. It`s just plain wrong.

One day Kikau and all the other blokes who will miss out on this will look back on this episode and realise they`ve been duped.

 Cleary was a bog average player who I hope goes down as a bog average coach.

 I `m on board the Wayne Bennett`s Rabbitohs band wagon now, the only bloke who will be able to hold his head up after this, everyone else has just covered themselves with shame.

 

58 minutes ago, The Rocket said:

Could be one of the biggest years of Kikau`s life, they will probably play a GF, could of topped it off by going to England and having the experience of his life and if Cleary was so worried about his welfare let him come back to pre-season late and ease him into the new season, been done plenty of times before. That`d be how a coach would generate loyalty.

What`s happened will slowly dawn on these players, especially as they see the cases start to come down in England, which they are dramatically, at some point the players are going to think whos welfare was Cleary interested in and we was robbed.

 

 

29 minutes ago, RP London said:

I would like to think pulling on a Fiji jersey in a World Cup and representing their country and families., a World Cup that isn't beyond them, is more important than an NRL pre-season.

 

16 minutes ago, Scubby said:

These same coaches enjoy watching Euro 2020 and the Olympics. There is no higher honour than representing your country in any sport! This is not the NFL, MLB or AFL these guys can play international competition. Who would actually deny them when it is written into every NRL contract?

Those who control the flow of information, control the world. By the time the players realise, it'll be way too late.

Rocket?, RP? Scubby? What can we do, to keep getting this message, (that the ARLC are being utterly dishonest and deceitful and grossly exceeding their authority), out into the public domain in Australia and New Zealand?

The press are virtually silent on the subject, certainly not unbiased.

Can't the AFL be provoked into voicing this kind of criticism? 

[gingerjon]

13 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

MLB players can and have played in international competition too, MLB even created one for that very purpose known as the World Baseball Classic which is sanctioned by the World Baseball Softball Confederation.  Gridiron and Aussie Rules stand out as just about the only major team sports which don't have international competition.

There’s literally baseball matches going on in the Olympics today as well.

It’s not necessarily the biggest deal for the US team but it’s a huge one for Japan, Korea and the rest.

[RP London]

17 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

MLB players can and have played in international competition too, MLB even created one for that very purpose known as the World Baseball Classic which is sanctioned by the World Baseball Softball Confederation.  Gridiron and Aussie Rules stand out as just about the only major team sports which don't have international competition.

i believe there is also an international american football association who organise a world championship but not sure of the standard etc.

[graveyard johnny]

well said elliott whitehead - got to feel the players have been duped after his statement

[The Rocket]

2 minutes ago, fighting irish said:

Can't the AFL be provoked into voicing this kind of criticism? 

Mate it`s playing right into the alf`s lap by making us look as provincial as them.

There was a stack of afl players at the union test the other night. When your young and a talented sportsperson your going to look at things like those internationals and think crickey I`d like to be part of that, I might have a crack at union as well as afl.

You`d know it`s not uncommon for talented kids to play multiple sports, christ Tommy T. was invited to the Swans( afl) academy but stuck with League, who knows maybe because he thought he might play in a WC one day or go on  Kangaroo tour.

V`landy`s even said earlier in the year that we need another team in QLD because we don`t want blokes like Cam Munster playing afl. well Pete, the same thing applies to union and their international calendar.