Jump to content

So What's The Plan From Here?


Recommended Posts

If nothing else, recent developments have exposed the fragility of Northern Hemisphere RL. It's in need of strong leadership and from that effective planning. Any successful enterprise has a plan. Southern Hemisphere RL could walk away and do its own thing or even take over the whole sport. NH RL is looking weak and going downhill. I am wondering what's the plan from here?

When a team formed in Canada, it had the chance through promotion to make SL. What sort of funding would it get on achieving that goal? They must have thought they would get full support in SL but no clear assurances were given. Upon reaching SL, it was denied any funding on the assumption the owner had bottomless pockets. That assumption was starkly exposed and thousands of new RL fans were treated as nothing more than collateral damage. An amazing opportunity to expand into North America handed on a plate crushed.

What's the plan with France, an established RL nation? Sports clubs are businesses and need to plan ahead. Toulouse can get to SL through promotion but will they get full funding if successful? Will they be exempt from relegation for a few years like the Catalan team was? Why can't a soundly based club like Toulouse be told now they are in going to be in SL next year so they can start planning with that in mind? Expecting Championship clubs to hit the ground running with little preparation doesn't work so well. Also, what's the number of SL clubs are the planners working toward and on what timescale? 

What's the international calendar looking like in the NH? What test series are planned for 2022, 2023 etc? Will England start to see that a stronger NH international scene needs to be cultivated? 

SL is a knee jerk operation. The weaker it becomes financially, the more it will have to be reactive to try save itself. Planning will become a luxury it cannot afford. England's dismissive attitude to the likes of France and the other home nations is coming back to bite them. The SH doesn't need England anymore, as Phil Gould rightly points out. 

So does NH RL have a plan to strengthen itself? Or is it a case of world RL becoming under the authority of Australia and what it sees as best? Without a plan, it will be the latter. 

  • Like 3

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites


But is the Southern Hemisphere any better? I just see parochialism and self gratification, you are a big fish in a very little pond globally but you don't seem to recognise that?

The plan from here should be a Covid secure World Cup, to start the ball rolling on a new inclusive world wide promotion of Rugby League, not to satisfy the worries of the NRL, which are not Covid related, but more a worry about not being the main instigator of the a very well organised World Cup which will strengthen the international game but not the NRL.

Likewise in Super League, the people at the top of the sport who think that the sport does not need to grow further than the M62, it really does need to expand, to the southern parts of the UK,  to Scotland , Wales and Ireland and beyond with support for France and a fledgling North America, there is room to expand alongside these nation's established sports.  I see lots of little acorns, but not many big trees!

Also to the NRL, invest more in Tonga,Samoa, Fiji, believe me, the nations are the ones that people remember in a World Cup, not always the winners or the big nations.

People need to be their heads banged together to act for the good of the game, not for their own little empires, which, believe it or not, are just very minor against the other sporting organisations on the planet........understand your place in the sporing cosmos and act accordingly..........I almost feel embarrassed to say this because it is pretty obvious and has been for a long time.

Edited by The Alchemist
  • Like 1
Even though our utter, unquestioned dominance in the sport has ended, all Wiganers believe that we are really just indulgently letting the other teams win for a while in order to make it more interesting.

Stuart Maconie, Cider with Roadies

"cause people often talk about being scared of change but for me I'm more afraid of things staying the same cause the game is never won by standing in any one place for too long"

Nick Cave

Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, The Alchemist said:

But is the Southern Hemisphere any better? I just see parochialism and self gratification, you are a big fish in a very little pond globally but you don't seem to recognise that?

...People need to be their heads banged together to act for the good of the game, not for their own little empires, 

The AFL is a sport in it's own little pond and survives remarkably well. People in big countries are less likely to have a global view.

The only time people don't put their own little empires first is when they can't. FIFA runs soccer with an iron fist and even huge leagues and clubs with enormous financial backing won't stand up to FIFA or UEFA. Even for international friendlies multi million (or billion) competitions come to a grinding halt. They don't like it but they lump it.

The RLIF is being humiliated at the moment and there's nothing they can do about it. FIFA can hit any recalcitrant hard but the ARLC would just laugh if the RLIF federation tried that.

That's why I ask what the NH plan is from here? This is a power game and the NH needs to know where it needs to be and plan accordingly.

  • Like 1

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, RayCee said:

The RLIF is being humiliated at the moment and there's nothing they can do about it. FIFA can hit any recalcitrant hard but the ARLC would just laugh if the RLIF federation tried that.

That's why I ask what the NH plan is from here? This is a power game and the NH needs to know where it needs to be and plan accordingly.

Quite simply the answer is that there is no NH plan.  The idea that anyone in the game in the northern hemisphere is capable of making a plan to get it out of the mess it's in is fanciful, the reason why they've relied on the same old, same old for so long is (as the worries about Toronto and "no away fans" showed) that's all they know.  They have their hands completely full trying to keep what they have afloat, they have no time or energy to give to working out how to grow it. 

Even if that wasn't the case, any plan would need money and lot of it, but because the traditional pro clubs are all located in smallish, run down, economically disadvantaged towns they have no access to the sort of money needed to support a big time pro sports operation because it's not anywhere near those towns and they can't extend their reach to the places where it is.  England looks to Australia and New Zealand rather than to France and other countries closer to home because Australia and New Zealand are the only opponents they can make money from playing.  Now that those matches don't have the same benefit for Australia and New Zealand which they once did the English game is truly in dire straits.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I see two paths for NH Rugby League.

1) Race against Time. This scenario assumes current level of funding is maintained.

Toulouse enter the Super League next year and that brings to 6 the number of clubs that are sufficiently resourced to provide the basis of a future genuine Super League competition. Given this scenario the RFL are able to convince your broadcaster to maintain the current level of funding until such time as Newcastle then maybe York have reached a sufficient size to be teams 7 and 8.

If the RFL can survive long enough for this to happen it may then be in a position to start to demand more from your broadcaster. If they are able to achieve an increase in funding then a strategic plan will have been formulated about where the next club to be encouraged will be, maybe a Welsh club or maybe another club in France, whoever it is, it has to offer the prospect of expanding the footprint of Rugby League in terms of participation, off-field revenue and followers .i.e. eyeballs. 

I`m not talking starting new clubs, it will have to be an ambitious existing club that can show that it has something to offer.

In the meantime the competition will have to limp along with 6 stronger and 6 weaker clubs.

2) The well runs dry.

Your broadcaster after having witnessed the fiascos that have plagued the game the last few years see no future for the sport apart from perhaps from being played in a few towns and villages dotted around the north of England and they cut their broadcast deal accordingly, most Super League teams go part-time.

The NRL seeing no value in having the game die off in the northern hemisphere approach the RFL with an offer to fund a 10 or 12 team Super League with a grant of $ 2m ( 1.1m pound ) per club to supplement the remaining TV deal.

The cost to the NRL will be about $30 m per year. There will be serious strings attached.

The rebuild will begin.

 

Edited by The Rocket
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

York have a hundred year record of not being a strong club. They're well funded at the moment but not performing as well as expected.  I don't see why York are constantly held up as potential $uperleague prospects.

Edited by Griff
  • Like 4
  • Thanks 1

"We'll sell you a seat .... but you'll only need the edge of it!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, Griff said:

York have a hundred year record of not being a strong club. They're well funded at the moment but not performing as well as expected.  I don't see why York are constantly held up as potential $uperleague prospects.

Point taken Griff but rather than the 100 year record, what is the current management like? If given a chance, would they take it and have the potential to do well? I think the fact it has a sizable population catchment that is appealing to many. I don't know enough about the club to know. 

My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, RayCee said:

Point taken Griff but rather than the 100 year record, what is the current management like? If given a chance, would they take it and have the potential to do well? I think the fact it has a sizable population catchment that is appealing to many. I don't know enough about the club to know. 

Let's see where they are in five years time.  When they have a longer track record. When Covid doesn't cloud the issue.

"We'll sell you a seat .... but you'll only need the edge of it!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, RayCee said:

Point taken Griff but rather than the 100 year record, what is the current management like? If given a chance, would they take it and have the potential to do well? I think the fact it has a sizable population catchment that is appealing to many. I don't know enough about the club to know. 

There are upsides and downsides to York as an organisation. Under the previous Chairman and setup it was obviously a downside. Currently financially they are stable a downside is a share in an expensive stadium project although the upside is the stadium and having a place to play. If the football club struggles financially for any longer it will have an added impact to the Rugby League side.

This season they have a set of players not a team. Since promotion from League 1 and building up the idea was to build from the foundations upwards with a strong work ethic and team focused with youngsters coming through. This season they tried to buy success and it failed bringing in the likes of Ryan Atkins (quality in Super League) however the team hasn't gelled. There has been a big switch to the women's side with England Internationals and 1/2 of Cas side being brought in which just happens to happen in the year when they are hosting the women's World Cup semi finals, it will be interesting to see how long that budget lasts for. Back to the men's team their isn't a junior setup they run an "elite academy" which usually sees them nick 3 or 4 players from Heworth send them back to Heworth and have them compete to try and get in the first team later. 

The club is better run but it is still a part time side with no academy. With a full time coach with no experience of coaching full time teams. Although nice facilities, York are a worse prospect than Newcastle or London. 

Edited by BridBeachRL
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, BridBeachRL said:

There are upsides and downsides to York as an organisation. Under the previous Chairman and setup it was obviously a downside. Currently financially they are stable a downside is a share in an expensive stadium project although the upside is the stadium and having a place to play. If the football club struggles financially for any longer it will have an added impact to the Rugby League side.

This season they have a set of players not a team. Since promotion from League 1 and building up the idea was to build from the foundations upwards with a strong work ethic and team focused with youngsters coming through. This season they tried to buy success and it failed bringing in the likes of Ryan Atkins (quality in Super League) however the team hasn't gelled. There has been a big switch to the women's side with England Internationals and 1/2 of Cas side being brought in which just happens to happen in the year when they are hosting the women's World Cup semi finals, it will be interesting to see how long that budget lasts for. Back to the men's team their isn't a junior setup they run an "elite academy" which usually sees them nick 3 or 4 players from Heworth send them back to Heworth and have them compete to try and get in the first team later. 

The club is better run but it is still a part time side with no academy. With a full time coach with no experience of coaching full time teams. Although nice facilities, York are a worse prospect than Newcastle or London. 

London with crowds of 200??? Newcastle are doing well, but let them establish themselves in the Championship first. Also letting teams in on bloc, where will all the players come from?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

We're back to this notion of having $uperleague teams where we'd like them to be.

Paris, Barcelona, Milan, New York .......

  • Like 1

"We'll sell you a seat .... but you'll only need the edge of it!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, Griff said:

We're back to this notion of having $uperleague teams where we'd like them to be.

Paris, Barcelona, Milan, New York .......

And how is NOT having SL teams like that working out?

Seems to me as if NH RL is in a vulnerable position whereby the Australia RL can decide to pull out of the WC because they value their domestic competition more. Oh they did. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Omott91 said:

The sooner the NRL takes a stake in Super league the better.

They’d just asset strip it, the WC decision has proven what we all suspected, that they have zero interest in the game outside Australia. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

35 minutes ago, Johnoco said:

And how is NOT having SL teams like that working out?

Seems to me as if NH RL is in a vulnerable position whereby the Australia RL can decide to pull out of the WC because they value their domestic competition more. Oh they did. 

We had one in Paris. 

It lasted two years.

"We'll sell you a seat .... but you'll only need the edge of it!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ive long held the view that RL is dying on its feet but that feels like saying its going to snow at Christmas this year !  We stagger on as a sport with inept people running the game into the ground with some on tremendous salaries that a small time game like ours cannot afford im sure.

There appears to be zero vision and zero optomism in the game since Lewis departed , ive totally given up on the sport and rarely read anything about it anymore;its the same old same old as we slide down the slippery slope.

We have very little credibility ,cash or influence and we are virtually invisible as a sport to the British public; our only nationally recognised person is Kevin Sinfield who is jumping ship .

Unless the Aussies grab us and try make something of us I fear its going to snow at Christmas very soon.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Johnoco said:

Do you consider that to have been done properly?

They made a real pigs ear of Paris , you get idiots who say we have done that and failed whilst not thinking what could we have done better

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's clear the game is in ruins and it's a case of rebuild, or die.

There's a lot to be done surely, but I think we need one fundamental principle in place before anything else.

We need a warm willingness to engage with newcomers, the world over.

This is the function (and the value) of an independent IRL. A body who's remit it is to expand the game, nurturing newcomers, wherever they emerge. Just as B(A)RLA should have been in this country, all along.

A body untainted by the narrow, stunted, cross-eyed, inbred and inward looking professional circus.

A body set up to share expertise, provide encouragement for all those with the gumption to get it going and welcome them with open arms.

Have a World Cup which works on invitation, including all those nations who are eager to be in it and capable of making the trip.

Oh and when newcomers come with gifts, (in some cases millions, a la Toronto, and our World Cup organisers, GB govt. and sponsors) stop slapping them in the face and bloody well find a way to work with them. 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Griff said:

York have a hundred year record of not being a strong club. They're well funded at the moment but not performing as well as expected.  I don't see why York are constantly held up as potential $uperleague prospects.

Because they have a modern stadia which is the perfect size, are based in a city with vibrant economic prospects and two universities with player pathways and will be a positive contributor to the growth and image of SL for a tv deal. 

In SL they would pull in 4-5k minimum and get sell outs vs Leeds and two Hull teams.  Looking great on telly. 

Edited by ShropshireBull
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, iangidds said:

They made a real pigs ear of Paris , you get idiots who say we have done that and failed whilst not thinking what could we have done better

Such as ?

"We'll sell you a seat .... but you'll only need the edge of it!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

Because they have a modern stadia which is the perfect size.  Our based in a city with vibrant economic prospects and two universities with player pathways and will be a positive contributor to the growth and image of SL for a tv deal. 

In SL they would pull in 4-5k minimum and get sell outs vs Leeds and two Hull teams.  Looking great on telly. 

Well, we'll see.

"We'll sell you a seat .... but you'll only need the edge of it!"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, RayCee said:

If nothing else, recent developments have exposed the fragility of Northern Hemisphere RL. It's in need of strong leadership and from that effective planning. Any successful enterprise has a plan.  I am wondering what's the plan from here?

It's clearly survival isn't it. The plan is clear, find the best TV deal we can get (done) sort out a superleague that provides the best TV entertainment to deliver that deal (arguably done as well with all the well funded clubs in place in SL) ensure the viewers get what they want (all the big clubs in there, excpt maybe Bradford so done)  and outside that SL clubs to continue player development (foundations, schools, junior development) all done withing the budgets we have. Also keep the game open to private investors..............

What is missing??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.




×
×
  • Create New...