League Restructure Thread (Merged Threads)

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

19 minutes ago, NW10LDN said:

The NRL gets a lot of stick but Melbourne are heading for the second final in a row and the NRL has put serious effort into growing the game in Victoria which is AFL country. 

Always makes me laugh when Storm are considered a successful expansion project

What has the cost been? $200 million? I think it has generated 2 Victorian NRL players in those 20 years..... $100 million dollars each. 

Most of thier fans are QLD/NSW expats. Apart from these people no one cares or plays the game in Vic 

There is a reason they are called the 4th Queensland team 

[Dave T]

1 hour ago, Tommygilf said:

They want an entertaining and relevant product that generates enough interest for lots of people to watch.

This is exactly right. When Sky repeatedly state that they care little for the structure, and how we line ourselves up - they are telling the truth. They just want the outcome - which is viewers/subscribers/advertisers or sufficient numbers and type.

[Guest]

Just now, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

Always makes me laugh when Storm are considered an expansion project

What has the cost been? $200 million? I think it has generated 2 Victorian NRL players in those 20 years..... $100 million dollars each

Most of thier fans are QLD/NSW expats. Apart from these people no one cares or plays the game in Vic 

There is a reason they are called the 4th Queensland team 

So you didn't bother reading the rest then. It's better than what is going on here. You just highlighted why this game is in decline in the UK.

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

28 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

Why are so many RL fans so blind? RL has been told by its broadcaster it’s no longer the product it once was, it’s boring.

 

Has the broadcaster done this? Genuine question as I am not sure I have heard that specifically reported  - when and who? 

I watched the Lions game with a Union fan Sunday then the Leeds game last night. Absolutely no comparison in terms entertainment and the person I was with wholeheartedly agreed (he's been to plenty of Broncos games with me too so understands league a bit) 

[Scubby]

9 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

Always makes me laugh when Storm are considered a successful expansion project

What has the cost been? $200 million? I think it has generated 2 Victorian NRL players in those 20 years..... $100 million dollars each. 

Most of thier fans are QLD/NSW expats. Apart from these people no one cares or plays the game in Vic 

There is a reason they are called the 4th Queensland team 

The Storm is a pretty rich franchise now and growing. A lot of the hard work has been done. Before the pandemic, crowds were regularly hitting 15k+ and membership and corporates are increasing. It is also amazingly well run and achieves success without overspending.

They took a decade or more to find their feet and that was where News Ltd's long term commitment helped. Just shows what can happen if you stick and support a long term project eh? The Victorian first grade thing nobody really cares - using that against clubs like Toronto and Catalans shows how flawed that premise is. 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

13 minutes ago, NW10LDN said:

So you didn't bother reading the rest then. It's better than what is going on here. You just highlighted why this game is in decline in the UK.

I did read it and I stick to my point that holding Storm up as a success is contentious at best

If you offered me £200 million we could create something similar in London no doubt. However I'd prefer that money to be spent across generating ground roots development from facilities, development officers, schools etc - in both the south and the heartlands... A successful franchise in London would be a cherry on top of a grassroots success - same with storm 

Weirdly our grassroots development in London is doing well with very limited funding... Unlike Melbourne we get the pick of the best union cast offs 

[David Dockhouse Host]

36 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

Why are so many RL fans so blind? RL has been told by its broadcaster it’s no longer the product it once was, it’s boring. They have been told referee standards are diabolical and are impacting on the spectacle. Fans are disengaging with the sport and once electric atmospheres are now dead.

Clubs will be told to fill grounds for TV, get as much away support in as possible to ignite atmosphere and to maximise ST sales

Referees will be told they are not the reason fans pay to watch a game, reminded about consistency and if need be we will ship a new bunch in from Australia. Compare our current rosta of refs with 15 years ago, the Mikalauskis of the world shouldn’t be helping to deliver multi million pound contracts to the sport, you can see players don’t respect them and they in turn can’t control games evenly

We have a salary cap that allows teams to spend £5m and others £1.2

We have a lot of work to do close season but it essential we stop levelling out at the lowest point

 

 

Do you have evidence that the broadcaster has told RL that the ref standards are diabolical? 

If you think their are humans who can ref a game without making an error then I believe you will be saying the about refs next year, the year after and so on for ever.

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

3 minutes ago, Scubby said:

The Victorian first grade thing nobody really cares - using that against clubs like Toronto and Catalans shows how flawed that premise is. 

If Toronto kept going and had no first team Canadians in or no proper presence in schools!/grassroots after 20 years I'd be questioning them too

I wouldn't use it against Catalan as they are a heartland area who produce thier own players regularly - not sure why that is relevant to bring up

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

2 minutes ago, David Dockhouse Host said:

Do you have evidence that the broadcaster has told RL that the ref standards are diabolical? 

If you think their are humans who can ref a game without making an error then I believe you will be saying the about refs next year, the year after and so on for ever.

And evidence the broadcaster has called the product boring too please. Again, who, when are where would be good

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

I did read it and I stick to my point that holding Storm up as a success is contentious at best

If you offered me £200 million we could create something similar in London no doubt. However I'd prefer that money to be spent across generating ground roots development from facilities, development officers, schools etc - in both the south and the heartlands... A successful franchise in London would be a cherry on top not of a grassroots success - same with storm 

Weirdly our grassroots development in London is doing well with very limited funding... Unlike Melbourne we get the pick of the best union cast offs 

Maybe and it would better than now because Londoners might actually pay attention to the sport. Grassroots is actually very weak in London. Most boroughs have no underage clubs and most schools don't have it in their PE programme. Again, you've ignored the point. Melbourne's success had led to growth in the in the grassroots game. Broncos and David Hughes have been useless for growing the game in London.

[Liverpool Rover]

15 minutes ago, Dave T said:

This is exactly right. When Sky repeatedly state that they care little for the structure, and how we line ourselves up - they are telling the truth. They just want the outcome - which is viewers/subscribers/advertisers or sufficient numbers and type.

One thing I think Sky won’t be happy with is that the relegation battle was over before the season had really begun. Especially after 2019 when there were 4 clubs who were still at risk going into the final day.

[Mumby Magic]

Quick note in self sufficiency. Halifax Bradford game. Ran out of beer etc by half time. I can wait for a beer but surely there's missed revenue there when it is normally Halifax's biggest attendance if the season.

[Tommygilf]

4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

This is exactly right. When Sky repeatedly state that they care little for the structure, and how we line ourselves up - they are telling the truth. They just want the outcome - which is viewers/subscribers/advertisers or sufficient numbers and type.

Exactly, the rest is down to us and how we achieve that mutual aim. Though we should always be fixing the roof whilst the sun is shining.

The problem that also creates is that Sky have little loyalty beyond those cold hard numbers. Especially now a lot of the long standing RL management/people from the start of the relationship have moved on or retired and the Murdochs' influence is gone, we are unlikely to get any sympathy votes. 

I've thought for a while now that we are effectively like Scottish Football to Sky. A regional competition with relatively low value advertisement with limited reach beyond its own scope, but with a longstanding relationship. In 2018, Sky gave them £26 mill a season - I don't know if that was before or after Comcast took control in 2018. The opportunity for RL lies in how we shouldn't be geographically restricted like Scottish football is. We can build new markets. We have failed spectacularly to do so in the UK however and that has left us vulnerable.

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

8 minutes ago, NW10LDN said:

Maybe and it would better than now because Londoners might actually pay attention to the sport. Grassroots is actually very weak in London. Most boroughs have no underage clubs and most schools don't have it in their PE programme. Again, you've ignored the point. Melbourne's success had led to growth in the in the grassroots game. Broncos and David Hughes have been useless for growing the game in London.

I would never say the only measure of success that every Borough has teams and a presence in schools!!! The fact there are grassroots clubs and youth development at all is minor miracle based on no money and just a few very enthusiastic people. You will get no argument from me about Hughes and Broncos being useless 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

9 minutes ago, Mumby Magic said:

Quick note in self sufficiency. Halifax Bradford game.Ran out of beer etc by half time

Absolutely inexcusable! 

Hopefully all involved are okay and have been offered counselling

I always think it's weird at some grounds like Belle Vue they only take cash for beer.... Surely limits the sales? 

[Guest]

Just now, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

I would never say the only measure of success that every Borough has teams and a presence in schools!!! The fact there are grassroots clubs and youth development at all is minor miracle based on no money and just a few very enthusiastic people. You will get no argument from me about Hughes and Broncos being useless 

It has to be measure of success and one why the RFL has failed at. And it's not just in London.

[Scubby]

10 minutes ago, Mumby Magic said:

Quick note in self sufficiency. Halifax Bradford game. Ran out of beer etc by half time. I can wait for a beer but surely there's missed revenue there when it is normally Halifax's biggest attendance if the season.

That's hard to take mate.

Being happy with a crowd of 2,600 when these two clubs once shared 15,000 season ticket holders is a real sign of the times.

Also for those basing the future potential of Toulouse on sparse crowds a couple of years ago, Bradford and Halifax really show how even being a competitive championship club cannot really help you attract a wider audience that is only interested in elite sport.

[tiffers]

1 hour ago, Hela Wigmen said:

Wasn’t it poorly attended the last time that was attempted (which memory serves was in the last ten years and involved Fev)? 

Is there actually much call for it to return? 

I'd say the general tone on the other thread has seen a desire for more English/French collaboration and to help NH RL develop.

I cant say I remember an English/French cup previously so couldn't comment on the positives/negatives etc.

[Mumby Magic]

30 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

Absolutely inexcusable! 

Hopefully all involved are okay and have been offered counselling

I always think it's weird at some grounds like Belle Vue they only take cash for beer.... Surely limits the sales? 

Lol I know. But like my mate said. They probably lost £400. In profit which could find a couple of young Un's for a bit. Plus it was cans and won't go out of date for a year. Ok yes I fancied a beer.

[sweaty craiq]

1 hour ago, Man of Kent said:

True and that's because the reality is 12 clubs is too many for a 'Super' Super League, let alone 14.

The number, whatever it is, should be based upon ability to fund a squad capable of competing and enhancing the product to the broadcaster

[sweaty craiq]

1 hour ago, David Dockhouse Host said:

Do you have evidence that the broadcaster has told RL that the ref standards are diabolical? 

If you think their are humans who can ref a game without making an error then I believe you will be saying the about refs next year, the year after and so on for ever.

Refs control the spectacle and all too often the outcome these days, mistakes will always be made and no one should say one mistake killed the spectacle because it won’t. Allowing head holds in the grapple, slowing down the PTB unevenly, policing the 10 unevenly, trying to be profile players best mates instead of only allowing the captain to talk etc are the ownership they must take. It’s little wonder we lost Fitzpatrick and the Wigan brothers prematurely replacing them with the Smiths, Mikalauskis etc of the world

[David Dockhouse Host]

12 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

Refs control the spectacle and all too often the outcome these days, mistakes will always be made and no one should say one mistake killed the spectacle because it won’t. Allowing head holds in the grapple, slowing down the PTB unevenly, policing the 10 unevenly, trying to be profile players best mates instead of only allowing the captain to talk etc are the ownership they must take. It’s little wonder we lost Fitzpatrick and the Wigan brothers prematurely replacing them with the Smiths, Mikalauskis etc of the world

I disagree, refs are more even than fans 

And the evidence of the broadcaster telling RL, where this?

[Scubby]

11 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

 

100% agree, that´s what makes Newcastle so exciting. 1500 in the second tier for a game that didn´t have much riding on it. Imagine what Newcastle can do if Leeds or Hull came to town... 

We've stopped imagining that's the problem. Cut your cloth is the new strategy document title. 

[JM2010]

1 hour ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

I did read it and I stick to my point that holding Storm up as a success is contentious at best

If you offered me £200 million we could create something similar in London no doubt. However I'd prefer that money to be spent across generating ground roots development from facilities, development officers, schools etc - in both the south and the heartlands... A successful franchise in London would be a cherry on top of a grassroots success - same with storm 

Weirdly our grassroots development in London is doing well with very limited funding... Unlike Melbourne we get the pick of the best union cast offs 

If good money was invested in the community game in London then it could become a strong area for producing players which would not only benefit the Broncos and Skolars but the game of RL in general

[The Blues Ox]

1 hour ago, Mumby Magic said:

Quick note in self sufficiency. Halifax Bradford game. Ran out of beer etc by half time. I can wait for a beer but surely there's missed revenue there when it is normally Halifax's biggest attendance if the season.

Aye would be a big problem if we actually made anything off our beer sales. We don't so it doesn't really matter.