M j M Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 10 minutes ago, Dave T said: If The Hundred was 'supported' by RL fans all we'd hear would be about the final balls in the final when the losers couldn't win, mocking the 'every ball counts' tagline. I don't know why we revel in peeing on people's chips. It was rubbish, everyone hated it and it didn't capture the imagination one bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleEyePie Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 15 minutes ago, Scubby said: I think the vote to implement it was won by something like a single vote. The RFL Blake Solly (remember him?) and Nigel Wood pushing it hard as a revolution for the game. We spend a lot of time and money trying to appease and entertain long standing existing fans. They are long standing for a reason.... The whole strategy has to be to entice new fans to the game. New fans want to watch the best of the best that a sport can offer. The game needs a balance. It's essential that it attracts new fans to keep the sport alive at a professional level but it can't afford to alienate the current fan base because there's no guarantee any attempt to attract new fans will be successful. And in that case the sport could simply lose a lot of what it already has. The two things don't have to be mutually exclusive though. The problem is throughout the sport people seem to be convinced that we're just one idea away from greatness. The Super 8's was just one more bright idea that may have contained some positive aspects but didn't do anything except place a greater risk on the financial security of 4 Super League clubs every season. Most people aren't watching sport because they think the format of the league is wacky and exciting. They don't necessarily watch because it's always entertaining. It's needs to be meaningful in some way though. I think perception is one of the biggest barriers we face in terms of audience growth and sponsorship. How would most Super League games ever really be meaningful to a large audience when most of the time the games are played by two small towns a few miles away from each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 14 minutes ago, Dave T said: If The Hundred was 'supported' by RL fans all we'd hear would be about the final balls in the final when the losers couldn't win, mocking the 'every ball counts' tagline. I don't know why we revel in peeing on people's chips. If you have been following the hundred you will have known that there is a huge swathe of disgust from County cricket fans having the season 'wrecked' by this ECB baby. Luckily for the ECB £300m and a marketing juggernaut buys you new fans to the game who don't really know or care about the Royal London Cup or County Championship. I think the hundred will struggle with infighting and losses and there will be an NRL 1998 type of appeasement with the Counties. However, I have admired how the ECB have said 'this is what we are doing and why' - it is called leadership and trying to develop the sport's wider appeal and demographic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, Scubby said: If you have been following the hundred you will have known that there is a huge swathe of disgust from County cricket fans having the season 'wrecked' by this ECB baby. Luckily for the ECB £300m and a marketing juggernaut buys you new fans to the game who don't really know or care about the Royal London Cup or County Championship. I think the hundred will struggle with infighting and losses and there will be an NRL 1998 type of appeasement with the Counties. However, I have admired how the ECB have said 'this is what we are doing and why' - it is called leadership and trying to develop the sport's wider appeal and demographic. Yeah I'm aware of some of the politics. It'll be interesting to monitor where it goes from here. It'll also be interesting to know the % of new fans, because the events did look rather like the t20 events they have staged for years with a few novelty bolt ons. That's not a bad thing, but it's an interesting exercise in power, money, marketing etc. Almost all those things people always say we could do in RL, they have done, let's see if the books balance or it lasts. I've been to a handful of T20 over the years and did look into going to a 100 game, but never got round to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommygilf Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, Dave T said: Yeah I'm aware of some of the politics. It'll be interesting to monitor where it goes from here. It'll also be interesting to know the % of new fans, because the events did look rather like the t20 events they have staged for years with a few novelty bolt ons. That's not a bad thing, but it's an interesting exercise in power, money, marketing etc. Almost all those things people always say we could do in RL, they have done, let's see if the books balance or it lasts. I've been to a handful of T20 over the years and did look into going to a 100 game, but never got round to it. According to their own pr it was 55% new to cricket ticket purchasers. Now, that may of course mean people who normally have their tickets bought by others, but its still not to be sniffed at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M j M Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 21 minutes ago, EagleEyePie said: Most people aren't watching sport because they think the format of the league is wacky and exciting. They don't necessarily watch because it's always entertaining. It's needs to be meaningful in some way though. I think perception is one of the biggest barriers we face in terms of audience growth and sponsorship. How would most Super League games ever really be meaningful to a large audience when most of the time the games are played by two small towns a few miles away from each other. I agree with this apart from the very last bit. RL fans are so hung up on the places where our sport is popular. Just let it go, you're right if something seems big and authentic to people, they'll watch. It doesn't immediately matter where those places are. We can't magic up overnight teams in places where RL has no history so we shouldn't keep downplaying the places where it's strong as if we're embarrassed of them. Make those clubs as big as possible, which they aren't at the moment, and then you'll have something you can use as a proper base to fund long-term expansion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 3 hours ago, gingerjon said: TV audience fell by 25% from opening match to the not sold out final. Missed this. That's very interesting. It will be a good case study in future years. Whilst I like some of the branding, I often got confused who the teams were. A few times I found myself thinking I should support the Northern team before remembering they were the Leeds-based team. I wonder how well the artificial element will hold up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redjonn Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 40 minutes ago, M j M said: I agree with this apart from the very last bit. RL fans are so hung up on the places where our sport is popular. Just let it go, you're right if something seems big and authentic to people, they'll watch. It doesn't immediately matter where those places are. We can't magic up overnight teams in places where RL has no history so we shouldn't keep downplaying the places where it's strong as if we're embarrassed of them. Make those clubs as big as possible, which they aren't at the moment, and then you'll have something you can use as a proper base to fund long-term expansion. yep have to agree... e.g. I've seen lots about the hundred in the media and hence really aware of the new concept. Yet I have absolutely no idea of the teams that participate or where in the country they are... they could even be international select teams for all I know - in fact that may be the aim to bring international players into the concept to challenge IPL in India.. So even though I won't be watching any games I am fully aware and when out with others it is a topic of discussion - mind not about players or the teams but the hype created for the sport. Bringing it into national awareness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 8 minutes ago, Dave T said: Missed this. That's very interesting. It will be a good case study in future years. Whilst I like some of the branding, I often got confused who the teams were. A few times I found myself thinking I should support the Northern team before remembering they were the Leeds-based team. I wonder how well the artificial element will hold up. There's no way the team names will last. One is named after a stadium and others a whole region of millions of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EagleEyePie Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 21 minutes ago, M j M said: I agree with this apart from the very last bit. RL fans are so hung up on the places where our sport is popular. Just let it go, you're right if something seems big and authentic to people, they'll watch. It doesn't immediately matter where those places are. We can't magic up overnight teams in places where RL has no history so we shouldn't keep downplaying the places where it's strong as if we're embarrassed of them. Make those clubs as big as possible, which they aren't at the moment, and then you'll have something you can use as a proper base to fund long-term expansion. Are there any other examples of successful professional sports whose major teams are from small towns and villages? It's obviously going to be good for the sport if the teams we currently have can thrive and become as big as they can be, but I really don't think these clubs are trying not to. The truth is there's a limit on how big most current rugby league clubs can be. And these clubs are already struggling because sponsors see very little value in them. Rugby league's geographic heartland will always be a limitation. The game needs to try to overcome these limitations. That doesn't mean ditching every traditional club and inviting Birmingham Bullets and Edinburgh Eagles but we should be looking to develop as many clubs as we can outside the heartlands. At present sponsors are advertising to pretty much the same people no matter which teams are in Super League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17 stone giant Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Scubby said: There's no way the team names will last. One is named after a stadium and others a whole region of millions of people. It wouldn't surprise me to see some changes. No sporting event in history has been exactly the same from day one onwards. Maybe there will be a ninth team representing the West, as understandably those people don't feel inclined to support Welsh Fire. Likewise, I can see why Birmingham and Manchester would alienate people not from those cities. With Birmingham I'd have thought West Midlands something might be the solution. Not sure about Manchester. North West something, perhaps. Anyway, given how many references there are to The Hundred on here, it's clear it's made a big impact on the sporting landscape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M j M Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 West Midlands sounds about as relatable to local people as Calder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OriginalMrC Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 1 hour ago, EagleEyePie said: Are there any other examples of successful professional sports whose major teams are from small towns and villages? It's obviously going to be good for the sport if the teams we currently have can thrive and become as big as they can be, but I really don't think these clubs are trying not to. The truth is there's a limit on how big most current rugby league clubs can be. And these clubs are already struggling because sponsors see very little value in them. Rugby league's geographic heartland will always be a limitation. The game needs to try to overcome these limitations. That doesn't mean ditching every traditional club and inviting Birmingham Bullets and Edinburgh Eagles but we should be looking to develop as many clubs as we can outside the heartlands. At present sponsors are advertising to pretty much the same people no matter which teams are in Super League. You'd think clubs outside the heartlands would get support but they don't. People across the sport will have their opinions on the value of so called expansion teams but believe me that Superleague and the RFL don't see any value for any club outside SL. That's ultimately the problem and why massive funding cuts have been decided for Champ and L1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17 stone giant Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 8 minutes ago, M j M said: West Midlands sounds about as relatable to local people as Calder. There isn't a perfect solution. Birmingham alienates some people. West Midlands isn't the greatest name because it's maybe a bit wishy washy. But here's the thing. Everyone has two choices. Either they obsess over the problem with the name, and therefore decide it's all rubbish and they're not going to watch or be involved. Or, they take the view that whilst it isn't perfect, they're not going to let an obsession with the name impact on their desire to have a great night out watching some cricket. It's the same with everything in sport. None of us get to decide absolutely everything about how a sport is structured and how things are done. And we all have the choice whether to watch or go and do something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M j M Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 1 minute ago, 17 stone giant said: It's the same with everything in sport. None of us get to decide absolutely everything about how a sport is structured and how things are done. And we all have the choice whether to watch or go and do something else. This is the problem though with an extremely mature sports market like the UK. People already have partisan biases and conceptions of sporting identity that are really hard to break. They may not make sense, the names may not be particularly geographically large (one of our largest football teams is named after a government installation on the other side of the city they currently play in). The names themselves sometimes don't mean much, but the identity and authenticity of those clubs do. As they said on the Hyperthetic RL podcast recently what does Rugby League identity boil down to ultimately but a pair of colours and an animal? On the face of it it's meaningless but it's everything to the fans and the club. And it's incredibly hard to build up, to make people care enough so that the following morning after a defeat it still hurts. The Hundred will need all its tens of millions to bed that sort of thing in over a prolonged period. For Rugby League expansion teams it can be a great challenge, a sport that has no grounding in the community sometimes trading under an identity nobody feels much kinship with. Persistence, decades of it, and money to keep it going are key. And sometimes even that's possibly not enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Cashmere Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 There's a lot of good ideas here but what we need first and foremost is for The RFL to publish a strategy detailing their ambitions for the sport. Without that, we're just going to get the same old rudderless, reactive, self-preservationist approach to governance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 9 minutes ago, Ray Cashmere said: There's a lot of good ideas here but what we need first and foremost is for The RFL to publish a strategy detailing their ambitions for the sport. Without that, we're just going to get the same old rudderless, reactive, self-preservationist approach to governance. https://www.rugby-league.com/governance/about-the-rfl/structure,-strategy-and-reports Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Cashmere Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 "RFL Strategic Plan 2015 - 2021" I want to know where the sport sees itself in 10 years time and how it plans to get there, not 4 months time. And how sad is it reading those '13 underlying principles and beliefs' 6 years on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griff Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 5 hours ago, M j M said: The first season of the top 8 literally went down to the last second of the last game. Maybe - but the League Leadership is (in my opinion, wrongly) not recognised widely. One of the great ironies is that we moan about how unfair loop fixtures and fixture formulae are and then dismiss the league leaderships as far less important than the Grand Finals. For verification, I point you in the direction of Featherstone Rovers supporters' constant moaning about how they won more games than Toulouse, happily reduced since the beginning of this month. "We'll sell you a seat .... but you'll only need the edge of it!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scubby Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Dave T said: https://www.rugby-league.com/governance/about-the-rfl/structure,-strategy-and-reports Gotta love a strategy report. Accountable only to the next strategy report Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 18 minutes ago, Scubby said: Gotta love a strategy report. Accountable only to the next strategy report Well that is sort of how these things work. I've said my piece on how it was an unworkable strategy before, highlighting things that the RFL have no responsibility for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Ray Cashmere said: "RFL Strategic Plan 2015 - 2021" I want to know where the sport sees itself in 10 years time and how it plans to get there, not 4 months time. And how sad is it reading those '13 underlying principles and beliefs' 6 years on... Do you have a similar report from another sport that you want? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeordieSaint Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 24 minutes ago, Scubby said: Gotta love a strategy report. Accountable only to the next strategy report The Strategic Outcomes from the plan: 1. Sold out major national and international events delivering spectacular entertainment for supporters and viewers. 2. Compelling competitions which consistently grow live and TV audiences, commercial revenues and which provide the opportunity for well-run clubs to flourish and succeed. 3. Financially viable and sustainable professional clubs creating stable employment opportunities, showcasing local, national and international playing talent, and leading the sport’s development - and making a difference - in their own communities. 4. Welcoming community clubs, putting players first, offering recreational enjoyment for children and adults alike in a safe and inclusive environment. 5. England being successful internationally on a consistent basis; A central organisation that stands out for excellence, innovation, mutual respect, integrity and inclusion that understands its role in servicing the wider sport. 6. A sport that lives its values in all its decision and actions. How many of those outcomes have been achieved? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Cashmere Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 24 minutes ago, Dave T said: Do you have a similar report from another sport that you want? No, I'm a rugby league fan on a rugby league forum discussing the future of rugby league. If there was a clear strategy being implemented then I wouldn't need to ask what said strategy is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave T Posted August 24, 2021 Share Posted August 24, 2021 7 minutes ago, Ray Cashmere said: No, I'm a rugby league fan on a rugby league forum discussing the future of rugby league. If there was a clear strategy being implemented then I wouldn't need to ask what said strategy is. You were given the RFL strategy doc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.