tms Posted July 31, 2021 Share Posted July 31, 2021 Based on current league positions, this is an example of how Super League in 2023 could look: Super League 1 Super League 2 Castleford Batley Catalans Bradford Huddersfield Featherstone Hull FC Halifax Hull KR Leigh Leeds London Salford Newcastle St Helens Toulouse Warrington Wakefield Wigan Widnes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piggy's mate Posted July 31, 2021 Share Posted July 31, 2021 3 hours ago, POR said: Based on current league positions, this is an example of how Super League in 2023 could look: Super League 1 Super League 2 Castleford Batley Catalans Bradford Huddersfield Featherstone Hull FC Halifax Hull KR Leigh Leeds London Salford Newcastle St Helens Toulouse Warrington Wakefield Wigan Widnes Yup we'll av that Touch Rugby W(h)inger and part-time Super Hero (Thursday mornings by appointment) BATLEY BULLDOGS RLFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keep The Faith Posted July 31, 2021 Share Posted July 31, 2021 1996 all over again http://tombatley.wordpress.com/ Give it a read.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RPH Posted July 31, 2021 Share Posted July 31, 2021 we would quickly end up in Super League 3..... "The trouble with quotes on the internet is that it's difficult to determine whether or not they are genuine" ....Abraham Lincoln 1809-1865.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverback Posted July 31, 2021 Share Posted July 31, 2021 had miss dews. til boxing day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank Posted August 1, 2021 Share Posted August 1, 2021 How's the TV money going to work out? Can't see those in SL 1 coughing anything up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ernieone Posted August 1, 2021 Share Posted August 1, 2021 Not good for the Super League wannabes this season. Finishing in the top two this year then still having to fight for promotion the season after. 1950s Gallant Youth, 2000 Bulldog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tms Posted August 1, 2021 Author Share Posted August 1, 2021 39 minutes ago, ernieone said: Not good for the Super League wannabes this season. Finishing in the top two this year then still having to fight for promotion the season after. Really E be no different if it stayed the same and only FEV went up strong possibility they get relegated back into championship in 23 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gittinsfan Posted August 1, 2021 Share Posted August 1, 2021 2 hours ago, POR said: Really E be no different if it stayed the same and only FEV went up strong possibility they get relegated back into championship in 23 It will be very difficult to assemble a quality squad in the time allowed.You have lost 2 of your best forwards already and I assume some of your current squad won't want to go full time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tms Posted August 2, 2021 Author Share Posted August 2, 2021 On 01/08/2021 at 08:04, ernieone said: Not good for the Super League wannabes this season. Finishing in the top two this year then still having to fight for promotion the season after. JUST a thought E if two go up then four get relegated Batley will be playing in 2022 with no promotion places on offer and when 4 good teams get relegated end of 2022 playing in 2023 with NO chance of promotion 21 hours ago, gittinsfan said: It will be very difficult to assemble a quality squad in the time allowed.You have lost 2 of your best forwards already and I assume some of your current squad won't want to go full time. That's TRUE G but I couldn't care less about what team we have or if we end up like eurovision with NUL POINTS it's all about the chance of being in SL in 2022 and getting a guaranteed share of the TV money unlike teams in the championship who may get NOWT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogerT Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 Are but you have to get there first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOGFATHER Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 2 hours ago, POR said: JUST a thought E if two go up then four get relegated Batley will be playing in 2022 with no promotion places on offer and when 4 good teams get relegated end of 2022 playing in 2023 with NO chance of promotion That's TRUE G but I couldn't care less about what team we have or if we end up like eurovision with NUL POINTS it's all about the chance of being in SL in 2022 and getting a guaranteed share of the TV money unlike teams in the championship who may get NOWT Do you honestly think Featherstone, Batley or Halifax would be anywhere near a SL2, if it came in to fruition? Sadly, I am far more cynical/realistic than you. I reckon there will be some sort of criteria regarding eligibility, that miraculously could only be met by the club's they want in. Just like all of the previous licensing applications. There will undoubtedly be another "very rigorous and fair process" put in place (that will be as transparent as a thick bowl of porridge), to ensure the game continues to excel in providing top quality entertainment every week and added value for any prospective TV and future commercial partners as they "frame the future", where "every minute matters". York will be in, instead of Fev, and Campbell will come out of the closet and join York instead of just bankrolling them from the shadows. A Cumbrian side will be in instead of us, for geographical reasons. Possibly, another overseas club instead of Halifax. Maybe Toronto, Ottawa, Red Star or more likely, another French side. As that would fit in with head honcho of the IRLF, who wants to grow RL in France over the next few years, and is already talking about hosting the next World Cup there. They will not see that it's the self interest and lack of integrity that has killed the game, not the number of club's they have in the top tier, or league structure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blind side johnny Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 2 hours ago, DOGFATHER said: Do you honestly think Featherstone, Batley or Halifax would be anywhere near a SL2, if it came in to fruition? Sadly, I am far more cynical/realistic than you. I reckon there will be some sort of criteria regarding eligibility, that miraculously could only be met by the club's they want in. Just like all of the previous licensing applications. There will undoubtedly be another "very rigorous and fair process" put in place (that will be as transparent as a thick bowl of porridge), to ensure the game continues to excel in providing top quality entertainment every week and added value for any prospective TV and future commercial partners as they "frame the future", where "every minute matters". York will be in, instead of Fev, and Campbell will come out of the closet and join York instead of just bankrolling them from the shadows. A Cumbrian side will be in instead of us, for geographical reasons. Possibly, another overseas club instead of Halifax. Maybe Toronto, Ottawa, Red Star or more likely, another French side. As that would fit in with head honcho of the IRLF, who wants to grow RL in France over the next few years, and is already talking about hosting the next World Cup there. They will not see that it's the self interest and lack of integrity that has killed the game, not the number of club's they have in the top tier, or league structure. Getting your paranoia in first DF? Sport, amongst other things, is a dream-world offering escape from harsh reality and the disturbing prospect of change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blind side johnny Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 5 hours ago, POR said: JUST a thought E if two go up then four get relegated Batley will be playing in 2022 with no promotion places on offer and when 4 good teams get relegated end of 2022 playing in 2023 with NO chance of promotion That isn't how I see it POR. In 2022 the teams in the Championship will be busting a gut to get into the top six places. If Batley did succeed in this then in 2023 there will be P&R between SL1 and SL2, so, in theory they would have a chance of promotion. Sport, amongst other things, is a dream-world offering escape from harsh reality and the disturbing prospect of change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tms Posted August 2, 2021 Author Share Posted August 2, 2021 43 minutes ago, Blind side johnny said: That isn't how I see it POR. In 2022 the teams in the Championship will be busting a gut to get into the top six places. If Batley did succeed in this then in 2023 there will be P&R between SL1 and SL2, so, in theory they would have a chance of promotion. get into the top six places But the top six isn't promotion your staying in the same division but with a dfferent name they would have a chance of promotion. yes that's true but it's a cat in hells chance too many good teams supposedly dropping down from this obviously stupid league format Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
distantdog Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 3 hours ago, DOGFATHER said: Do you honestly think Featherstone, Batley or Halifax would be anywhere near a SL2, if it came in to fruition? Sadly, I am far more cynical/realistic than you. I reckon there will be some sort of criteria regarding eligibility, that miraculously could only be met by the club's they want in. Just like all of the previous licensing applications. There will undoubtedly be another "very rigorous and fair process" put in place (that will be as transparent as a thick bowl of porridge), to ensure the game continues to excel in providing top quality entertainment every week and added value for any prospective TV and future commercial partners as they "frame the future", where "every minute matters". York will be in, instead of Fev, and Campbell will come out of the closet and join York instead of just bankrolling them from the shadows. A Cumbrian side will be in instead of us, for geographical reasons. Possibly, another overseas club instead of Halifax. Maybe Toronto, Ottawa, Red Star or more likely, another French side. As that would fit in with head honcho of the IRLF, who wants to grow RL in France over the next few years, and is already talking about hosting the next World Cup there. They will not see that it's the self interest and lack of integrity that has killed the game, not the number of club's they have in the top tier, or league structure. I would put money on Fev being in a SL2 if it ever came to pass. And think it would be great to have a WC in France if they can put forward a solid case for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gittinsfan Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 4 hours ago, DOGFATHER said: Do you honestly think Featherstone, Batley or Halifax would be anywhere near a SL2, if it came in to fruition? Sadly, I am far more cynical/realistic than you. I reckon there will be some sort of criteria regarding eligibility, that miraculously could only be met by the club's they want in. Just like all of the previous licensing applications. There will undoubtedly be another "very rigorous and fair process" put in place (that will be as transparent as a thick bowl of porridge), to ensure the game continues to excel in providing top quality entertainment every week and added value for any prospective TV and future commercial partners as they "frame the future", where "every minute matters". York will be in, instead of Fev, and Campbell will come out of the closet and join York instead of just bankrolling them from the shadows. A Cumbrian side will be in instead of us, for geographical reasons. Possibly, another overseas club instead of Halifax. Maybe Toronto, Ottawa, Red Star or more likely, another French side. As that would fit in with head honcho of the IRLF, who wants to grow RL in France over the next few years, and is already talking about hosting the next World Cup there. They will not see that it's the self interest and lack of integrity that has killed the game, not the number of club's they have in the top tier, or league structure. I don't think you are too far off the mark there. However if Fev go up this year, even RFL and SL could'nt justify relegating them from SL1 direct to tier 3.Then again...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOGFATHER Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 4 hours ago, Blind side johnny said: Getting your paranoia in first DF? No paranoia required, just a healthy dose of looking at what has happened historically and seeing no reason why things will be different this time. I look forward with eager anticipation, to reading your thesis explaining: - Why self interest will no longer play a part in the decision making process. How transparent the application process will be administered this time. Why Wakefield and Castleford are still playing from grounds which did not meet the criteria set out all those years ago, yet it didn't seemingly apply to them. Why the weighting of each criteria for the most recent applications to join SL was not fixed, but weighted differently depending on which club's application they were scoring. The rules regarding the width of the pitch do not seemingly apply to Bradford. Minimum standards regarding ground capacity set out for all SL club's, that didn't apply to London. All these types of things destroy the integrity of the game and we find ourselves where we are now, with a game on its knees, not helped by the pandemic, but it has just found its way to where it has been going since the inception of SL, it has just happened sooner, that's all. I can't help thinking that these incidents have become so common in the game, that long standing supporter's such as you, don't even bat an eyelid anymore, and are just blase to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phildog Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 So in effect that means that we have to have the same success next season to feature..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blind side johnny Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 4 hours ago, POR said: get into the top six places But the top six isn't promotion your staying in the same division but with a dfferent name they would have a chance of promotion. yes that's true but it's a cat in hells chance too many good teams supposedly dropping down from this obviously stupid league format Playing for a much bigger slice of the pie will be incentive enough in 2022. Staying above Fev in 2023 will be equally satisfying. Sport, amongst other things, is a dream-world offering escape from harsh reality and the disturbing prospect of change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blind side johnny Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 36 minutes ago, DOGFATHER said: No paranoia required, just a healthy dose of looking at what has happened historically and seeing no reason why things will be different this time. I look forward with eager anticipation, to reading your thesis explaining: - Why self interest will no longer play a part in the decision making process. How transparent the application process will be administered this time. Why Wakefield and Castleford are still playing from grounds which did not meet the criteria set out all those years ago, yet it didn't seemingly apply to them. Why the weighting of each criteria for the most recent applications to join SL was not fixed, but weighted differently depending on which club's application they were scoring. The rules regarding the width of the pitch do not seemingly apply to Bradford. Minimum standards regarding ground capacity set out for all SL club's, that didn't apply to London. All these types of things destroy the integrity of the game and we find ourselves where we are now, with a game on its knees, not helped by the pandemic, but it has just found its way to where it has been going since the inception of SL, it has just happened sooner, that's all. I can't help thinking that these incidents have become so common in the game, that long standing supporter's such as you, don't even bat an eyelid anymore, and are just blase to it. Amongst your other fantasy claims you state that Campbell is bankrolling York from the shadows. Go on then, give us the facts to back this one up. The ground criteria (which Batley's didn't meet for their division at the time, by the way) were suspended/quietly dropped when it proved that too many clubs fell short - it wasn't just those that you cite. No P&R was decided upon this basis. How can you say that the criteria for judgement for the recent elevation of Leigh were weighted differently for different clubs when you earlier say that these weren't transparent? Were you on this committee? Once again, the minimum standards that you quote were suspended. When SL began the game was well and truly on its knees. I'm no fan of the structure but it was a real lifesaver for clubs such as ours, believe it or not (you don't, I know). I am not simplistic nor innocent to the going on in business and sort, but neither am I idealistic, nor a fantasist. Sport, amongst other things, is a dream-world offering escape from harsh reality and the disturbing prospect of change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOGFATHER Posted August 2, 2021 Share Posted August 2, 2021 On 02/08/2021 at 20:09, Blind side johnny said: Amongst your other fantasy claims you state that Campbell is bankrolling York from the shadows. Go on then, give us the facts to back this one up. https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/sport/yorkcityknights/15023832.benefactor-mark-campbell-explains-reasons-for-saving-york-city-knights-and-denies-conflict-of-interest/ The ground criteria (which Batley's didn't meet for their division at the time, by the way) were suspended/quietly dropped when it proved that too many clubs fell short - it wasn't just those that you cite. No P&R was decided upon this basis. See London response below. How can you say that the criteria for judgement for the recent elevation of Leigh were weighted differently for different clubs when you earlier say that these weren't transparent? Were you on this committee? https://www.totalrl.com/halifax-out-of-super-league-reckoning-six-clubs-remain/ Super League had promised to be transparent in the application process, hence their decision to make public the criteria. However, one line in the document suggests complete transparency won’t be made available. A section of the report reads: “The Panel will have absolute discretion in the weighting of the Assessment Criteria. For the avoidance of doubt, the assessment criteria do not carry equal weight. However, the weighting of each criteria has not been disclosed. If they wanted to be transparent, why not disclose the weighting of the criteria, so it could be open to public scrutiny? If this was a truly transparent process, public scrutiny would surely be welcomed? Ensuring there was nothing to hide, prior to the submission of applications. Once again, the minimum standards that you quote were suspended. If the rules were suspended (as you have seemingly dreamt up), why did London need special dispensation in 2019? Was the suspension/dropping of the rule so quietly done, that the only person that knew it had been dropped, was you? It seems neither London, nor the RFL were aware they had dropped it. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.hulldailymail.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/rugby-league-news/london-broncos-allowed-ground-dispensation-2097500.amp When SL began the game was well and truly on its knees. I'm no fan of the structure but it was a real lifesaver for clubs such as ours, believe it or not (you don't, I know). And the game is not truly on its knees now? I'm fully aware of how the game was. Was SL a life saver, or just a life prolonger? The fundamentals that needed to change back then, didn't for most clubs, and still haven't. Club's needed to spend less than they brought in. As far as I can see, this still hasn't happened. I am not simplistic nor innocent to the going on in business and sort, but neither am I idealistic, nor a fantasist. Or able to figure out why Bradford are allowed to play on pitch that does not meet the minimum criteria. Amongst your other fantasy claims you state that Campbell is bankrolling York from the shadows. Go on then, give us the facts to back this one up. https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/sport/yorkcityknights/15023832.benefactor-mark-campbell-explains-reasons-for-saving-york-city-knights-and-denies-conflict-of-interest/ The ground criteria (which Batley's didn't meet for their division at the time, by the way) were suspended/quietly dropped when it proved that too many clubs fell short - it wasn't just those that you cite. No P&R was decided upon this basis. See London response below. How can you say that the criteria for judgement for the recent elevation of Leigh were weighted differently for different clubs when you earlier say that these weren't transparent? Were you on this committee? https://www.totalrl.com/halifax-out-of-super-league-reckoning-six-clubs-remain/ Super League had promised to be transparent in the application process, hence their decision to make public the criteria. However, one line in the document suggests complete transparency won’t be made available. A section of the report reads: “The Panel will have absolute discretion in the weighting of the Assessment Criteria. For the avoidance of doubt, the assessment criteria do not carry equal weight. However, the weighting of each criteria has not been disclosed. If they wanted to be transparent, why not disclose the weighting of the criteria, so it could be open to public scrutiny? If this was a truly transparent process, public scrutiny would surely be welcomed? Ensuring there was nothing to hide, prior to the submission of applications. Once again, the minimum standards that you quote were suspended. If the rules were suspended (as you have seemingly dreamt up), why did London need special dispensation in 2019? Was the suspension/dropping of the rule so quietly done, that the only person that knew it had been dropped, was you? It seems neither London, nor the RFL were aware they had dropped it. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.hulldailymail.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/rugby-league-news/london-broncos-allowed-ground-dispensation-2097500.amp When SL began the game was well and truly on its knees. I'm no fan of the structure but it was a real lifesaver for clubs such as ours, believe it or not (you don't, I know). And the game is not truly on its knees now? I'm fully aware of how the game was. Was SL a life saver, or just a life prolonger? The fundamentals that needed to change back then, didn't for most clubs, and still haven't. Club's needed to spend less than they brought in. As far as I can see, this still hasn't happened. I am not simplistic nor innocent to the going on in business and sort, but neither am I idealistic, nor a fantasist. Or able to figure out why Bradford are allowed to play on pitch that does not meet the minimum criteria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tms Posted August 3, 2021 Author Share Posted August 3, 2021 12 hours ago, Blind side johnny said: Playing for a much bigger slice of the pie will be incentive enough in 2022. Staying above Fev in 2023 will be equally satisfying. That would be nice BSJ but do you honestly think the super greed sat in SL1 are going to give SL 2 a much bigger slice of the pie Staying above Fev in 2023 bur you won't have to FEV aren't getting relegated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blind side johnny Posted August 3, 2021 Share Posted August 3, 2021 3 hours ago, POR said: That would be nice BSJ but do you honestly think the super greed sat in SL1 are going to give SL 2 a much bigger slice of the pie Staying above Fev in 2023 bur you won't have to FEV aren't getting relegated The plans as described include SL2 clubs getting substantially more than Championship clubs currently do. Sport, amongst other things, is a dream-world offering escape from harsh reality and the disturbing prospect of change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOGFATHER Posted August 3, 2021 Share Posted August 3, 2021 Just as another example BSJ. The RFL have today docked Fev 2 League points and given them a £10k fine. It turns out, from CCTV footage obtained by the police, that 11 players that played against us 5 days later, should have been forced to isolate, like Ferres had to. Campbell went on record stating Ferries was the only player in attendance at the bar for the illegal p155 up. So the Fev chairman publicly lied, obstructed an RFL investigation, risked another club's players health during a pandemic, and knowingly fielded 11 ineligible players in a league game. Batley are still seemingly awarded the loss, from a game that should never have been played. Fev lose £10k and the league points they should not have had in the first place. Yet there isn't even a hint of bringing the game in to disrepute, nor kicking Campbell out of the game. The administration is a complete laughing stock! But you are not blase? I reckon the floodlights must have gone out on the blindside of the pitch, where you reside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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