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5 hours ago, Dave T said:

Could calling somebody a Polish effer not be as offensive as calling someone a Pakistani effer? 

I would say it could, but we lack a precise term to express the nature of the offence, so someone will cite "racism" simply to ensure an incident is taken seriously. The problem, which no poster has yet addressed, is whether that option is available to everyone, including Australians.

In political discourse I`ve heard the word "othering" used in this context.

If I were an English player in the NRL, and the crowd called me a Pom, I wouldn`t mind. If they kept calling me a Pommie bleep, I think I might. It would imply that I didn`t belong. In the jargon - "othered".

An Australian could feel the same if repeatedly called an Aussie bleep by an English crowd. If he were over here with his family, he might wonder if his children were getting similar treatment in the local school. If his partner were present and had to listen to the abuse, she might worry about that too.

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18 hours ago, MidlandsJohn said:

I can imagine it was along the lines off "###### off back to Poland" screamed by someone who couldn't even point out Poland on a map.

It shows how thick this "fan" must be that he thinks racist abuse is perfectly fine yet at the same time proudly supports a team containing Jake Mamo, Sitaleki Akauola and Eribe Doro. Slight disconnect in the brain?

Many moons ago at Hilton Park Henderson Gill had scored a try and while standing in position waiting for Leigh to kick off a Leigh fan shouted f&£$ 0$$ Gilly you black b@$t@rd, Henderson turned around and laughed at the crowd and pointed to Des Drummond and gave the retort "he's blacker than me".

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1 hour ago, graveyard johnny said:

its supposed to be offensive- thats what opposing fans do to each other- nobody dies 

Exactly it's supposed to be offensive, That's my point.

Being offended by anti Polish comments is no better no worse than being offended by anti Hull comments.

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1 minute ago, DimmestStar said:

Exactly it's supposed to be offensive, That's my point.

Being offended by anti Polish comments is no better no worse than being offended by anti Hull comments.

so true- we can all stay in our bedrooms crying in to our pillows been offended by this and hurt by that or we can choose to get on with it- would anyone these days go see a comedian like jimmy carr , paul smith or frankie boyle if being offensive was so upsetting?

did the bloke who invented the phrase "one hit wonder" invent anything else?

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6 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

so true- we can all stay in our bedrooms crying in to our pillows been offended by this and hurt by that or we can choose to get on with it- would anyone these days go see a comedian like jimmy carr , paul smith or frankie boyle if being offensive was so upsetting?

But if you go to see them you know what you’ll be getting, it’s your choice, why should a promising young man like Oledski be called a racist epithet at  a sporting contest? What has it got to do with his ability on the field? If they’d called him a “big useless lump” it would have been very obviously incorrect but not nearly as offensive, can you genuinely not see that? 

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35 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

so true- we can all stay in our bedrooms crying in to our pillows been offended by this and hurt by that or we can choose to get on with it- would anyone these days go see a comedian like jimmy carr , paul smith or frankie boyle if being offensive was so upsetting?

Have you watched the video of Oledzki explaining what happened?

He stated that he expects to get some stick from the opposing fans but the language used against him was discriminatory and abusive.  And used while there were children and families in the stands.

It takes a special kind of person to defend the abuser in these situations.

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21 minutes ago, Phil said:

But if you go to see them you know what you’ll be getting, it’s your choice, why should a promising young man like Oledski be called a racist epithet at  a sporting contest? What has it got to do with his ability on the field? If they’d called him a “big useless lump” it would have been very obviously incorrect but not nearly as offensive, can you genuinely not see that? 

yes mate - i can see that - i dont see how been called french polish english scottish or south african is racist though or been attached to  a mad religion is a race as well 

did the bloke who invented the phrase "one hit wonder" invent anything else?

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1 minute ago, Dunbar said:

Have you watched the video of Oledzki explaining what happened?

He stated that he expects to get some stick from the opposing fans but the language used against him was discriminatory and abusive.  And used while there were children and families in the stands.

It takes a special kind of person to defend the abuser in these situations.

children and families hearing bad language at a rugby match - whats it coming to? I  think i will faint with the shock of it - in the hundreds of matches i have attended over the decades  it has been nothing but polite pleasantries and good wishes for the opposition in gamesmanship like manner - get a grip 

did the bloke who invented the phrase "one hit wonder" invent anything else?

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10 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

children and families hearing bad language at a rugby match - whats it coming to? I  think i will faint with the shock of it - in the hundreds of matches i have attended over the decades  it has been nothing but polite pleasantries and good wishes for the opposition in gamesmanship like manner - get a grip 

We have different expectations of behaviour.  I'm OK with that.

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go round city centre pubs before between and after psychobilly gigs dressed  in the gear with the hair etc - get the looks- get the comments - get the deck head wanting a pop at you after a few shandys- bother me? not in the slightest - its there problem - i rise above it 

did the bloke who invented the phrase "one hit wonder" invent anything else?

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22 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

Have you watched the video of Oledzki explaining what happened?

He stated that he expects to get some stick from the opposing fans but the language used against him was discriminatory and abusive.  And used while there were children and families in the stands.

It takes a special kind of person to defend the abuser in these situations.

Agree and very much what Hull & Hull KR fans have endured and expected to tolerate for years and years from Leeds fans....for nothing more than being from Hull.

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3 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

We have different expectations of behaviour.  I'm OK with that.

so am i - have never abused a player in my life - but someone ten yards away will be doing - it goes without saying  that for some people - venting their spleen in their normal position in the stand is their mortal right in their eyes - its what it is- if i was a player i would just block it out 

did the bloke who invented the phrase "one hit wonder" invent anything else?

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Oledski born in Gdansz is Polish by birth and heritage so presumably the remark was aimed at that.

Both Brits and Australians are still predominately anglo-celtic in origin though given some of what passes for "banter" between both groups you might wonder if this is classed as "acceptable" some do not think so

https://phildrane.com/blogs/phil-s-blogs/posts/pom-and-pommie-an-english-australasian-immigrant-s-view

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/poms-you-whinge-some-you-lose-some/2TELXUPGUFMFDERPUCYHUGXMQQ/

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When the pinch comes the common people will turn out to be more intelligent than the clever ones. I certainly hope so.

George Orwell
 

 

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Those idiots will be cheering him voraciously if he is playing in the World Cup for England.

Which proves once again that whilst you can't legislate for stupidity you have to punish it.

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12 hours ago, Padge said:

Many moons ago at Hilton Park Henderson Gill had scored a try and while standing in position waiting for Leigh to kick off a Leigh fan shouted f&£$ 0$$ Gilly you black b@$t@rd, Henderson turned around and laughed at the crowd and pointed to Des Drummond and gave the retort "he's blacker than me".

Having not been there (and also not being Gill so can't know what was in his head) but I do have a 50+ year old black relative, that's either all fine and let's have a laugh together or it's shades of Charlie Williams dealing with hecklers. Frankly these days it would be cringeworthy both that someone should shout that, and secondly that they would get that response.

The 50 year old black relative is relevant because he once told me he was f'ing tired of having to do that to survive in the workplace. But most people wouldn't know that because he dressed it up as having a sense of humour and not minding too much.

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Just now, iffleyox said:

The 50 year old black relative is relevant because he once told me he was f'ing tired of having to do that to survive in the workplace. But most people wouldn't know that because he dressed it up as having a sense of humour and not minding too much.

If you watch the video that Michael Holding and Ebony Rainford-Brent did for Sky last year, Ebony makes the exact same point. The humour is a tiring, and tiresome, defence mechanism to cover the fact that it hurts.

There's nothing to celebrate in it.

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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2 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

If you watch the video that Michael Holding and Ebony Rainford-Brent did for Sky last year, Ebony makes the exact same point. The humour is a tiring, and tiresome, defence mechanism to cover the fact that it hurts.

There's nothing to celebrate in it.

Absolutely. 

Incidentally, if you want to see something truly mindblowing in a 'it couldn't happen now thank God' way if you look on youtube there's footage of Charlie Williams (I'm a bit of a fan) playing live to a white audience in 1970s Rhodesia... Real 'watch through your fingers' stuff as he has to tell about 20 cracks against himself just to break the ice. And presumably (because they were there) they were the 'liberals'

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11 hours ago, graveyard johnny said:

go round city centre pubs before between and after psychobilly gigs dressed  in the gear with the hair etc - get the looks- get the comments - get the deck head wanting a pop at you after a few shandys- bother me? not in the slightest - its there problem - i rise above it 

Some or the contributions on this thread remind me of a group that bully some poor fella at work every day until he leaves (or worse) and just laugh it off by saying it was all done in fun.

There is an amazing lack of empathy for what it must be like to be on the recieving end of some of this 'banter'.

Edited by Dunbar
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Anyone comparing this to fans being called names for being from Hull etc are just way off the mark.

The difference is Leeds fans, or whichever fans are calling you names, don’t genuinely hate you and think you shouldn’t exist in this country.

You don’t get made to feel like you don’t belong or that you’re some second tier of citizen because of your skin colour or name on a regular basis in your daily life.

I have family who have to put up with this ###### and it can happen at any time. It’s downright painful to know people feel that way about you, despite knowing nothing about you.

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On 03/08/2021 at 08:44, Dave T said:

So what have the club done about their Head Coach using the word m*ng live on National TV, something that attracted plenty of public condemnation and reflected badly on the club? 

I believe there was an immediate apology by Price in the subsequent press review and a statement released by the club with a further apology and ‘that it would be handled internally’. I certainly agree in that instance the club could have gone further, but I was pleased with their response on the Hicks incident, my hope - and reason for the post - is they follow that route rather than the Price one. But it would require other parties to agree of course.

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28 minutes ago, Alffi 7 said:

I believe there was an immediate apology by Price in the subsequent press review and a statement released by the club with a further apology and ‘that it would be handled internally’. I certainly agree in that instance the club could have gone further, but I was pleased with their response on the Hicks incident, my hope - and reason for the post - is they follow that route rather than the Price one. But it would require other parties to agree of course.

The club absolutely could have gone further on the Price thing. They released a quick, minimal release - they claimed Price had apologised - but who to? Haven't seen anything from Price. I challenged this at the time and was told to give him time.

Is there a fine, or a ban? If not, why not? 

Because from what I see, the club hasn't taken that seriously at all. 

As a club we are at risk of having a damaged reputation again imho. Trouble in Catalans a couple of years ago, trouble with the ref, our leader using language like he did on Sky, and now an allegation of racism from a fan. But in the meantime we released a black BLM shirt - but didn't really give a strong message on the kneeling point. I defended the club on claims of virtue signalling - but I'm afraid that's where I feel we are at the moment. 

We don't seem to be too committed to creating a great culture - Fitzpatrick, time to step up.

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1 hour ago, The One said:

Anyone comparing this to fans being called names for being from Hull etc are just way off the mark.

The difference is Leeds fans, or whichever fans are calling you names, don’t genuinely hate you and think you shouldn’t exist in this country.

You don’t get made to feel like you don’t belong or that you’re some second tier of citizen because of your skin colour or name on a regular basis in your daily life.

I have family who have to put up with this ###### and it can happen at any time. It’s downright painful to know people feel that way about you, despite knowing nothing about you.

People know this. For some reason they want to play down racism.

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20 minutes ago, Dave T said:

People know this. For some reason they want to play down racism.

It’s quite sad that this is the third or fourth similar incident this year and the same people are debating the wording and it’s offensiveness each time. 

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3 hours ago, Dave T said:

The club absolutely could have gone further on the Price thing. They released a quick, minimal release - they claimed Price had apologised - but who to? Haven't seen anything from Price. I challenged this at the time and was told to give him time.

Is there a fine, or a ban? If not, why not? 

Because from what I see, the club hasn't taken that seriously at all. 

As a club we are at risk of having a damaged reputation again imho. Trouble in Catalans a couple of years ago, trouble with the ref, our leader using language like he did on Sky, and now an allegation of racism from a fan. But in the meantime we released a black BLM shirt - but didn't really give a strong message on the kneeling point. I defended the club on claims of virtue signalling - but I'm afraid that's where I feel we are at the moment. 

We don't seem to be too committed to creating a great culture - Fitzpatrick, time to step up.

Seems like the investigation was carried out at an RFL level rather than club level - maybe that's why we didn't hear too much from Warrington at first.

https://www.rugby-league.com/article/35810/tribunal-decision-steve-price-

 

The club still could have (and still might I suppose given the investigation has only just concluded) done more at the time, or even just made it a little clearer that there would be an RFL investigation - it wasn't mentioned in their brief press release.

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