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Can tickets be too cheap


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17 minutes ago, Ant said:

News flash, most under 30s are skint. 

 

Over the years the Giants have tried all manner of things, changing the main kick off times, what day they play games, freebies, bulk advertising etc

 

It must also be noted that this pricing structure is just in line with the ticket costs for the Covid curtailed season, and season ticket holders who didn't have their money back were promised their ticket prices would be fixed at the same amount. 

But yeah, let's not actual facts get in the way of talking @#$%

Is your first sentence really an actual fact?

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  Under 11's should be free.11 to 18 year old's no more than £5 a game Family ticket for 2 adults and 2 under 16's no more than £30.£16 max a game adult single with £12 cons.Under £120 for a seasons membership does devalue the game.Championship Football Clubs offer under 18's memberships for between £3.50/£5.50 a game under 12's £1.50 t0 £4 a game.Adults about £17 and cons £12.

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Problem with cheap tickets is when you can’t afford to keep selling tickets so cheap. A few years ago at Wakefield under the Glover regime tickets were cheap and the crowds were good but we made no money.  Season after we had to increase season tickets back up to a normal price, but  people had got used to cheap pricing and a fair few were unwilling to renew.

 

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2 hours ago, POR said:

But your only telling half the story

It's £65 for under 30's including juniors

They are selling others at £125 for over 30's including concessions

They are also selling  some season tickets for £90 and £220

It helps if you tell a story in it's entirety, it's also for a limited time period then prices rise, but the cheap season tickets are the clubs way of rewarding loyal supporters and also by a means of attracting potential new supporters.

Huddersfield, like a lot of RL clubs have an ageing fanbase, we, the HGSA did a study a couple of years back and we got the impression that 70% of our supporter base were between the ages of 50-65 or something, the idea is that we try and attract a younger fanbase by offering them cheap season tickets, hopefully, juniors will pick this up and bring along adults as well.

It worked with Huddersfield Town, who increased their supporter base by 65%, helped, obviously by their promotion to the Premier League, but it has to be marketed properly and at the right people, sadly, I don't think the Giants do that well enough, they don't sell the club enough, but that could be true of RL as whole?

 

And there's absolutely nothing stopping fans from other clubs from purchasing season cards for the Giants if they so wish.

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8 minutes ago, meast said:

It helps if you tell a story in it's entirety, it's also for a limited time period then prices rise, but the cheap season tickets are the clubs way of rewarding loyal supporters and also by a means of attracting potential new supporters.

Huddersfield, like a lot of RL clubs have an ageing fanbase, we, the HGSA did a study a couple of years back and we got the impression that 70% of our supporter base were between the ages of 50-65 or something, the idea is that we try and attract a younger fanbase by offering them cheap season tickets, hopefully, juniors will pick this up and bring along adults as well.

It worked with Huddersfield Town, who increased their supporter base by 65%, helped, obviously by their promotion to the Premier League, but it has to be marketed properly and at the right people, sadly, I don't think the Giants do that well enough, they don't sell the club enough, but that could be true of RL as whole?

 

And there's absolutely nothing stopping fans from other clubs from purchasing season cards for the Giants if they so wish.

That's really interesting.

Does anyone there have the resources and/or time to look into if cheap season tickets are the best way or if there are other things that could be done?

Your point about both the Giants and wider game marketing is, I think, sound.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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23 minutes ago, meast said:

It helps if you tell a story in it's entirety, it's also for a limited time period then prices rise, but the cheap season tickets are the clubs way of rewarding loyal supporters and also by a means of attracting potential new supporters.

Huddersfield, like a lot of RL clubs have an ageing fanbase, we, the HGSA did a study a couple of years back and we got the impression that 70% of our supporter base were between the ages of 50-65 or something, the idea is that we try and attract a younger fanbase by offering them cheap season tickets, hopefully, juniors will pick this up and bring along adults as well.

It worked with Huddersfield Town, who increased their supporter base by 65%, helped, obviously by their promotion to the Premier League, but it has to be marketed properly and at the right people, sadly, I don't think the Giants do that well enough, they don't sell the club enough, but that could be true of RL as whole?

 

And there's absolutely nothing stopping fans from other clubs from purchasing season cards for the Giants if they so wish.

The objective is sound, but I think it's fair to question if, and how, Huddersfield have concluded that price is the thing that's keeping under-30s away. If it is, then great. But if it isn't, all that the you do is end up giving away margin, developing a reputation where supporters come to expect a perpetual stream of discounts and having less money to invest in areas like match experience. 

You might attract some new supporters, but if you don't meet their expectations in terms of what they want from a day/night out, all you do is establish Giants games as "a cheap thing to do" - and those usually end up becoming "a cheap thing to stop bothering with". 

I don't think you can just write-off Huddersfield Town's growth in this area as being down to cheap tickets. Speaking to people who I know are Town fans, there has been a big emphasis on enhancing the matchday experience and it's that that is making Town games events that people want to go to. 

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2 hours ago, Dunbar said:

The commercial model for season tickets is interesting.  Firstly, they are very good for clubs because they provide guaranteed income for the year which is good for financial planning and also they are a 'pre-payment' which is very good for cash flow and so welcome in that regard.  A high number of season ticket sales would also be a powerful tool in negotiation with or attracting new sponsors or partners as you can use the 'reach' that you have to these people to sell the story.  All things being equal, high season ticket sales for any club is a good thing.

From a commercial planning perspective, purely for income (taking away the less tangible benefits described above) then there is always a balance between the price of the season ticket and how many games a fan would attend with or without the season ticket and you would expect clubs to model this with a lot of sensitivity as it is a key commercial decision.

A back of a fag packet calculation:

If you sell 5,000 season tickets at £125 each then that is £625k cash in the bank.

If you were trying to attract those same 5,000 fans on a game by game basis then attendance at 4 games a year paying £30 for a ticket would be £600k and so the season ticket provides better cash flow and more revenue.

But as soon as you get to 7 games attended then you are at £1.05M and for 10 games attended it is £1.5M.

So the question is, can a club commit to the efforts required to sell those tickets on a game by game basis - or indeed raise the price of the season ticket - to see that extra revenue.  I would say yes as the differences we are talking about here are significant - an extra £875k for fans attending 10 games a year at 'normal' ticket prices.  You could buy some decent talent into a business to 'sell' the game day experience for that.  And then you would be managing a growing business with all of the benefits that brings.

(p.s. this is reply just on the commercial model of season tickets, not a critique of the Giants)

This got me thinking does any club do anything like a best of both worlds option? For example something like a season ticket/membership whereby you pay £80, for example, then pay a small amount for tickets thereafter, say £5. The club still gets upfront money and fans can spread the cost, still get a discount overall and only pay for the matches they go to. It also gets away from the season ticket culture, that has made it difficult to sell matches that aren't covered by a season ticket, without making individual matches ridiculously expensive.

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I liked the suggestion someone said once of early bird offers similar to airlines, where they try and fill it up the earlier you book and then it gets expensive. Encourages early purchases.

I think we need more of that. Too many just wait to get a ticket and then decide not to bother because x, y or z has happened during the week. Encourage early purchases, but don't completely devalue the product by setting the price low constantly.

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25 minutes ago, Damien said:

This got me thinking does any club do anything like a best of both worlds option? For example something like a season ticket/membership whereby you pay £80, for example, then pay a small amount for tickets thereafter, say £5. The club still gets upfront money and fans can spread the cost, still get a discount overall and only pay for the matches they go to. It also gets away from the season ticket culture, that has made it difficult to sell matches that aren't covered by a season ticket, without making individual matches ridiculously expensive.

In order for that to work I think you would look at a club membership approach where a membership fee (up front) would get you discounts on game tickets, merchandise etc.

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"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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This is the pricing for Bristol RU - a club with a traditionally working class support base - for one game.

Now I will caveat this with the fact that I don't know if Bristol grade fixtures based on attractiveness, and this would be a top grade fixture if they did. But this game is likely to get a very good crowd.

I think pricing is focused on by people who haven't done any research into whether pricing is the primary issue to getting people through the turnstiles.

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3 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

This is the pricing for Bristol RU - a club with a traditionally working class support base - for one game.

Now I will caveat this with the fact that I don't know if Bristol grade fixtures based on attractiveness, and this would be a top grade fixture if they did. But this game is likely to get a very good crowd.

I think pricing is focused on by people who haven't done any research into whether pricing is the primary issue to getting people through the turnstiles.

That’s the pricing for that one halfway line seat though, isn’t it?

(Without disagreeing with the rest of your point)

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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1 minute ago, gingerjon said:

That’s the pricing for that one halfway line seat though, isn’t it?

(Without disagreeing with the rest of your point)

No idea, probably. But even then, that's not far off what we charge at the Grand Final, let alone for a league game.

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Just now, Tommygilf said:

No idea, probably. But even then, that's not far off what we charge at the Grand Final, let alone for a league game.

Found it, not that it changes your argument much but just for the details:

https://www.bristolbearsrugby.com/news/matchday-pricing-confirmed-for-202122-season/

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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11 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

In order for that to work I think you would look at a club membership approach where a membership fee (up front) would get you discounts on game tickets, merchandise etc.

Yeah that's why I said season ticket/membership as my feeling is its more like I membership. I think it would open up a lot of possibilities and cross selling opportunities. 

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19 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

This is the pricing for Bristol RU - a club with a traditionally working class support base - for one game.

So much relevance in this one sentence. 

Bristol may have had a working class support base but now they will be selling themselves as the Rugby Union experience in the city and with that will come an assumption that they will attract a different (or should I say complementary) demographic who don't see price as a barrier... in fact they would see price as some indicator of quality or prestige.

This is where Rugby League has its eternal dilemma around our identity.  We are rightly proud of our heritage and our connections to the communities in the North of England but at the same time we see this as a demographic that won't spend big on tickets and broadcast partners and sponsors see this as a demographic that doesn't have that disposable income to sell into.

You can see from the World Cup partnersand sponsors attracted that we can break out of this but that is for the biggest event we offer and not the regular club games.

I say it is a dilemma because even of we could break out of this fixed demographic, would we want to, is it not the heart and soul of the game?

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"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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5 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

I see Huddersfield Giants have started selling season tickets at £65 for Adults!

This is far too cheap, sadly they seem to have no ideas to draw in home fans other than rock bottom prices.

No doubt they’ll still ask away fans to pay £24, over a third of the price of a season ticket and not far of half the price. Scandalous.

In my opinion it is too cheap, but the Giants might deem it a success IF it gets new fans to the game and they stay fans.

Once you go down the cheap season ticket route you have to stick with it, otherwise you could lose any new fans you gain. If they are charging £65 for next season they will have to charge no more than £70 the following season

I seem to remember a few years ago a Super League club offering season tickets for £99, but i can't remember who the club was and if it was a success.

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Whilst it's interesting to see what Bristol charge, it was only recently we were looking at Cricket charging a tenner or so for The Hundred (around half the price of an SL game). 

Why are they not just charging 70 quid? 

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19 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Whilst it's interesting to see what Bristol charge, it was only recently we were looking at Cricket charging a tenner or so for The Hundred (around half the price of an SL game). 

Why are they not just charging 70 quid? 

The Hundred made a £15m loss.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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6 minutes ago, Dave T said:

But we keep getting told it was a massive success

Not by me you don't.

It lost 25% of its TV audience from opening to final, didn't sell out its final day and, as I just said, lost £15m.

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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18 minutes ago, DC77 said:

Source?

Had a quick search and saw mostly positive things about it.

https://www.sportingferret.com/2021/08/25/was-the-hundred-tournament-a-success/

Which bits do you need details on?

Its own figures show a loss of £15m. The TV figures for the final are 25% lower than for the opening match. There were tickets on sale for the final right up until it started during which empty seats were visible.

If you want more than that we can talk about it in AOB.

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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