Fan Engagement Survey

[Damien]

Interesting reading and the results echo many of the posts and threads seen on here. The RFL and clubs really need to start taking notice of the way fans feel:

Kevin Rye, from Think Fan Engagement, said: “Just a casual conversation with a fan of a club in Rugby League will tell you that fans feel disconnected, disengaged with.

“What’s even more concerning at a time that everyone in the sport admits is critical for its future as a professional game, is that the governing bodies come out with almost no credit. The responses from fans are in many cases despairing, recognising the need for leadership, but lamenting the lack of it at a critical time.

“As someone who is largely an outsider to the sport, what comes across most in all the research so far, is that it’s a sport that isn’t comfortable in its own skin.

“Many of those in charge across the game seem to be almost embarrassed at it, lacking in confidence somehow. I don’t get that from the fans who completed this survey, who clearly love and cherish their clubs and what is a wonderful sport that unites communities, and which has an extraordinary origin story.

“My message to everyone in the sport is what many of those fans surveyed have said: listen, work with them, engage with them, and start by appreciating the sport for what it is.”

https://www.loverugbyleague.com/post/nationwide-survey-shows-rugby-league-fans-feel-shut-out-and-let-down/

[Dave T]

The headline results are a bit odd. They seem a bit weird to focus on. 

Did anybody here see this survey? 

I think if any question starts with "Do you think fans should be consulted on x, y and z?" you are going to get these results. Would be interested to know what the questions were. 

It reads like a survey commissioned by somebody with an agenda. 

Not saying the overall point is wrong, but it seems odd. 

[Man of Kent]

I participated in the survey and posted it here.

Kevin Rye is also featured in this week's 5Live RL podcast: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p09wkmnd

As a fellow Southern-based AFC Wimbledon fan who likes RL, I have to agree with Kevin's assessment that RL is a sport lacking in self-confidence, uncomfortable in its own skin and embarrassed to be a Northern sport rooted in its communities - even though that is its greatest strength.

[Dave T]

8 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

I participated in the survey and posted it here.

Kevin Rye is also featured in this week's 5Live RL podcast: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p09wkmnd

As a fellow Southern-based AFC Wimbledon fan who likes RL, I have to agree with Kevin's assessment that RL is a sport lacking in self-confidence, uncomfortable in its own skin and embarrassed to be a Northern sport rooted in its communities - even though that is its greatest strength.

Four of the 7 headline findings refer to change of badges. 

And the finding that fans should have the final say is just silly. 

[Man of Kent]

1 minute ago, Dave T said:

Four of the 7 headline findings refer to change of badges. 

And the finding that fans should have the final say is just silly. 

So we're just dismissing it all out of hand, 'move along, nothing to see here' style?

[Damien]

20 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The headline results are a bit odd. They seem a bit weird to focus on. 

Did anybody here see this survey? 

I think if any question starts with "Do you think fans should be consulted on x, y and z?" you are going to get these results. Would be interested to know what the questions were. 

It reads like a survey commissioned by somebody with an agenda. 

Not saying the overall point is wrong, but it seems odd. 

Kevin Rye explains his background, which is Football, and the reasoning behind the survey in the podcast mentioned in the article:

5 Live Rugby League - The Fans View on Rugby League - BBC Sounds

He seems far from someone with an agenda and explains himself awfully well in the podcast.

[Dave T]

4 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

So we're just dismissing it all out of hand, 'move along, nothing to see here' style?

Make up whatever you want, I didn't say that. 

But i am interested in who commissioned it and why. Hence asking about it.

[Man of Kent]

Just now, Damien said:

He seems far from someone with an agenda and explains himself awfully well in the podcast.

He's not. He's a genuine bloke who is passionate about fan engagement (as many Wimbledon fans are) and is baffled why RL cannot see the wood for the trees.

[Damien]

3 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

He's not. He's a genuine bloke who is passionate about fan engagement (as many Wimbledon fans are) and is baffled why RL cannot see the wood for the trees.

I know, it was a bad turn of phrase by me. I should have really said he is not.

[Dave T]

9 minutes ago, Damien said:

Kevin Rye explains his background, which is Football, and the reasoning behind the survey in the podcast mentioned in the article:

5 Live Rugby League - The Fans View on Rugby League - BBC Sounds

He seems far from someone with an agenda and explains himself awfully well in the podcast.

 

4 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

He's not. He's a genuine bloke who is passionate about fan engagement (as many Wimbledon fans are) and is baffled why RL cannot see the wood for the trees.

Thanks both for sharing the link, I've listened to half of it so far.

He does describe himself as a fan activist - which does suggest a non-neutral starting point.

He said he was provoked to do this because he doesn't see engagement from clubs with fans. That may be fair, but it is a starting point with a bias.

He appears to have an issue with branding and badges - he gives a lot of his own views rather than reporting the results. That is fine, I expect he is touting for consultancy work, but it is absolutely coming from an angle. 

I don't think anyone would disagree with the headline - I expect many fans are disengaged, but I was disappointed that it seemed to reflect the guys own view on branding and badges - from being on here it doesn't feel like there is huge grumpiness on branding issues within the game. 

Had this survey been talking about transparency, governance etc. I would expect give them more weight. 

It is what it is, but the results were very specific and disappointing tbh. 

[Man of Kent]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

 

Thanks both for sharing the link, I've listened to half of it so far.

He does describe himself as a fan activist - which does suggest a non-neutral starting point.

He said he was provoked to do this because he doesn't see engagement from clubs with fans. That may be fair, but it is a starting point with a bias.

He appears to have an issue with branding and badges - he gives a lot of his own views rather than reporting the results. That is fine, I expect he is touting for consultancy work, but it is absolutely coming from an angle. 

I don't think anyone would disagree with the headline - I expect many fans are disengaged, but I was disappointed that it seemed to reflect the guys own view on branding and badges - from being on here it doesn't feel like there is huge grumpiness on branding issues within the game. 

Had this survey been talking about transparency, governance etc. I would expect give them more weight. 

It is what it is, but the results were very specific and disappointing tbh. 

To be fair, he says in the podcast that the game could do away with consultancy expense by listening properly to fans.

It may be his ultimate agenda is to compile a fan engagement index, with a league table. That would be welcome, as it might force clubs to up their game.

[Damien]

1 minute ago, Dave T said:

 

Thanks both for sharing the link, I've listened to half of it so far.

He does describe himself as a fan activist - which does suggest a non-neutral starting point.

He said he was provoked to do this because he doesn't see engagement from clubs with fans. That may be fair, but it is a starting point with a bias.

He appears to have an issue with branding and badges - he gives a lot of his own views rather than reporting the results. That is fine, I expect he is touting for consultancy work, but it is absolutely coming from an angle. 

I don't think anyone would disagree with the headline - I expect many fans are disengaged, but I was disappointed that it seemed to reflect the guys own view on branding and badges - from being on here it doesn't feel like there is huge grumpiness on branding issues within the game. 

Had this survey been talking about transparency, governance etc. I would expect give them more weight. 

It is what it is, but the results were very specific and disappointing tbh. 

You seem to be reading far more into this than me. If you think he has an agenda I'd say as much about your posts so far to be honest. What you say just doesn't correlate to what I have read or listened to and it seems an awfully odd view to take.

Listening to the podcast the RFL could do far worse than get Kevin Rye involved in some capacity. He doesn't half speak a lot of sense and completely sees what is wrong and what needs to be done. Fan engagement and listening to fans and the thoughts of someone who obviously knows what he is talking about on the subject is not a bad thing. It is precisely what RL needs.

[gingerjon]

3 minutes ago, Damien said:

 It is precisely what RL needs.

If this is precisely what RL needs then any part-time student with access to Survey Monkey will do.

It's a nice headline, and speaks to what rugby league could do with, but the results chosen - so presumably the questions asked - are dire and directionless.

[sweaty craiq]

If you cannot show complete confidence that your product is more than capable of meeting the opportunity or need, then you shouldn't be anywhere near a top table. RL has a potentially great future in the UK but not with idiots running it. 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, gingerjon said:

If this is precisely what RL needs then any part-time student with access to Survey Monkey will do.

It's a nice headline, and speaks to what rugby league could do with, but the results chosen - so presumably the questions asked - are dire and directionless.

That's really not what I said so its an odd slant to take, I literally wrote an entire paragraph before it that you seem to have ignored.

[gingerjon]

4 minutes ago, Damien said:

That's really not what I said so its an odd slant to take, I literally wrote an entire paragraph before it that you seem to have ignored.

You did. You said we could do a lot worse than get him involved.

My reaction is that if this is the standard he operates at then a work experience kid with a Survey Monkey account will be just as good.

[Dave T]

Just now, Man of Kent said:

To be fair, he says in the podcast that the game could do away with consultancy expense by listening properly to fans.

It may be his ultimate agenda is to compile a fan engagement index, with a league table. That would be welcome, as it might force clubs to up their game.

Agreed on your last point and it is a good thing for a fan voice platform.

[Dave T]

17 minutes ago, Damien said:

You seem to be reading far more into this than me. If you think he has an agenda I'd say as much about your posts so far to be honest. What you say just doesn't correlate to what I have read or listened to and it seems an awfully odd view to take.

Listening to the podcast the RFL could do far worse than get Kevin Rye involved in some capacity. He doesn't half speak a lot of sense and completely sees what is wrong and what needs to be done. Fan engagement and listening to fans and the thoughts of someone who obviously knows what he is talking about on the subject is not a bad thing. It is precisely what RL needs.

Hmm. I'm an RL fan, why would I have an agenda to defend clubs on points like this?

Fan engagement is a great thing, fan surveys can be useful. That doesn't mean all fan surveys are useful.

 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, gingerjon said:

You did. You said we could do a lot worse than get him involved.

My reaction is that if this is the standard he operates at then a work experience kid with a Survey Monkey account will be just as good.

I said "listening to the podcast the RFL could do far worse than get Kevin Rye involved in some capacity. He doesn't half speak a lot of sense....." I also said "thoughts of someone who obviously knows what he is talking about on the subject".

It was quite obvious I wasn't referring to just doing a survey. Otherwise that is what I would have said.

 

[Dave T]

It would be very useful to see the questions and results.

[gingerjon]

3 minutes ago, Damien said:

I said "listening to the podcast the RFL could do far worse than get Kevin Rye involved in some capacity. He doesn't half speak a lot of sense....." I also said "thoughts of someone who obviously knows what he is talking about on the subject".

It was quite obvious I wasn't referring to just doing a survey. Otherwise that is what I would have said.

 

Either way, this all seems remarkably lightweight.

[Moove]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

It would be very useful to see the questions and results.

According to their website they're due to publish more in the 'coming days and weeks'

[Dave T]

22 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

If you cannot show complete confidence that your product is more than capable of meeting the opportunity or need, then you shouldn't be anywhere near a top table. RL has a potentially great future in the UK but not with idiots running it. 

Which question leads to this conclusion? Or is it just his opinion? 

[Damien]

4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Hmm. I'm an RL fan, why would I have an agenda to defend clubs on points like this?

Fan engagement is a great thing, fan surveys can be useful. That doesn't mean all fan surveys are useful.

 

I agree fan surveys in isolation cant be a complete waste of time and can be no more than lip service. They are also often completely ignored. That's why it needs to be much more than that. The value is having the right person to listen properly to what fans are saying, interpret and present that and then formulate a strategy to improve that. In the podcast he nailed pretty much all of what he said, even putting Dave Woods right with things like Huddersfield fans chanting Fartown, and even past subjects like mergers. I can certainly see the value of getting him, or someone like him, involved.

[Man of Kent]

6 minutes ago, Damien said:

In the podcast he nailed pretty much all of what he said, even putting Dave Woods right with things like Huddersfield fans chanting Fartown, and even past subjects like mergers. I can certainly see the value of getting him, or someone like him, involved.

Thought Dave Woods kind of proved his point about RL feeling embarrassed and insecure about its heritage and Northern-ness with the Fartown example then Wood's need to point out that Catalans and Toulouse came top.