Salford to move to Moor Lane?

[Dave T]

10 minutes ago, Ray Cashmere said:

 

I'd guess not considering the deal they supposedly offered Williams which suggests that their ability to spend is a bigger concern than restrictions imposed upon their spending.

https://www.seriousaboutrl.com/we-had-a-legal-document-wigan-explains-how-they-could-have-forced-things-through-with-george-williams-42850/

[Damien]

14 minutes ago, Ray Cashmere said:

Does anyone know who Wigan's second marquee is after Bateman? Do they even have one?

I'd guess not considering the deal they supposedly offered Williams which suggests that their ability to spend is a bigger concern than restrictions imposed upon their spending.

People get far too hung up on marquees as an excuse not to raise the salary cap. Marquee players often aren't good value for money, Wigan's have invariably been poor. Looking at last season George Burgess was a disaster and Bateman average.

I can completely understand why a club would not want to have marquees. There are plenty of good reasons not to pay 2 players excessively more than the rest, squad morale and putting all your chips in one (or two) basket as much as anything. I also don't think its particularly good to have a system that encourages a marquee getting £250k and paid a fortune while a youngster plays for 30k.

Edited November 11, 2021 by Damien

[Red Willow]

A few misguided comments on here.

The current club don't owe the council money so they can't come after them. The money is in the CVA. Blame Marwen for that.

The Academy was scrapped after the RFL didn't award funding or a place in the elite. Again Marwen decided to save money and this was his best answer.

The move will probably increase the funding available if as suggested the concessions money goes to the club.

The ground at Moor Lane may be expanded if crowds pick up

The current management seem to be going the right way as evidenced by the pathways and the work in local schools.

It is a long hard path 

[Tommygilf]

39 minutes ago, M j M said:

It seems to be mostly Wigan fans who miss the old days of just outspending everyone else. (Although that club's problems are much wider and include apparently disastrous salary cap management).

It doesn't at all though does it?

[idrewthehaggis]

On 09/11/2021 at 22:04, dead man inc said:

Well it does when Salford decided to default on the £1.5 million pound loan from the council - taxpayers money that could/should have been used to help the most disadvantaged  in the Salford community

Your concern for our fellow souls is admirable. Good on you. But a couple of points. First Local Government finances aren't like a wage or benefits, all ploughed into one account. There are separate funds, strictly enforced by the Treasury where monies can be spent or not. Paid or not, it wouldn't be going into SCC's social care budget.

On 10/11/2021 at 09:05, Mr Frisky said:

Hope they go for 6G then.

It will 6G, 3D and in the 5th Dimension. Its Salford ain't it.

On 10/11/2021 at 10:26, Tonka said:

To be fair to Ray he quite deliberately said "full commercial control" in his original post.  When he says "effectively, yes" on the issue of legal ownership, he's not trying to suggest that leasehold = legal ownership of the title.  We all know, however, that leasehold ownership is akin to full ownership if you can treat the asset as yours, and that's all he's saying.  The length of the lease will be important (21 years is different to 100, for example), as will whether Salford as leaseholder is free to develop the seating capacity or make any other changes to enhance the stadium.

I just want to wish good luck to Ray, he comes across as pragmatic and on top of the issues.

Indeed one of the better contributors. And clearly knows his stuff.

On 10/11/2021 at 14:11, Ray Cashmere said:

Thanks, I appreciate it.

My issue is when people try and use things like this as a stick to beat Salford with such is their desperation to attack clubs like us.

Criticise our crowds. Criticise our poor performances on the pitch. Criticise the Koukash era. We're a long way away from where we should and need to be. Just don't try and manufacture contrived arguments over things which are positive and promising.

Yup "Contrived arguments," or perhaps just bitter or scared. 

On 10/11/2021 at 17:10, theswanmcr said:

We’ll said. Not everyone but there is a lot of Salford bashing on here.

We are hammered for the mess we are in with the Stadium - fair enough and mistakes were made, but we built a new ground (after the much better original design collapsed) and didn’t just sit on our a*** like others. Turns out it was the wrong option in the end but we showed ambition and it backfired.

So now we have Hobson’s Choice by the looks of it with Moor Lane. And many having a go at the lack of ambition and small time look of a 5k stadium… after we have clearly shown that a bigger ground is too big for little Salford!

This ground option - though by no means perfect - will be fine for where we are at the minute and as you say Shropshire looks good when full.

if other bigger clubs with bigger grounds can come from somewhere to take our place in SL so be it.. but having been to both stadiums I’d rather go to Moor Lane than AJ Bell any day no matter what league we are playing in.

Hobson's Choice. Aptly Salfordian I think.

23 hours ago, Morris Wanchuk said:

I’m more bothered about the fact that Salford have been allowed to operate at this ‘elite level’ without running an academy. If this move allows them to consolidate themselves financially through increased revenues on match days etc and invest in an academy then that’s a massive plus. 

Clearly you don't realize SRD have been trying to re-build that Academy since Koukash's decision. Or that the RFL only seemingly want the advantages of those Academies and the rigged salary cap dispensations with the Big Clubs.  Regional Academies run free of the clubs would be far cheaper and better in quality.

12 hours ago, Damien said:

It's not just grounds though, and there is just as much criticism of clubs with grounds that are too big. Let's face it, the AJ Bell isn't a big ground and looks fine with 5-6,000 people but Salford just did a poor job of filling it and could even get those crowds.

It really is the full package of what a club brings that people look at when clubs get criticised. That is why a club like Castleford doesn't get anywhere near the same criticism as those you cite despite playing in a poorer ground than Salford or Huddersfield. 

Tell how they did a bad job? I am sure Mr King and Mr Blease would like to know better.Personally I thought it was because people were annoyed with MK, the Willows closing or the site of the AJ Bell of Doom or that the team was ######, unlike MUFC or MCFC.

6 hours ago, Kirmonds pouch said:

If I were Salford I'd go the full way, re-brand as Manchester and try and get a gig here at the Manchester City Academy stadium, Academy!!!!

I know it's not in Salford but then what is these days and of course it may not be available or far too expensive, I don't even know who owns it, is it the council or the club?. However it's modern, central to Manchester, well served by public transport and parking. It holds 7,000, perfect for a club like Salford.

I know nothing about Manchester politics but is there any reason this couldn't happen, no sarcasm please, I'm just wondering?

First MCFC aren't looking to rent out that fairly excellent ground to anyone bar themselves. It would be Council owned athletics stadium round the corner they would play or the National Speedway Centre in Belle Vue. 

Second there is no need or desire for a name change. No more than say Aston Villa, Benfica, St Pauli, Sampdoria, Feyenoord, Chelsea,Everton or Patrick, the last two who don't even play in those suburbs.

And lastly if it is Moor Lane, its four miles from the very centre  of Manchester. It couldn't get closer for a big city.

 

Lastly can we knock it on the head about 5,000. The intention is to expand it to up to 8,000, which is more than ample for a league that averages that per season.

[Mr Frisky]

54 minutes ago, idrewthehaggis said:

Your concern for our fellow souls is admirable. Good on you. But a couple of points. First Local Government finances aren't like a wage or benefits, all ploughed into one account. There are separate funds, strictly enforced by the Treasury where monies can be spent or not. Paid or not, it wouldn't be going into SCC's social care budget.

It will 6G, 3D and in the 5th Dimension. Its Salford ain't it.

Indeed one of the better contributors. And clearly knows his stuff.

Yup "Contrived arguments," or perhaps just bitter or scared. 

Hobson's Choice. Aptly Salfordian I think.

Clearly you don't realize SRD have been trying to re-build that Academy since Koukash's decision. Or that the RFL only seemingly want the advantages of those Academies and the rigged salary cap dispensations with the Big Clubs.  Regional Academies run free of the clubs would be far cheaper and better in quality.

Tell how they did a bad job? I am sure Mr King and Mr Blease would like to know better.Personally I thought it was because people were annoyed with MK, the Willows closing or the site of the AJ Bell of Doom or that the team was ######, unlike MUFC or MCFC.

First MCFC aren't looking to rent out that fairly excellent ground to anyone bar themselves. It would be Council owned athletics stadium round the corner they would play or the National Speedway Centre in Belle Vue. 

Second there is no need or desire for a name change. No more than say Aston Villa, Benfica, St Pauli, Sampdoria, Feyenoord, Chelsea,Everton or Patrick, the last two who don't even play in those suburbs.

And lastly if it is Moor Lane, its four miles from the very centre  of Manchester. It couldn't get closer for a big city.

 

Lastly can we knock it on the head about 5,000. The intention is to expand it to up to 8,000, which is more than ample for a league that averages that per season.

You had 2 lastlys- one less lastly and one more third then you would be on the correct track.

So overall what are you trying to say?

[Henson Park Old Firm]

I can't wait for Salford to announce the new stadium, this thread will go into a Chernobyl meltdown

 

 

(but all jokes aside I hope things work out well for them)

[EastLondonMike]

Best of luck to Salford. I don’t have a problem with them only having a 5k capacity if/when they move to Moor Lane. If they can fill it regularly it will show there is some potential there for growth. Maybe with a team performing well on the pitch they could at some point look to take a few games to bigger stadia. Here’s hoping.

[Guest]

4 hours ago, EastLondonMike said:

Best of luck to Salford. I don’t have a problem with them only having a 5k capacity if/when they move to Moor Lane. If they can fill it regularly it will show there is some potential there for growth. Maybe with a team performing well on the pitch they could at some point look to take a few games to bigger stadia. Here’s hoping.

Admirable sentiments but if Salford couldn’t even come close to filling the AJ Bell when they *were* performing well on the pitch, why would they need to take games to bigger stadia in a year or two?

The time to step back, move to a smaller ground and regroup is maybe after a relegation, not while you are still in the top flight. 

[sweaty craiq]

5K filled every week would be great but here is the link to the stadium/facilities The-Peninsula-Stadium-Guide.pdf (salfordcityfc.co.uk) Take a minute to look at the ground and the parking sections.

Parking will be a nightmare, and as far as I can see has not been considered - but that just affects matchday fans!!!!

Look at the shallow seating/terrace and tell me what the commentary position will be for Sky or indeed any decent viewing cameras?

[steve oates]

8 hours ago, EastLondonMike said:

Best of luck to Salford. I don’t have a problem with them only having a 5k capacity if/when they move to Moor Lane. If they can fill it regularly it will show there is some potential there for growth. Maybe with a team performing well on the pitch they could at some point look to take a few games to bigger stadia. Here’s hoping.

I'm not sure what the growth is here? Not sure where the "well performing team" will come from.

History can recall the Snape days when Manchester soccer stars would turn up to games, then the John Wilkinson days where money from Cebora Ltd bolstered the team, then Koukash who seemingly found bankrolling the Reds too difficult probably because his businesses didn't do that much.

They've had decades of low crowds (somewhere around 4K) regardless of any successes and they face a large drop in TV money with nobody wealthy enough to plug those financial holes. Their task is the same as Wakefield's tends to be and that is year on year avoid that bottom spot. I don't particularly "hope" they stay up because I'm then hoping another club will go down.......

[steve oates]

26 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

Tell me what the commentary position will be for Sky or indeed any decent viewing cameras?

The west stand of LSV I'd suggest as it really is Beaumont's turn to have a proper go at Superleague. 

[Ray Cashmere]

45 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

5K filled every week would be great but here is the link to the stadium/facilities The-Peninsula-Stadium-Guide.pdf (salfordcityfc.co.uk) Take a minute to look at the ground and the parking sections.

Parking will be a nightmare, and as far as I can see has not been considered - but that just affects matchday fans!!!!

Look at the shallow seating/terrace and tell me what the commentary position will be for Sky or indeed any decent viewing cameras?

All these things were discussed at the fans forum

[gingerjon]

49 minutes ago, sweaty craiq said:

Look at the shallow seating/terrace and tell me what the commentary position will be for Sky or indeed any decent viewing cameras?

EFL seem to get coverage from there every other week as required.

Does rugby league need special cameras?

[Davo5]

33 minutes ago, Ray Cashmere said:

All these things were discussed at the fans forum

Were any solutions forthcoming ?

[Scubby]

With due respect to Salford, could you imagine if Wakefield or Huddersfield had put forward a solution to play at Dewsbury in the SL in future? The reaction from all circles would have been exactly the same.

It is not the move it is the elite competition potentially placing the bar so low that the move is permitted. 

[BladeHearts]

I might be missing something here, but Moor Lane looks like a pretty tidy stadium, which is a perfect capacity for Salford’s current crowds and seems to have scope for a moderate amount of future development.

 

[theswanmcr]

6 hours ago, Johnoco said:

The time to step back, move to a smaller ground and regroup is maybe after a relegation, not while you are still in the top flight. 

The time to step back, move to a smaller ground and regroup is - regardless of what league you are in - when you about to be made homeless and have no other option.

[theswanmcr]

2 minutes ago, BladeHearts said:

I might be missing something here, but Moor Lane looks like a pretty tidy stadium, which is a perfect capacity for Salford’s current crowds and seems to have scope for a moderate amount of future development.

 

Nope you’re not missing anything. As everyone has admitted it is not perfect - but it is absolutely fine. Tight little stadium that creates a good atmosphere.

Some of the comments that it is a joke or disgrace that SL should be playing here are way over the top and those posters have clearly never been to the likes of Trailfinders!

[Harry Stottle]

45 minutes ago, Scubby said:

With due respect to Salford, could you imagine if Wakefield or Huddersfield had put forward a solution to play at Dewsbury in the SL in future? The reaction from all circles would have been exactly the same.

It is not the move it is the elite competition potentially placing the bar so low that the move is permitted. 

Which begs the question, will we ever see a return to licensing?

What would the 'Criteria' to qualify for the selection process look like, how lenient would it be, or would it be done in the knowledge that a number of teams would simply not be up to the standard required.

You make a very good point with your suggestion of the standards and the height of the bar to hurdle.

 

[Harry Stottle]

1 minute ago, theswanmcr said:

Nope you’re not missing anything. As everyone has admitted it is not perfect - but it is absolutely fine. Tight little stadium that creates a good atmosphere.

Some of the comments that it is a joke or disgrace that SL should be playing here are way over the top and those posters have clearly never been to the likes of Trailfinders!

I don't think using the Trailfinders as a comparison answers any questions.

[theswanmcr]

3 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

I don't think using the Trailfinders as a comparison answers any questions.

What questions Harry?

It appears that this is our only option. No point going over the whys and wherefores yet again.

[To Be Confirmed]

3 hours ago, sweaty craiq said:

5K filled every week would be great but here is the link to the stadium/facilities The-Peninsula-Stadium-Guide.pdf (salfordcityfc.co.uk) Take a minute to look at the ground and the parking sections.

Parking will be a nightmare, and as far as I can see has not been considered - but that just affects matchday fans!!!!

Look at the shallow seating/terrace and tell me what the commentary position will be for Sky or indeed any decent viewing cameras?

The club are currently looking at options around Moor Lane, they have also confirmed that Park and ride schemes would be used.

 

Re TV cameras, cub have confirmed that a  gantry would be built on top of one of the current stands, both confirmed at the fans forum.

[Red Willow]

52 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Which begs the question, will we ever see a return to licensing?

What would the 'Criteria' to qualify for the selection process look like, how lenient would it be, or would it be done in the knowledge that a number of teams would simply not be up to the standard required.

You make a very good point with your suggestion of the standards and the height of the bar to hurdle.

 

it was trying to meet the criteria last time meant Salford moved to AJ Bell. Other clubs didn't meet them but that wasn't an issue for them.

I think no matter what Salford decide there will be some bashing going on here, often those shouting the loudest support clubs that have also had previous insolvencies, or benefited from other "deal"

 

The current board are working hard to resolve many of the issues, there will be an academy, a woman's team. A pathfinder programme has been established and the development foundation are working with a large number of schools in Greater Manchester some of which have never played RL. 

It is early days but I would hope that the RL community would support this as good new rather than the usual tribal nonsense.

[Damien]

42 minutes ago, Red Willow said:

The current board are working hard to resolve many of the issues, there will be an academy, a woman's team. A pathfinder programme has been established and the development foundation are working with a large number of schools in Greater Manchester some of which have never played RL. 

I think if all of this happens then people will be a lot more positive about Salford. It isn't just about the ground and is the full package as a club and all of this is certainly a step in the right dircetion.

Edited November 12, 2021 by Damien