End of season international calendar

[JM2010]

The threads about the size of the Tonga side and England team vs Samoa is getting me excited for the WC. There's no better games to watch than England, Australia, NZ, Tonga, Samoa, Fiji and PNG taking each other on. 

I still believe England should play France mid season with the other NH clubs also playing each other but at the end of each season I want England to be taking on the SH teams. That could be a test series, 4 Nations, 6 Nations etc. These are the games that get the neutrals interested and show how entertaining RL can be.

Does anyone know if there is a plan beyond next year's WC?

[Gerrumonside ref]

1 minute ago, JM2010 said:

The threads about the size of the Tonga side and England team vs Samoa is getting me excited for the WC. There's no better games to watch than England, Australia, NZ, Tonga, Samoa, Fiji and PNG taking each other on. 

I still believe England should play France mid season with the other NH clubs also playing each other but at the end of each season I want England to be taking on the SH teams. That could be a test series, 4 Nations, 6 Nations etc. These are the games that get the neutrals interested and show how entertaining RL can be.

Does anyone know if there is a plan beyond next year's WC?

I don’t think there is a concrete plan for England internationals beyond the WC as of this moment - there’ll be some of course.

We might want to play the SH teams, but of course the release of the players is at the behest of the NRL scheduling.

I totally agree that France vs England should become a regular fixture especially to build on the current momentum of Catalans and Toulouse. 

[JM2010]

5 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

Australia dont care and we should stop caring about them. England need to be commiting to playing European nations and inviting a SH team that gets left out of Oceanic cup.  4 nations from that.  1 in London,  one up north in a target market  (Sheffield would be my choice) .

I agree about England committing to playing European teams but I think that should be mid season.

Although the NRL have upset a lot of us I still prefer watching England taking on the SH teams

[doc]

The RFL have said that a calendar will be announced soon. 

They've just got to retrieve the fag packet from behind the couch.

[theswanmcr]

Slight tangent… why in RL do we call them ‘end of season’ or ‘mid season’ internationals?

We have become ingrained that we have to shoehorn some in if we can in between the all-important Super League. Same for Aus/NRL.

Football - and no other major sport- doesn’t do this. Their ‘season’ runs roughly August to May with league, cups and internationals throughout. Then a gap (or Euros or World Cup).

We need internationals to just become a regular part of the season, not be grateful that we somehow found a way to squeeze one whole ‘extra’ game into the middle of a ridiculously long 27 game league plus play offs season featuring only 12 ruddy teams.

[Phil W]

57 minutes ago, theswanmcr said:

Slight tangent… why in RL do we call them ‘end of season’ or ‘mid season’ internationals?

We have become ingrained that we have to shoehorn some in if we can in between the all-important Super League. Same for Aus/NRL.

Football - and no other major sport- doesn’t do this. Their ‘season’ runs roughly August to May with league, cups and internationals throughout. Then a gap (or Euros or World Cup).

We need internationals to just become a regular part of the season, not be grateful that we somehow found a way to squeeze one whole ‘extra’ game into the middle of a ridiculously long 27 game league plus play offs season featuring only 12 ruddy teams.

Agreed, an international calendar that's regular is a must. 

What union has with internationals works but they maybe play too many. Could we maybe look at a Five Nations tournament where teams play each other home or away with promotion and relegation. England, France, Scotland and Greece and Ireland are the top five ranked teams at the minute but not sure on if Greece can play home games as remember some internal issues? So maybe Italy come in. England having to go to Edinburgh or Dublin creates interest.

[welshmagpie]

1 hour ago, JM2010 said:

The threads about the size of the Tonga side and England team vs Samoa is getting me excited for the WC. There's no better games to watch than England, Australia, NZ, Tonga, Samoa, Fiji and PNG taking each other on. 

I still believe England should play France mid season with the other NH clubs also playing each other but at the end of each season I want England to be taking on the SH teams. That could be a test series, 4 Nations, 6 Nations etc. These are the games that get the neutrals interested and show how entertaining RL can be.

Does anyone know if there is a plan beyond next year's WC?

In an ideal world, in a non-world cup year with all the stars aligned, I’d like to see (in England’s case):

June: England vs Wales (Euro Cup)

June: France vs England (Euro Cup)

Oct: England vs Ireland (Euro Cup)

Nov: Tonga vs England (4 Nations)

Nov: NZ vs England (4 Nations)

Nov: Australia vs England (4 Nations)

Thus providing elite competition at the end of the season alongside meaningful build up through a European cup. Beneath the Euro Cup would be another 4 team comp (Scotland, Italy, Serbia, Greece) with promotion and relegation. Equally, Federation Shield beneath 4 Nations (these would be the World Cup quarter finalists to reward those). 

[welshmagpie]

1 hour ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

I don’t think there is a concrete plan for England internationals beyond the WC as of this moment - there’ll be some of course.

We might want to play the SH teams, but of course the release of the players is at the behest of the NRL scheduling.

I totally agree that France vs England should become a regular fixture especially to build on the current momentum of Catalans and Toulouse. 

If you’re on Twitter, give Troy Grant (IRL chair) a follow. He regularly gets asked about the proposed international calendar. It’s essentially ready to go but is currently with member nations and he hopes to release in Dec/Jan.

[Sports Prophet]

18 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

Thats fine but you really arent the market for internationals.  Its the casual fta viewer and they dont seem to care who we play so I would rather grow our own market than involve Australia. 

This persistent idea that casual viewers are the big key keeps tripping me up.

Surely the number 1 priority of a sport is to sell out major fixtures at showpiece venues.   That is not England v Wales at LSV.

RL in both UK and Aus are far too reliant on broadcast income. In my opinion, the reliance, or should I say dependence, on Sky this is one of the specific reasons why RL has fallen as low as it has in the consciousness of the UK general public.

[JM2010]

22 hours ago, welshmagpie said:

In an ideal world, in a non-world cup year with all the stars aligned, I’d like to see (in England’s case):

June: England vs Wales (Euro Cup)

June: France vs England (Euro Cup)

Oct: England vs Ireland (Euro Cup)

Nov: Tonga vs England (4 Nations)

Nov: NZ vs England (4 Nations)

Nov: Australia vs England (4 Nations)

Thus providing elite competition at the end of the season alongside meaningful build up through a European cup. Beneath the Euro Cup would be another 4 team comp (Scotland, Italy, Serbia, Greece) with promotion and relegation. Equally, Federation Shield beneath 4 Nations (these would be the World Cup quarter finalists to reward those). 

I agree mostly but I'd have stand alone test matches mid season and include Jamaica and Nigeria in this. A 4/6 N at the end of the season for England and the SH teams would be very competitive and provide good tv viewing.

I'd run Euro, Americas and African tournaments at the end of the season

[Guest]

23 hours ago, Phil W said:

Agreed, an international calendar that's regular is a must. 

What union has with internationals works but they maybe play too many. Could we maybe look at a Five Nations tournament where teams play each other home or away with promotion and relegation. England, France, Scotland and Greece and Ireland are the top five ranked teams at the minute but not sure on if Greece can play home games as remember some internal issues? So maybe Italy come in. England having to go to Edinburgh or Dublin creates interest.

Irish don't care about rugby league. It will never compete with the union team. The sports market is already crowded between football, rugby union, and GAA. Italy is effectively an Australian side.

[theswanmcr]

1 hour ago, NW10LDN said:

Irish don't care about rugby league. It will never compete with the union team. The sports market is already crowded between football, rugby union, and GAA. Italy is effectively an Australian side.

Ireland didn’t once care about cricket. In just 30 years they have gone from nothing to a test playing nation.

Play meaningful regular internationals and there’s no reason we can’t find a niche there at all.

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, theswanmcr said:

Ireland didn’t once care about cricket. In just 30 years they have gone from nothing to a test playing nation.

Play meaningful regular internationals and there’s no reason we can’t find a niche there at all.

They still don't care about cricket. It's mostly British expats and Asian immigrants. There is no niche market to be found. They have football, a decent rugby union team, and their own sports of Gaelic football and hurling. Jamaica has fledging domestic scene but their national team (if you can even call it that) played Scotland in Featherstone. Really just an admission that international rugby league is a joke and no amount of heritage sides are going to change that.

[Big Picture]

13 hours ago, NW10LDN said:

Jamaica has fledging domestic scene but their national team (if you can even call it that) played Scotland in Featherstone. Really just an admission that international rugby league is a joke and no amount of heritage sides are going to change that.

And judging by the sparse "crowd" visible on the highlight video on Youtube, fewer than 200 spectators bothered with it.

[Chris22]

15 hours ago, NW10LDN said:

They still don't care about cricket. It's mostly British expats and Asian immigrants. There is no niche market to be found. They have football, a decent rugby union team, and their own sports of Gaelic football and hurling. Jamaica has fledging domestic scene but their national team (if you can even call it that) played Scotland in Featherstone. Really just an admission that international rugby league is a joke and no amount of heritage sides are going to change that.

Is the Scottish international rugby union team a joke? Only 1 of their tryscorers in a 60 point win over Tonga the other week was Scottish born?

[theswanmcr]

16 hours ago, NW10LDN said:

 

16 hours ago, NW10LDN said:

They still don't care about cricket. It's mostly British expats and Asian immigrants. There is no niche market to be found. They have football, a decent rugby union team, and their own sports of Gaelic football and hurling. Jamaica has fledging domestic scene but their national team (if you can even call it that) played Scotland in Featherstone. Really just an admission that international rugby league is a joke and no amount of heritage sides are going to change that.

Well you should go and tell Cricket Ireland to pack it all in then. Tell them that their men’s and women’s, U19s, U15s test teams, the inter-province champs, hundreds of schools mights as well not bother. Liquidise an organisation with a 10m Euros annual turnover (just under half of the RFLs) because no one cares. I’d say that’s a pretty good niche market.

No one in the grand scheme of 60 million people across Britain really cares about RL. We are a niche market ourselves. Yes international RL is a joke but simply saying ‘what’s the point’ isn’t going to help change that.

[2blackrooks]

I think International matches are great and the interest is building

i get The fascination of playing Australia NZ it bring in the money but I cherish the sight of PNG and Samoa launching themselves at the England defence, I would be bringing these teams over in a quad nation event with France 

Putting England in with Ireland Wales Scotland, at the moment I just don’t think it works there going to put 50 odd point past them, this is a mute point for some but I do believe a England reserve squad would be better, they still would put up a decent score but would lift the quality of play over time, 

Maybe adding a Tonga Fiji to the Sco Wal Ire mix would spice it up offering strong opposition a good media slant? Who knows

as for the home nations having little interest I just don’t agree the interest is there it just needs time and regular international game and local players coming through the system 

I can only talk for Scotland, the game in Featherstone total disaster from a media point of view good game though. In the late 90’s up to early 20’s we could get 2,000 + coming through the gates but the stopping of the funding from the RL for development officers had a devastating effect on RL up here we had a strong league but over teams faded away, but things are turning, 

Remember when RU started the WC the scores and the quality was terrible but overtime teams have improved and the WC is now a viable product

RL is in a similar position as if we’re starting back at the beginning, it ain’t gonna look pretty over the next few years but given time and the will to move forward we can have an amazing product, the important thing is RU have neglected Tier 2 nations even to this day it’s happening RL need to embrace tier 2 3 teams and give them the opportunity to grow stronger, that’s my opinion some will agree some will laugh it’ll only matter if the powers that be actually do something about it 

[JM2010]

On 09/11/2021 at 21:09, welshmagpie said:

If you’re on Twitter, give Troy Grant (IRL chair) a follow. He regularly gets asked about the proposed international calendar. It’s essentially ready to go but is currently with member nations and he hopes to release in Dec/Jan.

I hope it looks something like this

Years 1 and 2

Mid season

England vs Exiles and France

France vs England and Wales

Wales vs France and Ireland

Ireland vs Wales and Scotland

Scotland vs Ireland and Jamaica

Jamaica vs Scotland and England Knights

Nigeria vs Jamaica and England Knights

End of season

6 Nations including England

Euros 1, 2 and 3

Middle East and Africa Championship

Americas Championship

Year 3 

Same as 1 and 2 with WC qualifiers replacing end of season championships 

Year 4 

Mid season the same as other years 

End of season 

WC

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Sports Prophet]

Realistically, the only nations that could host tournaments with reasonable support are Eng, Fra, Aus and NZ.

I would love to see a six nations with a final played over six weeks, hosted every four years in between a WC. I think it should be played in the same hemisphere as the previous WC in order to capitalise on the interest generated by the WC. Australia, NZ and England as well as three qualifiers. 2 from the hosting hemisphere and 1 from the opposite hemisphere.

Eg WC in England, 6 nations two yrs later in France. 

I don’t think I would be desperate to see anymore of the Kangaroos than that. I would probably be more interested in the subsequent qualification tournaments held the year before a six nations.

[Sports Prophet]

On 11/11/2021 at 06:17, NW10LDN said:

…Really just an admission that international rugby league is a joke and no amount of heritage sides are going to change that.

I honestly think that the club game is where the sport of RL has the biggest opportunity to grow international interest in our sport.

[RugbyLeagueGeek]

25 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

I honestly think that the club game is where the sport of RL has the biggest opportunity to grow international interest in our sport.

How would you see that working, out of interest?

[Sports Prophet]

2 hours ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

How would you see that working, out of interest?

I dare not say, fearing irrational reprisal

Let me at least say, politically wise, I think the club game in RL better fits the capitalist nature required to suitably promote the sport to new markets and furthermore, the clubs are far more evenly matched in greater numbers at the highest level than what national sides are.

I will further add, if RL did use the club game to demonstrate the sport at its best, it would not be the first sport to be doing so.

[RugbyLeagueGeek]

1 hour ago, Sports Prophet said:

I dare not say, fearing irrational reprisal

1 hour ago, Sports Prophet said:

Let me at least say, politically wise, I think the club game in RL better fits the capitalist nature required to suitably promote the sport to new markets and furthermore, the clubs are far more evenly matched in greater numbers at the highest level than what national sides are.

Fair point

1 hour ago, Sports Prophet said:

I will further add, if RL did use the club game to demonstrate the sport at its best, it would not be the first sport to be doing so.

I can only think of football as another sport that have done this, and football is a global behemoth that I'm not sure RL should be modelling themselves on, because it is so massive globally there isn't really anything to compare it to. I would imagine sports such as RU and cricket provide better comparisons, and these are certainly sports where the international competition has helped to grow their domestic games as opposed to the other way around.