Let's Do The RFL's Job For Them - Challenge Cup 2023

[daz39]

1 hour ago, Eddie said:

While I’d be all over a 90s themed event myself I don’t think it would appeal to the younger demographic, which is what I think RL should be doing before a large chunk of that generation is lost to the game. Maybe get some well known grime artists in and provide free ear defenders to anyone aged over 25? 

Or hand out returnable extra large mobile phones on entry to keep them occupied and sticking with familiarisation.

[daz39]

1 hour ago, Scubby said:

Well put and exactly what I was getting at. The bar is so low at the moment it is scary. Alex Simmons is probably an example of the kind of thinking right now.

I am literally getting bombarded with tracking ads for the Hundred, Blast, Twickenham events etc. here in London. I was on the RFL ticket site yesterday, put two tickets in a basket and it didn't even follow me around then. Go on RFL socials and sites every day. The budget is miniscule and they are now relying on 5-10k easy ticket sales from Leigh-Fev fans regardless of whether the event is enhanced or damaged.

I can't think of anything more damaging than buses full of passionate RL fans going back up the motorway while the cup final is on (having actually been sat in the stadium). When you hit rock bottom the only way is up (that's 80s not 90s)

Even more so when they have actually got a valid ticket for it too, absolutely baffling to me...

[Leyther_Matt]

2 hours ago, daz39 said:

Even more so when they have actually got a valid ticket for it too, absolutely baffling to me...

Does the same question apply to the tens of thousands who didn't bother staying for the 1895 final in 2019?

[gingerjon]

17 minutes ago, Leyther_Matt said:

Does the same question apply to the tens of thousands who didn't bother staying for the 1895 final in 2019?

Either way, really does show that the double header idea isn't exactly enhancing the day.

[Leyther_Matt]

34 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Either way, really does show that the double header idea isn't exactly enhancing the day.

Don’t disagree in the slightest, it’s just the thinly-veiled “proper fan” accusations that get my goat.

That said, I will be staying for both games and wouldn’t be at either of them if my team wasn’t involved so swings and roundabouts and all that. 

[GUBRATS]

6 hours ago, Dave T said:

I think one point to add that can't be understated here is that if we get this kind of thing right, we can drive huge benefits for the game overall. 

Crowds are in decline at the Final - whilst there are loads of reasons, you can't get away from the fact that it is quite a clear indicator that as an event it is just not good enough to make people want to go every year, maybe dragging along a few more people next time.

 

One of the softer KPI's really needs to be around enjoyment of the event. People need to come away buzzing, so that they are actively looking for the next major RL event, whether that is an international, the Grand Final, Magic, whatever - get this right and these things cross-subsidise each other, a great event at Wembley becomes part of the marketing for internationals, which market the Grand Final etc. We can't just look at these things as standalone. 

I think when we have a good international year we have some great assets. For me, getting lively large crowds of people having fun so that they then become evangelical about the events is priority number 1.

If I look at the sports I've attended as events, RL is probably some way down the list. Some of the Magic's reached a really good level, now they have become all put booze sessions I've lost interest (even though I enjoy a session as much as anyone). 

Horse racing, F1, cricket, RU, Athletics have all delivered better events/products, even though as my sport RL would be my first choice by some way. 

Horse racing is gambling based , yes I know it's a dress up occasion these days and quite often with a post ' match ' artist , but take away the punting , and it doesn't exist 

F1 has to be THE most boring spectator sport on the planet , you get to watch one corner , and might see 4 or 5 overtakes on that corner a race 

Cricket relays heavily on huge numbers of International games for its finance , it's cheap to ' produce ' from a broadcasting POV due to the length of the games ( the '100' is yet to prove profitable ) 

Union like cricket relys on lots of International matches and a class system that has huge support from many media and government organisations , it also has ' control ' due to a century of not paying it's players which meant it was able to invest in infrastructure 

Athletics relys on massive media coverage every 4 years from the Olympics resulting in the successful participants ( usually individuals ) getting huge publicity , it also at all levels is now funded by everybody who buys a lottery ticket , previous to that it was very poor 

Do I know the answer ? Nope , but this thread shows lots of different idea's , many of them contradicting each other , I have a few but am not going to share on here , because like everybody else's , they would require long term extensive investment with no guarantee of producing a return , I'm just not pretentious enough to suggest I definitely do know the answers , unlike lots of others 

[Dave T]

8 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Horse racing is gambling based , yes I know it's a dress up occasion these days and quite often with a post ' match ' artist , but take away the punting , and it doesn't exist 

F1 has to be THE most boring spectator sport on the planet , you get to watch one corner , and might see 4 or 5 overtakes on that corner a race 

Cricket relays heavily on huge numbers of International games for its finance , it's cheap to ' produce ' from a broadcasting POV due to the length of the games ( the '100' is yet to prove profitable ) 

Union like cricket relys on lots of International matches and a class system that has huge support from many media and government organisations , it also has ' control ' due to a century of not paying it's players which meant it was able to invest in infrastructure 

Athletics relys on massive media coverage every 4 years from the Olympics resulting in the successful participants ( usually individuals ) getting huge publicity , it also at all levels is now funded by everybody who buys a lottery ticket , previous to that it was very poor 

Do I know the answer ? Nope , but this thread shows lots of different idea's , many of them contradicting each other , I have a few but am not going to share on here , because like everybody else's , they would require long term extensive investment with no guarantee of producing a return , I'm just not pretentious enough to suggest I definitely do know the answers , unlike lots of others 

But you are pretentious enough to dismiss all the other sports that are outperforming RL in many areas and be rude about people's suggestions on a discussion forum. 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Dave T

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, Dave T said:

But you are pretentious enough to dismiss all the other sports that are outperforming RL in many areas and be rude about people's suggestions on a discussion forum. 

I'm not dismissing them , they are all very different to RL , horse racing , athletics and F1 aren't really in any way ' club centric ' sports , the other 2 are massively International based , to the point where some cricket players no longer play any club matches 

I'm not being ' rude ' or insulting like many others , just pointing out that like all threads of this nature , nobody wants the same thing , if you asked for 50 things to improve an event , you'd probably get 50 different answers 

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

I'm not dismissing them , they are all very different to RL , horse racing , athletics and F1 aren't really in any way ' club centric ' sports , the other 2 are massively International based , to the point where some cricket players no longer play any club matches 

I'm not being ' rude ' or insulting like many others , just pointing out that like all threads of this nature , nobody wants the same thing , if you asked for 50 things to improve an event , you'd probably get 50 different answers 

I wouldn't say your last para is true though, there is some broad agreement tbh, whether it's a 90s theme or a beer fest is just flavours of the same point. It's the principle of a carnival atmosphere and the targeting of different demographic - and not going as cheap as we can with the current setup. 

On your first para, of course they are different sports, but we are discussing staging events. I have no more than a passing interest in all of them, yet I have had an absolutely outstanding day out at all of them. 

[GUBRATS]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I wouldn't say your last para is true though, there is some broad agreement tbh, whether it's a 90s theme or a beer fest is just flavours of the same point. It's the principle of a carnival atmosphere and the targeting of different demographic - and not going as cheap as we can with the current setup. 

On your first para, of course they are different sports, but we are discussing staging events. I have no more than a passing interest in all of them, yet I have had an absolutely outstanding day out at all of them. 

And as I put in my previous post , they all require long term investment with no guarantee of a return , do it all for 10 years and you might get a return on that investment , you also might not 

[Dave T]

Just now, GUBRATS said:

And as I put in my previous post , they all require long term investment with no guarantee of a return , do it all for 10 years and you might get a return on that investment , you also might not 

That does rather go for everything though, there is a cost of doing business, we can't avoid all costs and investment, although it is clear we have been trying that approach. 

But much of the stuff discussed doesn't need a 10 year investment, some of the specifics can be tracked really effectively in real time. Although it is true that patience and longer term investment is crucial. 

[Damien]

3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

That does rather go for everything though, there is a cost of doing business, we can't avoid all costs and investment, although it is clear we have been trying that approach. 

But much of the stuff discussed doesn't need a 10 year investment, some of the specifics can be tracked really effectively in real time. Although it is true that patience and longer term investment is crucial. 

Too right. No investment just leads to stagnation at best and decline at worst. Unfortunately I think RL is now reaping what it has sown on a number of fronts, quite literally because it has sown sod all for a long, sustained period.

[GUBRATS]

Just now, Damien said:

Too right. No investment just leads to stagnation at best and decline at worst. Unfortunately I think RL is now reaping what it has sown on a number of fronts, quite literally because it has sown sod all for a long, sustained period.

Many think we have ' magic ' beans , when in fact we don't have any beans 

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Many think we have ' magic ' beans , when in fact we don't have any beans 

This just isn't true though is it. The game just had a £200m TV deal - it decided what to do with that. 

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, Dave T said:

This just isn't true though is it. The game just had a £200m TV deal - it decided what to do with that. 

The game ? , I thought that was all SL's money 

[Dave T]

1 minute ago, GUBRATS said:

The game ? , I thought that was all SL's money 

That's silly of you when you know large amounts were given to parts of the game outside of SL. 

[gingerjon]

Just now, Dave T said:

That's silly of you when you know large amounts were given to parts of the game outside of SL. 

And there goes the thread ...

[Toby Chopra]

2 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

The game ? , I thought that was all SL's money 

Around £55 mln went to Championship and League 1 clubs, the RFL and foundations. 

[GUBRATS]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

That's silly of you when you know large amounts were given to parts of the game outside of SL. 

Indeed , but it's still not enough for the investment required , everybody is really good at telling others what they should be doing with their money , we have finite resources , maybe for the ' good of the game ' some of the clubs that don't ' need ' all their central funding could offer it to the RFL to invest in the CC ? 

I'm sure all the fans of these clubs would be happy for that to happen 

[GUBRATS]

2 minutes ago, Toby Chopra said:

Around £55 mln went to Championship and League 1 clubs, the RFL and foundations. 

Ok , so don't give that to those clubs and the foundations , spend it on the CC final 

[Damien]

17 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Many think we have ' magic ' beans , when in fact we don't have any beans 

£40 million a year was a considerable amount. We invested none.

[Dave T]

3 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Indeed , but it's still not enough for the investment required , everybody is really good at telling others what they should be doing with their money , we have finite resources , maybe for the ' good of the game ' some of the clubs that don't ' need ' all their central funding could offer it to the RFL to invest in the CC ? 

I'm sure all the fans of these clubs would be happy for that to happen 

You're clearly grumpy and have no desire to chat about any of this, so we can leave it. 

[GUBRATS]

10 minutes ago, Damien said:

£40 million a year was a considerable amount. We invested none.

It was invested in paying our players , as always 

[Toby Chopra]

3 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Ok , so don't give that to those clubs and the foundations , spend it on the CC final 

Well, that money's long gone. But in principle, yes.

Lets spend 1 mln per year on the ancillary entertainment to make the CCF the go-to event for league fans around the country. If we sell another 20k tickets it'll pay for itself anyway. 

Magic is a TV event more than anything - Sky love it. 

The Grand Final is the competitive peak - crowning our best team - so it's about the game itself. And it's in the north. 

But the CCF, we can embellish with a good time around it, especially as a majority of fans will have to travel for it. 

But where we are now, as I said up thread, for me this is all about enticing rugby league fans back to the CCF not - yet - about attracting people who don't know anything about the sport. ie the so called "event crowd". 

We have fans, even in the southeast. Let's make it worthwhile them attending. 

At the same time hopefully IMG will help us spread the gospel and we can expand that pool of potential attendees. 

[Damien]

6 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

It was invested in paying our players , as always 

Well that's not an investment to grow revenue or grow events like the Challenge Cup then.