Are you sure England is better then Samoa?

[Harry Stottle]

14 hours ago, Agbrigg said:

When was the last time Bateman had a good game, so far back I can't remember. However looking at the antics of getting him available tells you ever so much. If England are so desperate to get an out of form player available then to me it indicates they are in serious trouble. However I quite honestly don't care anymore

Totally agree Aggers, Shaun Wane must have set in motion a directive to get Bateman included in the Knights as soon as he got sent off in the event he would cop a suspension, I have also said that if Bateman is such an integral part of Wane's strategies 'god help us'.

[Mojo]

1 hour ago, UTK said:

I don't think Samoa being stronger than Tonga is very accurate, Junior Paulo is the only Samoan forward who would have a sniff at making Tonga's pack if eligible, even though Staggs is out their outside backs are all stars in their own right and would definitely hold their own. 

1. Tolu Koula/Will Hopoate
2. Daniel Tupou
3. Siosifa Talakai
4. Will Penisini/
5. Sione Katoa
6. Junior Amone
7. Tui Lolohea
8. Addin Fonua-Blake
9. Siliva Havili
10. Sio Siua Taukeiaho 
11. Haumole Olakau'atu
12. Keaon Koloamatangi
13. Jason Taumalolo
14. Soni Luke
15. Tevita Pangai Jnr/Mo Fotuaika
16. Joe Ofahengaue/Junior Tatola
17. David Fifita/Felise Kaufusi

Funnily enough what Tonga has in star forwards is what samoa has in the backs lol Junior Paulo and Nanai would make that Tongan monster pack but samoas main strength is in the back where only Tupou can make the samoan backs and maybe Talakai over Tago. It's definitely good to see the island nations so powerful this world cup.

[Harry Stottle]

5 hours ago, Pulga said:

So a completely different set of people to the ones running the RLWC?

It is still part of the process Pulga, what has happened over here as tainted the game for a lot of people.

[Harry Stottle]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

Not strictly.  Rimmer is heavily involved in both. 

But,  we shouldn't cut off our nose to spite our face.  We should make our feelings known and try and drive change where we can as fans. 

How with words?

The authorities well knew that their recent decisions would anger more people than pacify some.

In my opinion they have taken a massive gamble that England will do very well in the WC and that will be the healing factor, should England fail miserably then those who are disgruntled may just protest by their actions of forsaking the sport and staying away, not just complaining.

[SydneyRoosters]

14 hours ago, Agbrigg said:

When was the last time Bateman had a good game, so far back I can't remember. However looking at the antics of getting him available tells you ever so much. If England are so desperate to get an out of form player available then to me it indicates they are in serious trouble. However I quite honestly don't care anymore

He‘a been motm in England’s last 2 games so yeah.

[Harry Stottle]

2 minutes ago, SydneyRoosters said:

He‘a been motm in England’s last 2 games so yeah.

That just shows how low are standard has dropped, or the wrong lads have been picked against a mishmash of NRL player's who can't get a gig at home, albeit the 'All stars' is the best preparation we can muster in the Northern Hemisphere (no point whatsoever in playing France), the better teams we will meet in the WC would have blown them away.

[StandOffHalf]

1 hour ago, UTK said:

I don't think Samoa being stronger than Tonga is very accurate, Junior Paulo is the only Samoan forward who would have a sniff at making Tonga's pack if eligible, even though Staggs is out their outside backs are all stars in their own right and would definitely hold their own. 

1. Tolu Koula/Will Hopoate
2. Daniel Tupou
3. Siosifa Talakai
4. Will Penisini/
5. Sione Katoa
6. Junior Amone
7. Tui Lolohea
8. Addin Fonua-Blake
9. Siliva Havili
10. Sio Siua Taukeiaho 
11. Haumole Olakau'atu
12. Keaon Koloamatangi
13. Jason Taumalolo
14. Soni Luke
15. Tevita Pangai Jnr/Mo Fotuaika
16. Joe Ofahengaue/Junior Tatola
17. David Fifita/Felise Kaufusi

Will Katoa be available for the right wing? I thought I heard he was gone for a good while.

Would Tuipolotu come in for him if he's out?

[SydneyRoosters]

2 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

That just shows how low are standard has dropped, or the wrong lads have been picked against a mishmash of NRL player's who can't get a gig at home, albeit the 'All stars' is the best preparation we can muster in the Northern Hemisphere (no point whatsoever in playing France), the better teams we will meet in the WC would have blown them away.

“No point whatsoever in playing France” you’re having a laugh mate it’s people like yourself that keep the sport from growing that’s one of the stupidest things I’ve heard.

[Dave T]

41 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

How with words?

The authorities well knew that their recent decisions would anger more people than pacify some.

In my opinion they have taken a massive gamble that England will do very well in the WC and that will be the healing factor, should England fail miserably then those who are disgruntled may just protest by their actions of forsaking the sport and staying away, not just complaining.

I'm not as angry about the Bateman thing as others.  The England team are playing the rules to get round this,  but I dont think it's the biggest deal ever. 

On Knowles,  I think it stinks,  but I'd be stunned if this doesn't lead to a reaction at the RFL disciplinary.  I expect some people are raging now,  and whether that will be individuals no longer used,  or a tightening up of processes,  I expect some reaction. 

But we don't need to over-react. 

[Mojo]

12 minutes ago, SydneyRoosters said:

“No point whatsoever in playing France” you’re having a laugh mate it’s people like yourself that keep the sport from growing that’s one of the stupidest things I’ve heard.

I agree. The English should've played France instead of the all star game. They got nothing out of that game. They would've got a lot playing a legit international team and they we're in the same pool

[Dave T]

Just now, Mojo said:

I agree. The English should've played France instead of the all star game. They got nothing out of that game. They would've got a lot playing a legit international team and they we're in the same pool

They will have got far more out of the All Stars game on the pitch than a game vs France. A tough game for starters. 

That's not to say we shouldn't be playing France,  but it's wrong to say playing against Pacific players in that game isn't good prep for a tournament where we will face many Pacific players. 

[Mojo]

Just now, Dave T said:

They will have got far more out of the All Stars game on the pitch than a game vs France. A tough game for starters. 

That's not to say we shouldn't be playing France,  but it's wrong to say playing against Pacific players in that game isn't good prep for a tournament where we will face many Pacific players. 

They were playing a team of players who mostly won't even be in the world cup teams and most definitely had no structure at all. When you could've played France who would be gunning hard to get there combinations right and are in the same pool as england. The french aren't as good but the English would've known what type of team they are playing a international team.

[Harry Stottle]

7 minutes ago, Mojo said:

I agree. The English should've played France instead of the all star game. They got nothing out of that game. They would've got a lot playing a legit international team and they we're in the same pool

Playing France would have been preperation for them, it would have been a useless excersize for England.

[Harry Stottle]

33 minutes ago, Mojo said:

They were playing a team of players who mostly won't even be in the world cup teams and most definitely had no structure at all. When you could've played France who would be gunning hard to get there combinations right and are in the same pool as england. The french aren't as good but the English would've known what type of team they are playing a international team.

Half of the expected French team would have pulled out as they have done previously in mid season international games their selection pool is so small of adequate player's, they can only group the best they can offer in out of season tournaments.

Edited September 23, 2022 by Harry Stottle

[Barley Mow]

18 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Playing France would have been preperation for them, it would have been a useless excersize for England.

I think playing the all stars was best for England's world cup preparation. They are the strongest opposition available during the season, when southern hemisphere nations aren't an available option.

That doesn't mean that England shouldn't be playing France as well. England v France should be happening every single year.

[Harry Stottle]

4 minutes ago, Barley Mow said:

I think playing the all stars was best for England's world cup preparation. They are the strongest opposition available during the season, when southern hemisphere nations aren't an available option.

That doesn't mean that England shouldn't be playing France as well. England v France should be happening every single year.

Yes it should Barley, but it could only happen out of season, Catalan and Toulouse aren't going to risk all their better home grown player's in basically mid season friendlies for that is what those fixtures will be even if a 'gong' is put up to try to make some reasoning for it.

[Mojo]

Just now, Harry Stottle said:

Yes it should Barley, but it could only happen out of season, Catalan and Toulouse aren't going to risk all their better home grown player's in basically mid season friendlies for that is what those fixtures will be even if a 'gong' is put up to try to make some reasoning for it.

If that's true about clubs holding players back than France is so far back in development I don't even think they can beat cook islands if they played them.

[Harry Stottle]

@SydneyRoosters are you completely bereft of making a comment other than the Laughing Emoji, France are very weak in international standard player's that they have to choose from, the two clubs which have nearly all the best French lads available have better things to concentrate on than giving up their best French lads for meaningless games in mid season, if you can't see that or look at the evidence from the recent internationals then you are either trying to dismiss it from your thought process or simply have no idea what is going on.

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

7 hours ago, Pulga said:

So a completely different set of people to the ones running the RLWC?

If you think that the leadership of RL in this country had nothing to do with the decision to let Knowles off then you are being naive 

If you think the WC organisers and the RFL are completely uncommunicative entities you are being naive 

Dark corridors and whispered instructions abound

 

[Harry Stottle]

4 minutes ago, Mojo said:

If that's true about clubs holding players back than France is so far back in development I don't even think they can beat cook islands if they played them.

But this tournament is out of season Mojo, their best will come together for that.

[UTK]

1 hour ago, StandOffHalf said:

Will Katoa be available for the right wing? I thought I heard he was gone for a good while.

Would Tuipolotu come in for him if he's out?

Woolf said when he named the initial 38-man squad that he should be fully fit for the tournament, Tuipulotu would be next drop winger I'd say though.

[Dave T]

46 minutes ago, Mojo said:

They were playing a team of players who mostly won't even be in the world cup teams and most definitely had no structure at all. When you could've played France who would be gunning hard to get there combinations right and are in the same pool as england. The french aren't as good but the English would've known what type of team they are playing a international team.

Whilst it is true that it won't be those players necessarily - they were a stronger team than France, and had an awful lot of size. Part of prep is trying to replicate those situations you may find yourself in, and playing huge Pacific players is useufl in that context.

It should be remembered that our last game prior to that was versus France, and I do think games in France are really useful for camps and playing in more hostile environments. 

I do also think it is important for France to play team worse than them. They had a mid-season test versus Wales - it is important that they sometimes get to test themselves against lower teams and actually get some wins. It could be pretty miserable just constantly taking a hiding from England.

[StandOffHalf]

10 minutes ago, UTK said:

Woolf said when he named the initial 38-man squad that he should be fully fit for the tournament, Tuipulotu would be next drop winger I'd say though.

Great news, if that's the case. He's a real try-scorer and a weapon out wide. 

Him and Tupou would be awesome wings.

[Harry Stottle]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

I'm not as angry about the Bateman thing as others.  The England team are playing the rules to get round this,  but I dont think it's the biggest deal ever. 

On Knowles,  I think it stinks,  but I'd be stunned if this doesn't lead to a reaction at the RFL disciplinary.  I expect some people are raging now,  and whether that will be individuals no longer used,  or a tightening up of processes,  I expect some reaction. 

But we don't need to over-react. 

The Bateman and Knowles reactions have homogeneously become as one Dave, the timescale of both events joins them up, the process is wrong on both counts and there is a place where the buck should have stopped and that is at *RLHQ. There will be no separation in a lot of peoples minds that Wane was the architect of the manipulation of Bateman's suspension, or that the judiciary is responsible for Knowles getting off, both together have left a bitter taste in the mouth of a lot of  people.

I will stick to what I suggest, a good World Cup and these incidents will get forgotten, a humiliation and these two incidents will get repeated time and again and stoke up the anger that many are feeling. If you feel that is over reaction then so be it.

*A question for you Dave, you seem to Champion Mr Richard Lewis as the best Exec Chairman we have had, do you think these two incidents would have happened under his watch?

[Dave T]

1 minute ago, Harry Stottle said:

The Bateman and Knowles reactions have homogeneously become as one Dave, the timescale of both events joins them up, the process is wrong on both counts and there is a place where the buck should have stopped and that is at *RLHQ. There will be no separation in a lot of peoples minds that Wane was the architect of the manipulation of Bateman's suspension, or that the judiciary is responsible for Knowles getting off, both together have left a bitter taste in the mouth of a lot of  people.

I will stick to what I suggest, a good World Cup and these incidents will get forgotten, a humiliation and these two incidents will get repeated time and again and stoke up the anger that many are feeling. If you feel that is over reaction then so be it.

*A question for you Dave, you seem to Champion Mr Richard Lewis as the best Exec Chairman we have had, do you think these two incidents would have happened under his watch?

It's a good question, and I'd like to say no, as he did instil a level of professionalism which was welcome. But, he was also a wheeler dealer to an extent and on his watch plenty of controversial things happened too.