Teare

[Derwent]

All this talk about going down, rebuilding and coming back up is fine but what would be any different if we did ? The last twice we have been in the Championship the same thing has happened and we have had to impose pay cuts and release good players for nothing to other clubs (e.g. Callum Philliips last time, Teare this time), the club simply can't sustain itself to be competitive at this level. Unless there is a substantial financial investment in the club then I think we need to accept that we are a League 1 club and that is the only level that we can operate at financially.

[townie88]

3 minutes ago, Derwent said:

All this talk about going down, rebuilding and coming back up is fine but what would be any different if we did ? The last twice we have been in the Championship the same thing has happened and we have had to impose pay cuts and release good players for nothing to other clubs (e.g. Callum Philliips last time, Teare this time), the club simply can't sustain itself to be competitive at this level. Unless there is a substantial financial investment in the club then I think we need to accept that we are a League 1 club and that is the only level that we can operate at financially.

Agree. Which is is why the large majority on here would back the merger (if it would ever be an option)

[Town67]

7 minutes ago, Town5 said:

We were never staying up with the squad we had but there was a good base to start again with the young local lads some have now moved on and will probably be followed by others. If they came out and said we are going to struggle but with the team we have we are looking to the future. I think most people would of understood rather than promise signings then sign player's that didn't improve us. Some of the lads we lost probably were as good and cheaper 

I agree, I’ve said before the man management under Chris has been woeful he may be good coach but it means nothing if you can’t man manage. If we didn’t push anyone away we’d have a very good local base to work off

[Onreport]

12 minutes ago, Town5 said:

We were never staying up with the squad we had but there was a good base to start again with the young local lads some have now moved on and will probably be followed by others. If they came out and said we are going to struggle but with the team we have we are looking to the future. I think most people would of understood rather than promise signings then sign player's that didn't improve us. Some of the lads we lost probably were as good and cheaper 

100% agree

[DavidM]

14 hours ago, Town5 said:

In a matter of a few month we have gone from the money is there and we are looking at overseas players. To there is no money left take a pay cut or leave

Indeed 

[Town5]

2 hours ago, townie88 said:

Agree. Which is is why the large majority on here would back the merger (if it would ever be an option)

It would be hard to take at first but the more years go by and same mistakes happen it's looking like the only way west Cumbria will have a chance at a competitive side

[Nero]

16 hours ago, Town5 said:

In a matter of a few month we have gone from the money is there and we are looking at overseas players. To there is no money left take a pay cut or leave

It's not that simple, money raised to buy players does not belong to the club until a player is bought, I am led to believe money is still available to buy players, but the problem is the club has no income due to lack of home matches during the summer months & lack of support due to our poor run of form so can't afford to pay the players or even the bills at the minute. I've been told least one of the travelling players not only accepted a pay cut, but donated money to the club to help it through this sticky patch. It's not a great situation, but credit to the directors trying to steer us through it to make sure we have a club to support.

[Nero]

3 hours ago, townie88 said:

Agree. Which is is why the large majority on here would back the merger (if it would ever be an option)

Would a merger of two struggling sides not be a case of putting all your eggs in one basket? What if the merged side struggled? I'm sure the demise of Cumbrian pro RL would be welcomed in some quarters of the RL community!

[homeandawayer]

7 minutes ago, Nero said:

It's not that simple, money raised to buy players does not belong to the club until a player is bought, I am led to believe money is still available to buy players, but the problem is the club has no income due to lack of home matches during the summer months & lack of support due to our poor run of form so can't afford to pay the players or even the bills at the minute. I've been told least one of the travelling players not only accepted a pay cut, but donated money to the club to help it through this sticky patch. It's not a great situation, but credit to the directors trying to steer us through it to make sure we have a club to support.

Sorry i'm not understanding that Ron. Is buying players not another way of saying paying their contract money? In the old days you had to pay the other club a transfer fee, is it not the case that the clubs now just hold a player's registration and no money changes hands unless they buy out the contract ? I know amateurs get  a signing on fee so do clubs have to pay the pro player a signing on fee? i don't know how these things work. 

[homeandawayer]

5 minutes ago, Nero said:

Would a merger of two struggling sides not be a case of putting all your eggs in one basket? What if the merged side struggled? I'm sure the demise of Cumbrian pro RL would be welcomed in some quarters of the RL community!

As someone else said mergers have never been mergers they've been effectively takeovers. You'd need to start a new club away from the two towns for it to have a chance i reckon. Can someone do a poll about how many of us are in favour of it? i'd be interested to see if a majority do support one.

[donald]

2 minutes ago, homeandawayer said:

Sorry i'm not understanding that Ron. Is buying players not another way of saying paying their contract money? In the old days you had to pay the other club a transfer fee, is it not the case that the clubs now just hold a player's registration and no money changes hands unless they buy out the contract ? I know amateurs get  a signing on fee so do clubs have to pay the pro player a signing on fee? i don't know how these things work. 

Usually if an amateur signs a 2 year contract at say 10k it gets spread out monthly over the 2 years plus winning and losing pay on top of that

[Billy Bob]

24 minutes ago, donald said:

Usually if an amateur signs a 2 year contract at say 10k it gets spread out monthly over the 2 years plus winning and losing pay on top of that

Donald correct, also if another club wants to sign a player whilst he is in contract, that club would have to buy his contract, hence a transfer fee.

[Nero]

51 minutes ago, homeandawayer said:

Sorry i'm not understanding that Ron. Is buying players not another way of saying paying their contract money? In the old days you had to pay the other club a transfer fee, is it not the case that the clubs now just hold a player's registration and no money changes hands unless they buy out the contract ? I know amateurs get  a signing on fee so do clubs have to pay the pro player a signing on fee? i don't know how these things work. 

There are a group of supporters who have made donations to bring players to the club. That money can not be used for the day to day running of the club, it will only be handed to the club in the event of a suitable player becoming available. When signing players other things need to be taken into account, how much they want to be paid, accommodation etc. it’s only one piece of the jigsaw. Successful businessmen & women do not become successful by throwing money into a black hole. A similar scheme is operated successfully by our neighbours. 

[Death to the Rah Rah's]

3 hours ago, Derwent said:

All this talk about going down, rebuilding and coming back up is fine but what would be any different if we did ? The last twice we have been in the Championship the same thing has happened and we have had to impose pay cuts and release good players for nothing to other clubs (e.g. Callum Philliips last time, Teare this time), the club simply can't sustain itself to be competitive at this level. Unless there is a substantial financial investment in the club then I think we need to accept that we are a League 1 club and that is the only level that we can operate at financially.

Totally agree and that's what I've been saying on the other thread, we are on a hamster wheel and we have to find a way of breaking the status quo before its too late

[Nero]

4 hours ago, Derwent said:

All this talk about going down, rebuilding and coming back up is fine but what would be any different if we did ? The last twice we have been in the Championship the same thing has happened and we have had to impose pay cuts and release good players for nothing to other clubs (e.g. Callum Philliips last time, Teare this time), the club simply can't sustain itself to be competitive at this level. Unless there is a substantial financial investment in the club then I think we need to accept that we are a League 1 club and that is the only level that we can operate at financially.

If we don’t have ambition, we’ll have nothing! Who’d have thought in 1988 we’d be back in the big league just 6 seasons later! We’ve effectively struggled since 1997, but everyone who joins the BoD has the ambition to get us back up there. If we all get behind them (like the players & staff have) we may just live the dream again!

[homeandawayer]

34 minutes ago, Nero said:

If we don’t have ambition, we’ll have nothing! Who’d have thought in 1988 we’d be back in the big league just 6 seasons later! We’ve effectively struggled since 1997, but everyone who joins the BoD has the ambition to get us back up there. If we all get behind them (like the players & staff have) we may just live the dream again!

..but that was from the sale of the training ground, we'd need a similar cash injection.

[homeandawayer]

52 minutes ago, Nero said:

There are a group of supporters who have made donations to bring players to the club. That money can not be used for the day to day running of the club, it will only be handed to the club in the event of a suitable player becoming available. When signing players other things need to be taken into account, how much they want to be paid, accommodation etc. it’s only one piece of the jigsaw. Successful businessmen & women do not become successful by throwing money into a black hole. A similar scheme is operated successfully by our neighbours. 

Yeah i was aware of the group but someone just explained how it works as you were typing probably.

[Derwent Parker]

5 hours ago, townie88 said:

Agree. Which is is why the large majority on here would back the merger (if it would ever be an option)

Rubbish a merger would not help in any way.

If 2 teams who both had good investors, both had money in bank, both owned their grounds and both had a bunch of quality players merged.

Then you could pool all those resources and sell one of the grounds and would be better off [ ie the 2 hull teams]

But this is not the case here in any form. Neither Town or Haven have those qualities at present.

[homeandawayer]

54 minutes ago, Nero said:

There are a group of supporters who have made donations to bring players to the club. That money can not be used for the day to day running of the club, it will only be handed to the club in the event of a suitable player becoming available. When signing players other things need to be taken into account, how much they want to be paid, accommodation etc. it’s only one piece of the jigsaw. Successful businessmen & women do not become successful by throwing money into a black hole. A similar scheme is operated successfully by our neighbours. 

So they are two separate entities and when they say there's money for signings there is, but you can hardly sign a new player when all the others are taking a pay cut because the club itself is broke.

[donald]

47 minutes ago, Derwent Parker said:

Rubbish a merger would not help in any way.

If 2 teams who both had good investors, both had money in bank, both owned their grounds and both had a bunch of quality players merged.

Then you could pool all those resources and sell one of the grounds and would be better off [ ie the 2 hull teams]

But this is not the case here in any form. Neither Town or Haven have those qualities at 

If a merger did happen combining both squads at the moment in my opinion would guarantee a top 6 finish . Haven aren't world beaters in any shape or form but add Fitzsimmons doran Barnes obrien and say scholey it would give us a very strong squad.

[Death to the Rah Rah's]

10 minutes ago, donald said:

If a merger did happen combining both squads at the moment in my opinion would guarantee a top 6 finish . Haven aren't world beaters in any shape or form but add Fitzsimmons doran Barnes obrien and say scholey it would give us a very strong squad.

Don't waste your breath getting into a discussion with Derwent Parker Donald, his last statement pretty much covers every point as to why a merger IS the only way to sustain championship rugby in west cumbria. 

As has been said many times before by Town and Haven supporters, its Town today, Haven tomorrow and round and round we go, both sets of supporters have to lose the attitude and do what's best for the long term future of the sport in this area. 

There's potentially a big enough player pool to at least be a mid to top table championship side, anything higher would be a bonus in my eyes.

If a merger isn't feasible then the club has to explore the supporters trust option as it needs to stabilise and grow and that can't be done by selling ground admission, a pie ad a pint on 20 days of the year

[Town5]

3 hours ago, Nero said:

It's not that simple, money raised to buy players does not belong to the club until a player is bought, I am led to believe money is still available to buy players, but the problem is the club has no income due to lack of home matches during the summer months & lack of support due to our poor run of form so can't afford to pay the players or even the bills at the minute. I've been told least one of the travelling players not only accepted a pay cut, but donated money to the club to help it through this sticky patch. It's not a great situation, but credit to the directors trying to steer us through it to make sure we have a club to support.

I understand all that but we must of known we couldn't afford to pay for these players long term once the money was made available to bring them in 

[Derwent Parker]

3 hours ago, Death to the Rah Rah's said:

Don't waste your breath getting into a discussion with Derwent Parker Donald, his last statement pretty much covers every point as to why a merger IS the only way to sustain championship rugby in west cumbria. 

As has been said many times before by Town and Haven supporters, its Town today, Haven tomorrow and round and round we go, both sets of supporters have to lose the attitude and do what's best for the long term future of the sport in this area. 

There's potentially a big enough player pool to at least be a mid to top table championship side, anything higher would be a bonus in my eyes.

If a merger isn't feasible then the club has to explore the supporters trust option as it needs to stabilise and grow and that can't be done by selling ground admission, a pie ad a pint on 20 days of the year

and where do you play at ?????

[Route66]

3 hours ago, Town5 said:

I understand all that but we must of known we couldn't afford to pay for these players long term once the money was made available to bring them in 

I think the club looked at the attendance at the play off games and assumed that those crowds would flock back, they were dealt a bad hand with the fixture list ,but a bad start coupled with the pricing has led us to where we are now

[Alineden]

On 28/07/2022 at 20:34, Town5 said:

In a matter of a few month we have gone from the money is there and we are looking at overseas players. To there is no money left take a pay cut or leave

That's what I'm struggling with.