What is the latest on South African Rugby League?

[The Daddy]

It's been fairly quiet news wise in South Africa, what is the latest news and plans? Last I heard was that the RL governing body had to be sanctioned and authorised under the SARU.

On another note, what's the local leagues like and where are the clubs based?

[Wigan Riversider]

Last heard of them in 1995 centenary WC and in SL 9s in 1997 I think.

Not being flippant just honest.

[gingerjon]

42 minutes ago, Wigan Riversider said:

Last heard of them in 1995 centenary WC and in SL 9s in 1997 I think.

Not being flippant just honest.

A South Africa team played against the Cook Islands in 2019 and lost heavily.

[Guest]

South Africa is union and football territory. Waste of time spending money there. Better off focusing on West Africa.

[Damien]

South Africa Rugby League has always been smoke and mirrors and it is always difficult to find out anything of substance.

Other African countries such as Ghana and Nigeria show much greater promise in my opinion. Both are also in West Africa, which offers huge potential for internationals, and both have growing domestic setups and plenty of activity on social media, in particular Ghana. They also don't have a dominant RU presence that always seeks to limit the development of Rugby League like has happened repeatedly in South Africa. 

[Eddie]

They played Brazil a few weeks ago, and hammered them iirc. That said it was one of those games where the vast majority of players were Aussies, and it was played in Australia too. 

[welshmagpie]

A quick look at their website shows a fair bit of domestic activity from November to around March

http://www.sarugbyleague.co.za/kobus-botha-rhino-cup.html?fbclid=IwAR3XZ78kGPqKVGvKkm-b4ode2mHUPMfLHFIbqONGiQPR5s3pIBnAy-37qys&fs=e&s=cl

http://www.sarugbyleague.co.za/sarl-protea-cup.html?fs=e&s=cl

This one seems to be a regional/representative series

http://www.sarugbyleague.co.za/jan-prinsloo-regional-cup.html?fs=e&s=cl

[Whippet13]

SA are in the mix for RLWC25 qualification, the text in quotes below is from the IRL site so they are still active. More interesting is that RL is established and being played regularly in several West African countries now. Any investment goes a long way so hopefully some of the RLWC21 profits will head that way:

"Qualifying will begin this year, with the two highest placed finishers from Cameroon, Ghana, Morocco and Nigeria in the MEA Championship in Accra progressing to meet Lebanon and South Africa in the MEA Cup 2023. Should Lebanon be a RLWC2021 quarter-finalist the highest placed finisher from the other three MEA Cup 2023 participants will enter a inter-regional repechage in 2024 for the final berth at France 2025. Should Lebanon not reach this year’s quarter-finals, the 2023 MEA Cup winner will qualify directly for France 2025"

[Futtocks]

They have had some familiar problems with state recognition as a sport in their own right, which many new RL nations have had to go through. Oddly, the country's RU administration weren't behind it in this case. 

I recall reading somewhere that they have deliberately limited their international activity out side RWC qualification, as they are concentrating their limited resources on developing the domestic game.

[Oxford]

8 minutes ago, Futtocks said:

They have had some familiar problems with state recognition as a sport in their own right

You do have to ask how long rubbish like this can continue; States refusing to admit RL is a sport in its own right in the 21st Century?

I admit they have the right to decide what sports they recognise but really?

I would love to hear about a country, just once. that has a problem recognising  kick & clap as a sport in it's own right because RL exists as a sport.

 

 

[Damien]

8 minutes ago, Futtocks said:

They have had some familiar problems with state recognition as a sport in their own right, which many new RL nations have had to go through. Oddly, the country's RU administration weren't behind it in this case. 

I recall reading somewhere that they have deliberately limited their international activity out side RWC qualification, as they are concentrating their limited resources on developing the domestic game.

Union has certainly been behind some of the issues in South Africa. The president of SASCOC, the SA Sports Confederation and Olympic Committee who won't recognise Rugby League, has a RU background and RU are also concerned that RL will swallow up some of the funding RU currently receives. What may be said openly and what actually happens behind the scenes are two completely different things.

[Eddie]

1 minute ago, Oxford said:

You do have to ask how long rubbish like this can continue; States refusing to admit RL is a sport in its own right in the 21st Century?

I admit they have the right to decide what sports they recognise but really?

I would love to hear about a country, just once. that has a problem recognising  kick & clap as a sport in it's own right because RL exists as a sport.

 

 

I sometimes think (when I’m driving, running or cycling and have too much time for thinking) that RL could actually take over RU in a country such as Holland or Norway, where if all their domestic players swapped to League they’d have a much better chance of making a WC than in Union, where they have zero chance. I know it’s a pipedream but if the RL world was united and focused on the international game they could try to do that. 

[EastLondonMike]

Always felt there was so much potential in SA, and despite what some would have you believe RL has had a decent presence in the country for many many years (there at least a couple of books on the subject available to buy through scratching shed i believe - also a couple of episodes on the Rugby Reloaded podcast worth checking out on SA and its history) but it seems lack of funding and consistent and continued support from the wider game has led to very little in the way of genuine progress. Made ever more difficult by the presence of Union and its position in SA society.

I still think it's a country that can bear fruit for RL, but like so many things in the world of RL, it needs a real focus and a proper strategy put in place.

From the point of view of gaining exposure for the game, picking up International TV viewers and possibly selling some merchandise, (some of which could have a knock-on effect of potential positives for the game locally) a couple of games every couple of seasons involving SL/NRL sides would work wonders IMO.

I can recall back at the start of the SL/ARL war (around 97 maybe) a good 7-8 SA union players of a decent standard (in RU terms) being signed up by various clubs in Australia. Sadly though none made much of an impact and returned to RU within a couple of seasons.

[eal]

Most South Africans I know have an active dislike of Rugby League if they have ever come across it. Rugby Union is such a core part of their culture I doubt Rugby League will ever make much headway. I would be surprised if RU really has much to do with holding RL back in the country, RL is as much of a threat to RU as underwater basket weaving.

[Oxford]

There is an assumption that we'll always see yoonion as the culprits behind RL's lack of progress. To some extent although they may be less active or completely inactive compared with actions of the past, the fact is all the damage was done decades and decades ago.

This is certainly not the ongoing conflict the way it was previously and certainly shouldn't be part of life or sport in this day and age.

Above someone said he knew South Africans with an active dislike for RL but that it was no threat. Such statements are  made without explanation or even questions all too often in RL circles. If RL is no threat to k&c why would anyone in SA dislike it? Or how or why could those things both be true?  And here I'm not saying these things are not the case just that it's as well to remember how that state of affairs might have come about and how RL's lack of development might no longer need the helping hand of anyone involved in ru. It's also true that even if such statements are wholly accurate there is no responsibility on anyone in RL to accept them as gospel and simply give up trying.

 

 

[Heritage XIII]

One just has to look at the number of South Africans who have played in the English RL over many decades & successfully, to realise the potential for the game there.

[rlno1]

11 hours ago, Oxford said:

You do have to ask how long rubbish like this can continue; States refusing to admit RL is a sport in its own right in the 21st Century?

I admit they have the right to decide what sports they recognise but really?

I would love to hear about a country, just once. that has a problem recognising  kick & clap as a sport in it's own right because RL exists as a sport.

 

 

So true, whilst you can't descriminate against something or anyone these days, and rightfully so, it seems it is ok to do it against rugby league. 

[rlno1]

8 hours ago, eal said:

Most South Africans I know have an active dislike of Rugby League if they have ever come across it. Rugby Union is such a core part of their culture I doubt Rugby League will ever make much headway. I would be surprised if RU really has much to do with holding RL back in the country, RL is as much of a threat to RU as underwater basket weaving.

If League is under the union banner and the government grant money to them, does this not hinder the growth of the game?

[Oxford]

6 hours ago, rlno1 said:

So true, whilst you can't descriminate against something or anyone these days, and rightfully so, it seems it is ok to do it against rugby league. 

On the face of it, it may be the last form of discrimination left on the planet when all the important ones have become extinct.

And what do hear from journalists and pundits on this? The silence of assent, the claim that this is yesterday's problems and you have a chip on your shoulder for saying anything! And yet RL is not granted recognition as a sport in its own right or has to fight to be recognised in far too manycountries still. Even on the Total forum discussions on this topic can disappear on to the cross code nonsense as if this wasn't an issue that needs raising, discussing or championing for RL as important.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Oxford

[Pulga]

17 hours ago, NW10LDN said:

South Africa is union and football territory. Waste of time spending money there. Better off focusing on West Africa.

This is more or less my same opinion. Just replace "South Africa" with "England".

[Oxford]

And just replace the world with Cleckheaton! Perfection!

[unapologetic pedant]

2 hours ago, Pulga said:

This is more or less my same opinion. Just replace "South Africa" with "England".

NRL sends all its stood-down and banned players to Ghana. Peter V`landys becomes head of state. Ghanaians take over Sydney pubs. Aussie backpackers in Ghana eaten by crocs. Ghana and Cameroon refuse to travel to RLWC in Oz citing health and safety concerns.

"Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it"

[Pie tries]

17 hours ago, Oxford said:

You do have to ask how long rubbish like this can continue; States refusing to admit RL is a sport in its own right in the 21st Century?

I admit they have the right to decide what sports they recognise but really?

I would love to hear about a country, just once. that has a problem recognising  kick & clap as a sport in it's own right because RL exists as a sport.

 

 

RU always has a problem when it’s compared to RL…..

[Oxford]

30 minutes ago, Pie tries said:

RU always has a problem when it’s compared to RL…..

That's it you've doomed us to the cross sport zone.

 I imagine it as like when Tarzan found the elephants' graveyard in old black & white movies; with the tusks and bones of what were perfectly decent RL issues sticking up here and there and being picked over ru crows. Don't say it's not like that I hate to have my dreams ruined by reality.

[Guest]

18 hours ago, Eddie said:

I sometimes think (when I’m driving, running or cycling and have too much time for thinking) that RL could actually take over RU in a country such as Holland or Norway, where if all their domestic players swapped to League they’d have a much better chance of making a WC than in Union, where they have zero chance. I know it’s a pipedream but if the RL world was united and focused on the international game they could try to do that. 

Pacific nations are the most likely. Union only got there first because it was introducted by the British administrators. I was looking at some union forum and they were worried about RL now enjoying the popularity as RU in Tonga. It's growing in Samoa and Fiji.