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4 minutes ago, AB90 said:

And any thoughts on the below pack that got dominated by PNG (plus Tonga & NZ on that tour)?

8.Chris Hill

9.Josh Hodgson

10.Tom Burgess

11.John Bateman 

12.Eliot Whitehead

13.James Graham

Subs: Luke Thompson, Alex Walsmley, Josh Jones, Daryl Clark

The backs won it for PNG and you know that. Plus Jake Graham got knocked out first tackle so he didn’t play.

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1 minute ago, SydneyRoosters said:

Yes, do have a problem with that.

You need to put your English cap down and realise england isn't has good as you think they are. They aren't beating Samoa comfortably with ease like you said they are. And if they struggled against png they're definitely not gonna dominate samoa with ease. It will be a battle that's for sure but you're predicting this with your English jersey on and not as a rugby league fan.

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Just now, SydneyRoosters said:

@Mojowhats you’re issue with my statement. PNG have upset the likes of New Zealand GB In the past. Name one team Samoa has upset.

When did PNG beat the Kiwis? 1800s?? Tonga never lost to nz or aus and look what happened? GB tour proved that the English team is going more backwards than forward. Imagine if Samoa lost to PNG you would've talked them down as rubbish team. Yet GB lost every game on tour and you said "well we had a aussie on the wing" 🤦‍♂️😂😂😂

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11 minutes ago, AB90 said:

And any thoughts on the below pack that got dominated by PNG (plus Tonga & NZ on that tour)?

8.Chris Hill

9.Josh Hodgson

10.Tom Burgess

11.John Bateman 

12.Eliot Whitehead

13.James Graham

Subs: Luke Thompson, Alex Walsmley, Josh Jones, Daryl Clark

As a slight correction it was Philbin and Williams on the bench instead of Jones and Clark. 

What I feel is often lost behind the infamous Austin on the wing saga was the rest of that backline:

  1. Jonny Lomax
  2. Jermaine McGillvary
  3. Jack Hughes 
  4. Jake Connor
  5. Blake Austin
  6. Gareth Widdop
  7. Jackson Hastings

That is absolutely dire and Jerry was the only one worth anything on the tour (as was often the case but nonetheless), if anyone suggest Jackson Hastings for the England squad simply link them the full replay of this game that is available on NRL.com.

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4 hours ago, Mojo said:

You need to put your English cap down and realise england isn't has good as you think they are. They aren't beating Samoa comfortably with ease like you said they are. And if they struggled against png they're definitely not gonna dominate samoa with ease. It will be a battle that's for sure but you're predicting this with your English jersey on and not as a rugby league fan.

First of all I’m Aussie and an Aussie fan. I just watch the super league and know what the English players can do. Don’t just take my word for it Wayne Bennett (the best brain in rugby league)  has spoken several times about how good the English players are.

For me England have a large amount of world class players Welsby, Makinson, Farnworth, Lomax, Hastings, Knowles, Radley Etc. As a squad they really don’t have any weaknesses and are fast, strong and fit side who can shine for 80 minutes.

I don’t think that they will beat Samoa comfortably, it was a bit of hyperbole, I suspect it will be close game as a I said before.

 

Edited by SydneyRoosters
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17 minutes ago, Mojo said:

You need to put your English cap down and realise england isn't has good as you think they are. They aren't beating Samoa comfortably with ease like you said they are. And if they struggled against png they're definitely not gonna dominate samoa with ease. It will be a battle that's for sure but you're predicting this with your English jersey on and not as a rugby league fan.

GB lost in Port Moresby because of the oppressive humidity and from being shatteringly low on confidence.

Being at home in English conditions and in front of a full-ish English home crowd is a completely different scenario.

That PNG win where they ran over the top of GB in the second half is legit one of my favourite memories in test football, heehee. I was hollering them on!

Edited by StandOffHalf
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11 minutes ago, Mojo said:

When did PNG beat the Kiwis? 1800s?? Tonga never lost to nz or aus and look what happened? GB tour proved that the English team is going more backwards than forward. Imagine if Samoa lost to PNG you would've talked them down as rubbish team. Yet GB lost every game on tour and you said "well we had a aussie on the wing" 🤦‍♂️😂😂😂

PNG Beat New Zealand on the 17th of august 1986 24-22

Tonga have lost to New Zealand 5 times and lost to Australia in 2018 34-16.

I agree Great Britain were terrible on that tour and there’s no excuses for that. But you can’t act like the didn’t just beat the kiwis 3/4 times the year before and the year before that weren’t 7 points off being world champions.

The fact is England have been one of the best teams in the world for the last 114 years. One tour isn’t going to change that nor will a few players playing for the heritage.

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I also think PNG can win against Tonga. For me, that is shaping up to be one of the must-see games of the tournament.

I think England will beat Samoa, but I do think it will be a high-scoring and see-sawing affair. I fancy them to win by a couple of scores. Something like 34-22.

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1 minute ago, SydneyRoosters said:

PNG Beat New Zealand on the 17th of august 1986 24-22

Tonga have lost to New Zealand 5 times and lost to Australia in 2018 34-16.

I agree Great Britain were terrible that tour on that tour and there’s no excuses for that. But you can’t act like the didn’t just beat the kiwis 3/4 times the year and the before that weren’t 7 points off being world champions.

The fact is England have been one of the best teams in the world for the last 114 years. One tour isn’t going to change that nor will a few players playing for the heritage.

 But you've also got to realise international rugby league in the past is way different to now. The pacific talent 10 years ago is way different now. Tonga and Samoa at the 2013 world cup were made up of players missing out on the Kiwis and kangaroos squad and some were just picked from reserve grade. But now most of those star players are playing for the island nation and the quality of players in the island nations is on another level. So you can't bring up the past results when in the past the international game was dominated by 3 nations and the island nations only played literally every 4 years at the world cup.

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1 minute ago, Mojo said:

 But you've also got to realise international rugby league in the past is way different to now. The pacific talent 10 years ago is way different now. Tonga and Samoa at the 2013 world cup were made up of players missing out on the Kiwis and kangaroos squad and some were just picked from reserve grade. But now most of those star players are playing for the island nation and the quality of players in the island nations is on another level. So you can't bring up the past results when in the past the international game was dominated by 3 nations and the island nations only played literally every 4 years at the world cup.

It’s always “International rugby league is different now so it doesn’t matter”. players come and go, teams get stronger and teams get weaker, And Injuries happen. But rugby league is still rugby league at the end of the day and Samoa is still the Samoa it was 10 years ago. There are differences but to say it completely is relevant is very far from the truth.

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1 minute ago, SydneyRoosters said:

It’s always “International rugby league is different now so it doesn’t matter”. players come and go, teams get stronger and teams get weaker, And Injuries happen. But rugby league is still rugby league at the end of the day and Samoa is still the Samoa it was 10 years ago. There are differences but to say it completely is relevant is very far from the truth.

Samoa is still the same 10 years ago? Your definitely a dinosaur who doesn't want the game to grow and hating the fact that the island nations are getting bigger and better with "heritage" players. I'm done arguing with a ignorant old head 🤦‍♂️😂😂😂

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6 minutes ago, Mojo said:

Samoa is still the same 10 years ago? Your definitely a dinosaur who doesn't want the game to grow and hating the fact that the island nations are getting bigger and better with "heritage" players. I'm done arguing with a ignorant old head 🤦‍♂️😂😂😂

I think your misunderstanding what I’m saying. Yes Samoa is the same team it was 10 years ago. Maybe not the same squad or the same it coach or even the same fans but they are still Samoa. Just like England are the same England that have won 3 world cups and England are the same England that lost to Italy in 2013.

 

the point is history matters.

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24 minutes ago, UTK said:

As a slight correction it was Philbin and Williams on the bench instead of Jones and Clark. 

What I feel is often lost behind the infamous Austin on the wing saga was the rest of that backline:

  1. Jonny Lomax
  2. Jermaine McGillvary
  3. Jack Hughes 
  4. Jake Connor
  5. Blake Austin
  6. Gareth Widdop
  7. Jackson Hastings

That is absolutely dire and Jerry was the only one worth anything on the tour (as was often the case but nonetheless), if anyone suggest Jackson Hastings for the England squad simply link them the full replay of this game that is available on NRL.com.

And your point being? You say they are dire but these are some of the very best players in SL (the best in Hastings case who was MOS).

The is the PNG spine in that game:

1.Alex Johnstone 

6.Laybutt

7.Boas

9.Puara

Now that is what a ‘dire’ spine looks like! I can’t even find the first names of the 6, 7 (it might be Watson who I think plays in league 1) or 9.

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16 minutes ago, AB90 said:

And your point being? You say they are dire but these are some of the very best players in SL (the best in Hastings case who was MOS).

The is the PNG spine in that game:

1.Alex Johnstone 

6.Laybutt

7.Boas

9.Puara

Now that is what a ‘dire’ spine looks like! I can’t even find the first names of the 6, 7 (it might be Watson who I think plays in league 1) or 9.

It wasn't intended to take away from that result, GB never looked like the best team in any of the games on that tour and PNG was the ultimate culmination of that. 

But the 2022 edition of England isn't going to be comparable to that at all, Lomax is the only possible remainder from that backline. Also have to have a laugh at Hughes, Austin and Connor at centre being "among the best players in SL", Bennett lost the plot entirely - hopefully Wane doesn't do the same.

On the initial point re the forward pack, I don't understand calls to pick Hill now that Walmsley is out. He's rarely offered anything at International level and despite a resurgence in club form I can't see him translating that to Internationals at 34.

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1 hour ago, AB90 said:

And any thoughts on the below pack that got dominated by PNG (plus Tonga & NZ on that tour)?

8.Chris Hill

9.Josh Hodgson

10.Tom Burgess

11.John Bateman 

12.Eliot Whitehead

13.James Graham

Subs: Luke Thompson, Alex Walsmley, Josh Jones, Daryl Clark

Yep. Most are cold weather English men and when they lost their captain early in the first half they where always going to struggle a man down in that scorching PNG heat and hard ground. PNG played awesome and did a massive amount of effective dummy half running that set them on their back foot for a lot of the game. Kyle Laybutt had the game of his life and kicked like a champion. England were down on confidence PNG were up. A lot of the PNG team played together at the PNG Hunters who play in the feeder competition to the NRL.

 

Basically it was just a really tough day for GB because of a lot of factors.

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1 hour ago, Mojo said:

 But you've also got to realise international rugby league in the past is way different to now. The pacific talent 10 years ago is way different now. Tonga and Samoa at the 2013 world cup were made up of players missing out on the Kiwis and kangaroos squad and some were just picked from reserve grade. But now most of those star players are playing for the island nation and the quality of players in the island nations is on another level. So you can't bring up the past results when in the past the international game was dominated by 3 nations and the island nations only played literally every 4 years at the world cup.

I'm still struggling to understand how you can argue about the potential result of a match or England's prospects in the World Cup when you don't watch the competition from which most of the players are drawn.

I wouldn't even attempt to make a prediction on a game when I haven’t seen half of the players in action.

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"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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2 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I'm still struggling to understand how you can argue about the potential result of a match or England's prospects in the World Cup when you don't watch the competition from which most of the players are drawn.

I wouldn't even attempt to make a prediction on a game when I haven’t seen half of the players in action.

Exactly, I am Aussie and go for Australia but I do watch the super league (a game or two every round). I am not biased at all towards the NRL or super league I just see it how I see it.

All of these other aussies who say England is and the super league is when they have never watch them play really annoy’s me. From everything’s I’ve seen I rate the super league’s difference from the NRL to be about the same as the premier league vs Ligue 1 or Serie A.

That being said there are a lot of world class players in that competition and a few who could give Australia or New Zealand nightmares.

Personally I think with the home advantage England have a massive chance at winning the whole thing and I’d would very suprised if England don’t Steam past Samoa and Tonga to the final.

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17 minutes ago, SydneyRoosters said:

Exactly, I am Aussie and go for Australia but I do watch the super league (a game or two every round). I am not biased at all towards the NRL or super league I just see it how I see it.

All of these other aussies who say England is and the super league is when they have never watch them play really annoy’s me. From everything’s I’ve seen I rate the super league’s difference from the NRL to be about the same as the premier league vs Ligue 1 or Serie A.

That being said there are a lot of world class players in that competition and a few who could give Australia or New Zealand nightmares.

Personally I think with the home advantage England have a massive chance at winning the whole thing and I’d would very suprised if England don’t Steam past Samoa and Tonga to the final.

I am less bullish.  We have some top quality players (but a lack of depth).  We can certainly beat either Tonga or Samoa on home soil but they will be very tough games.

There is a chance we can win the whole thing but everything would have to go our way and the winners of the Australia / New Zealand half of the draw are massive favourites. 

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"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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Tevita Pangai Junior is supposedly the latest player to pull out of the WC with Tonga, an immense shame because he was a big part of the side that beat Australia but they have more than enough depth in his positions.

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3 hours ago, SydneyRoosters said:

@Mojowhats you’re issue with my statement. PNG have upset the likes of New Zealand GB In the past. Name one team Samoa has upset.

Wales.

Wales won, but it was a brutal game, probably the hardest I've ever seen. Wales  players were totally battered and bruised at the end.

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/53338840

Under Scrutiny by the Right-On Thought Police

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1 hour ago, UTK said:

Tevita Pangai Junior is supposedly the latest player to pull out of the WC with Tonga, an immense shame because he was a big part of the side that beat Australia but they have more than enough depth in his positions.

Hopefully this Free’s up a spot for Agnatius Paasi I’d be surprised if he doesn’t make it.

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