Fri 9th Sept: SL: Catalans Dragons v Leeds Rhinos KO 20:00 (Sky)

[Dave T]

Just now, Blind side johnny said:

The French players were the problem then?

The French club were the bigger issue yes.  As they have been consistently. 

Didn't Gausch serve a ban this year,  which is almost unprecedented in RL?

 

[Davo5]

19 minutes ago, ATLANTISMAN said:

Warrington won't be happy first 5/6 matches out:(

I’ve seen better props than Dudson playing in the NCL,he was bang average at Wigan & has continued that form at the Dragons.

[Tommygilf]

5 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I did think I had read something.  He would likely have been banned for the tournament now anyway 

I think he along with Ben Flower weren't happy with the amateurism at the WRL and the matches being played iirc. 

[Barley Mow]

15 minutes ago, ATLANTISMAN said:

I was sat right in front and as headbutts go it was more a threat than a headbutt (He just lost his head:)

P  

Lost his head? That sounds like a pretty substantial headbutt to me! 

[Blind side johnny]

13 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The French club were the bigger issue yes.  As they have been consistently. 

Didn't Gausch serve a ban this year,  which is almost unprecedented in RL?

 

My point is that people trying to label it as a "French mentality" are simply wrong and borderline racist. The individual players at fault were not French; it may be an issue within the club but trying to label it as a problem with "the French" is simply wrong and possibly bigoted.

[Hvy wg]

Just saw a clip showing Bentley elbowing McMeeken in the face that went unpunished.

[Dave T]

24 minutes ago, Blind side johnny said:

My point is that people trying to label it as a "French mentality" are simply wrong and borderline racist. The individual players at fault were not French; it may be an issue within the club but trying to label it as a problem with "the French" is simply wrong and possibly bigoted.

I asked about French sporting culture,  because it has absolutely been a long term issue for Catalans.  Now that may be just a thing personal to them because Gausch is that way inclined,  hence my question. 

Whether it is a French sporting issue or whether it is simply Catalans Dragons,  when that comes from the top it can be damaging. It's easier to go with a victim mentality (I note that McNamara is moaning about the ref flying with Leeds)  than to address issues. 

We regularly have discussions here about Yorkshire,  Lancs,  London,  we talk about Aussie and North American sports culture without going down the bigot route.

Edit to add.  I take the comments on board though,  and maybe the question was clumsy,  and your point certainly wasn't the angle I was coming from.  But different nations do have different sporting cultures. 

Edited September 10, 2022 by Dave T

[David Dockhouse Host]

2 hours ago, sweaty craiq said:

For me all I ask a ref to be consistent at PTB antics/speed, policing the 10m and keeping the markers square. If he has to issue a few or a lot of penalties in the first 10/15 mins then so be it - you will always get a better game afterwards

That sounds sensible but I'm not sure that really happens. The ref has set the precedent if they blow a lot early on. Players know and start to play for it even more knowing the ref has been handing out penalties.

Sadly you would think blowing lots early would tidy the game up but it seems to have the reverse affect.

[LeeF]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

This was an area where Child was too passive.  He allowed Garcia to rant and stayed very calm.  As I say,  calmness is a good thing,  but you can use a firm voice and remain calm. I find that Child looks like he is ignoring things as he literally has no expression on his face and just seems to look past the incident playing out in front of him. 

In this instance he had done a good job of explaining to Garcia why he was binning his player,  so Garcia was doing nothing more than strop.  A firm warning really was needed from Child at that point. 

I agree. At the time I thought it was time to bin Garcia although that may have escalated things as it was clear that Catalans had “lost it” by then. Maybe that’s why Child was so passive.

The key issue from the match is that the players from both sides were of the mindset to niggle and react and it is highly likely that whatever action the referee had taken would have had zero effect. It was one of those games

[Dave T]

Just now, LeeF said:

I agree. At the time I thought it was time to bin Garcia although that may have escalated things as it was clear that Catalans had “lost it” by then. Maybe that’s why Child was so passive.

The key issue from the match is that the players from both sides were of the mindset to niggle and react and it is highly likely that whatever action the referee had taken would have had zero effect. It was one of those games

One of the challenges Catalans have is that they have certain players who basically can't be calmed down.  Mcilorum is one of the worst,  but Tomkins also isn't far off him.  

It's not unusual for Mcilorum to carry out serious foul play shortly after a ref has read the riot act and supposedly calmed things down. 

[LeeF]

20 minutes ago, Hvy wg said:

Just saw a clip showing Bentley elbowing McMeeken in the face that went unpunished.

A video after the event from the comfort of your chair probably with a number of viewings. It’s easy to pick things up isn’t it? Maybe the MRP should adopt this as a working practice?

Not knowing exactly which incident you are referring to it may well have been missed on the 1 view at full speed etc but if so then it’s just one of those things and if you are correct and it is deemed more than an accidental clash then I’m sure the MRP and Disciplinary Panel will deal with it appropriately. 

[LeeF]

4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

One of the challenges Catalans have is that they have certain players who basically can't be calmed down.  Mcilorum is one of the worst,  but Tomkins also isn't far off him.  

It's not unusual for Mcilorum to carry out serious foul play shortly after a ref has read the riot act and supposedly calmed things down. 

It’s a mindset or culture issue and at a professional level is just stupid. It’s the type of thing you see a fair bit at amateur level and even at that level it’s plain stupid 

[johnh1]

3 hours ago, SalfordSlim said:

There did look to be a few fans lobbing their beers in the direction of Leeds players when they went over to the Leeds fans to celebrate. Catalans fans are notorious for getting on the ref's back (even more so than Headingley south standers believe it or not!) but they actually took the hiding we got off them really well last month. 2 or 3 fans randomly even came up to us and applauded us and shook our hands after the game.

I'm assuming some of the on-pitch antics from both teams had a lot to do with some pent up fan aggression (not condoning it in any way btw as some of our own fans have been known to throw the odd beer in the past as well).

Same here Salford Slim. Nothing but a good vibe from them 3 weeks ago. But then they knew they were in the play offs at that point.

[Damien]

54 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

Priors was nothing, he accidentally connected with tomkins head whilst standing up, Tomkins then play acted with a dive.

You must have missed the bit where he walked forwards and lowered his head. Yes Tomkins made a meal and whilst no where near as bad as Dudson it wasn't just nothing either.

[Chrispmartha]

11 minutes ago, Damien said:

You must have missed the bit where he walked forwards and lowered his head. Yes Tomkins made a meal and whilst no where near as bad as Dudson it wasn't just nothing either.

I didn’t miss it, it was nothing if Tomkins hadn’t have thrown himself to the ground we wouldn’t even be mentioning it

[Hvy wg]

20 minutes ago, LeeF said:

A video after the event from the comfort of your chair probably with a number of viewings. It’s easy to pick things up isn’t it? Maybe the MRP should adopt this as a working practice?

Not knowing exactly which incident you are referring to it may well have been missed on the 1 view at full speed etc but if so then it’s just one of those things and if you are correct and it is deemed more than an accidental clash then I’m sure the MRP and Disciplinary Panel will deal with it appropriately. 

Why are you taking it like that? I was just pointing to an event.

Youre right my chair is very comfortable, yes. 

 

[LeeF]

7 minutes ago, Hvy wg said:

Why are you taking it like that? I was just pointing to an event.

Youre right my chair is very comfortable, yes. 

 

Maybe because of the way I read your post although even now I’m struggling to see what else you may be trying to say

[Damien]

13 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

I didn’t miss it, it was nothing if Tomkins hadn’t have thrown himself to the ground we wouldn’t even be mentioning it

No Prior would have properly made contact. Tomkins with his theatrics did Prior a favour.

Edited September 10, 2022 by Damien

[Wolford6]

If James Childs never gets another big game, it will still be too soon.

[fieldofclothofgold]

Regards Catalans and people saying they should be in SL .well if attendances are anything to go by look at today's  rowd compared with lasfnights .

[redjonn]

43 minutes ago, David Dockhouse Host said:

That sounds sensible but I'm not sure that really happens. The ref has set the precedent if they blow a lot early on. Players know and start to play for it even more knowing the ref has been handing out penalties.

Sadly you would think blowing lots early would tidy the game up but it seems to have the reverse affect.

yep,

also I note the early sin-binning of a Catalan player had absolutely no impact of subsequent behaviour of Catalan players.

Its all very well some on here trying to point out how the ref missed opportunities to add his authority but all through the game he was telling and explaining his rational.  Even when he reinforced with penalties it didn't make one iota as players and in particular Catalan were not listening.

Catalan chose to bring niggle into the game as a means of trying disrupt the dominants teams control as they were not able too otherwise.   Plus if I remember their was a series of high shot penalties against Catalan early on, 3 on the bounce, it didn't have any impact.

As I said earlier its all very well saying the ref should have done this or that... he did and Catalan chose to ignore and spent the time seemingly complaining every decision.

As had been pointed out the first half lasted 58minutes and that was primary due to the tactics of Catalan.

[Damien]

4 hours ago, redjonn said:

yep,

also I note the early sin-binning of a Catalan player had absolutely no impact of subsequent behaviour of Catalan players.

Its all very well some on here trying to point out how the ref missed opportunities to add his authority but all through the game he was telling and explaining his rational.  Even when he reinforced with penalties it didn't make one iota as players and in particular Catalan were not listening.

Catalan chose to bring niggle into the game as a means of trying disrupt the dominants teams control as they were not able too otherwise.   Plus if I remember their was a series of high shot penalties against Catalan early on, 3 on the bounce, it didn't have any impact.

As I said earlier its all very well saying the ref should have done this or that... he did and Catalan chose to ignore and spent the time seemingly complaining every decision.

As had been pointed out the first half lasted 58minutes and that was primary due to the tactics of Catalan.

This is awfully one sided.

Child didn't do much to Leeds though did he? Leeds got away with plenty and sin binning one Catalans player and not taking action against any Leeds player simply inflamed the situation more and added to the Catalans sense of injustice.

Yes Catalans were a disgrace, and not for the first time lost the plot. They need a real clear out and fresh start. However dont ignore that Leeds were no angels either. They were very niggly too.

Two grubby teams in a volatile atmosphere with referee who didn't stamp his authority resulted in the match that we got. It's quite right to say blame the players, and yes the players are at fault and should be punished accordingly, but a referee needs to control that and Child didn't.

Edited September 10, 2022 by Damien

[MyMrsWouldPreferSinfield]

6 hours ago, JohnM said:

Didn't see it hear the game, but from the posts on here, it sounds like the game was Cats returning to their indiscipline of old and Rhinos continuing their challenge to Leeds United as the team in the Premier League with the worst record of indiscipline.

Ohh dear John you’re at it again with your Leeds United tripe!

Leeds United have been back in the PL for two seasons plus the start of this season. In that time they have picked up 4 red cards! This is the same as Man City and Wolves.

Only a handful of clubs have less; Manchester United 3, Crystal Palace 3, Spurs 3, Liverpool 2 and Leicester 1.

In the same period Arsenal have collected 9, Everton 8, Brighton 8, Aston Villa 7, West Ham 6, Newcastle 6, Southampton 6 and Chelsea 6.

West Brom 4, Fulham 3, Sheffield United 3, Brentford 3, Watford 3, Burnley 2, Norwich 1 have played at least one season less.

You posted a Talksport article the other day, if you actually listened to it they were gushing about Leeds.

This anti Leeds narrative is embarrassing. The type of rubbish glory supporters come out with.

[Futtocks]

 

[JohnM]

2 hours ago, MyMrsWouldPreferSinfield said:

Ohh dear John you’re at it again with your Leeds United tripe!

Leeds United have been back in the PL for two seasons plus the start of this season. In that time they have picked up 4 red cards! This is the same as Man City and Wolves.

Only a handful of clubs have less; Manchester United 3, Crystal Palace 3, Spurs 3, Liverpool 2 and Leicester 1.

In the same period Arsenal have collected 9, Everton 8, Brighton 8, Aston Villa 7, West Ham 6, Newcastle 6, Southampton 6 and Chelsea 6.

West Brom 4, Fulham 3, Sheffield United 3, Brentford 3, Watford 3, Burnley 2, Norwich 1 have played at least one season less.

You posted a Talksport article the other day, if you actually listened to it they were gushing about Leeds.

This anti Leeds narrative is embarrassing. The type of rubbish glory supporters come out with.

Hope this helps. https://live-the-analyst.pantheonsite.io/2022/06/most-cards-in-a-premier-league-season-leeds/