Alex Walmsley to miss Saints' run in.

[DG70]

3 hours ago, GUBRATS said:

Wigan will win the GF 

Bllx

Agreed, against Salford, but will be close.

[Harry Stottle]

7 hours ago, jim_57 said:

Depends how seeding (if any) was done.

If based on their qualification which came from the last World Cup it would be Australia 1, England 2, Tonga & Fiji 3/4.

If based on ranking I’m not sure but there is a good chance Aus & NZ weren’t 1 and 2 at the time the draw was done.

The rankings are a load of brown smelly stuff, never mind saying GB and England are any different they are virtually one and the same and the last games GB played was in '19, anyone with any sense of RL knows present day Aus and NZ are 1 & 2.

[jim_57]

56 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

The rankings are a load of brown smelly stuff, never mind saying GB and England are any different they are virtually one and the same and the last games GB played was in '19, anyone with any sense of RL knows present day Aus and NZ are 1 & 2.

Sure everyone knows that, but seedings have to be based off something not just how strong a team is on paper. NZ missed the semis last time, Tonga have beaten all of the big 3 so it’s fair to assume Australia & NZ might not have been officially considered 1&2 at the time the draw was done.

[UTK]

1 hour ago, Harry Stottle said:

The rankings are a load of brown smelly stuff, never mind saying GB and England are any different they are virtually one and the same and the last games GB played was in '19, anyone with any sense of RL knows present day Aus and NZ are 1 & 2.

Nonetheless Australia is currently ranked 4th and the Kiwis 1st so that would explain seeding on the same side of the draw, if the Kangaroos played more often the rankings would likely be more reflective but they don't. That's not the fault of the rankings system it's the fault of the ARLC.

Now Australia will likely have a semi-final v NZ which could easily see them miss the RLWC final (or top 2 when finals weren't played) for the first time since the inaugural tournament in 1954. I hope we get demolished by NZ in the semi and drop the Kangaroos even further in the international pecking order so that some change can occur.

[ghost crayfish]

Massive loss for England, this. It also reduces the big advantage St Helens have over Salford, which is in the middle.

But for England, what are the alternatives? What was Chris Hill's late season form like?

[Mojo]

14 hours ago, SydneyRoosters said:

He should be back the quarter finals though I’m pretty sure. but it still is a massive lose for the Samoa game Radley really has to step up and contain Papali’i and Paulo.

First time I watched walmsley was on the GB tour. I didn't know who he was but I was fairly impressed with the way he played. He wasn't taking a backward step against the Tongan forwards and I'm pretty sure he would've done well in the nrl. He is a huge loss for England. And Radley is only one man and he can't do everything. Luke Thompson I like at the bulldogs. He had a awesome season for the bulldogs last year. But he was out of form this year. England's forward pack will definitely have their work cut out against samoa. If the forwards gets dominated the English spine would struggle to do anything. 

[Mojo]

14 hours ago, SydneyRoosters said:

He should be back the quarter finals though I’m pretty sure. but it still is a massive lose for the Samoa game Radley really has to step up and contain Papali’i and Paulo.

First time I watched walmsley was on the GB tour. I didn't know who he was but I was fairly impressed with the way he played. He wasn't taking a backward step against the Tongan forwards and I'm pretty sure he would've done well in the nrl. He is a huge loss for England. And Radley is only one man and he can't do everything. Luke Thompson I like at the bulldogs. He had a awesome season for the bulldogs last year. But he was out of form this year. England's forward pack will definitely have their work cut out against samoa. If the forwards gets dominated the English spine would struggle to do anything. 

[Mojo]

14 hours ago, SydneyRoosters said:

He should be back the quarter finals though I’m pretty sure. but it still is a massive lose for the Samoa game Radley really has to step up and contain Papali’i and Paulo.

First time I watched walmsley was on the GB tour. I didn't know who he was but I was fairly impressed with the way he played. He wasn't taking a backward step against the Tongan forwards and I'm pretty sure he would've done well in the nrl. He is a huge loss for England. And Radley is only one man and he can't do everything. Luke Thompson I like at the bulldogs. He had a awesome season for the bulldogs last year. But he was out of form this year. England's forward pack will definitely have their work cut out against samoa. If the forwards gets dominated the English spine would struggle to do anything.

[Mojo]

The forward pack england might face against samoa

8 Junior Paulo

10 Josh Aloiai

11 Luciano Leilua

12 Jayd'n Sua

13 Raymond Faitala-Mariner

Bench

Spencer Leniu

Josh Papali'i

Martin Taupau

Nanai might get picked for samoa. I don't think he'll make the aussie team only because he's still young and aussie are so stacked with second rowers who are proven on the big stage.

[UTK]

IMO Walmsley makes the decision re the makeup of the bench a bit easier and the guy who should be chosen to step up to the plate is Mike McMeeken, he had a brilliant stint at Catalans early/mid-season where he was forced to play around a month at prop due to injuries. During that stretch I don't think it would have been unfair to say he was one of if not the best prop in the competition, unfortunately he had a poor time with injury for the rest of the season but he is a high quality player both on the middle and the edge.

He also replaces some of the physicality that Walmsley brings with Walmsley and McMeeken standing at 196cm and 195cm tall respectively, while not as physically large as Walmsley, McMeeken is still a very strongly built forward while maintaining strong mobility as a preferred edge backrower.

IMO: 8. Oledski 10. Thompson 11. Whitehead 12. Bateman 13. Knowles 15. Burgess 16. Radley 17. McMeeken

Starting/Bench props are interchangeable based on preference and gameplan but I would ideally keep Burgess on the bench as it's what he's used to. I had Whitehead out of the side and would be happy with other backrow suggestions (Batchelor/Watkins/Farrell in unlikely event he's fit) but recent form for the Raiders has granted him a revisit. 

[ghost crayfish]

1 hour ago, UTK said:

IMO Walmsley makes the decision re the makeup of the bench a bit easier and the guy who should be chosen to step up to the plate is Mike McMeeken, he had a brilliant stint at Catalans early/mid-season where he was forced to play around a month at prop due to injuries. During that stretch I don't think it would have been unfair to say he was one of if not the best prop in the competition, unfortunately he had a poor time with injury for the rest of the season but he is a high quality player both on the middle and the edge.

He also replaces some of the physicality that Walmsley brings with Walmsley and McMeeken standing at 196cm and 195cm tall respectively, while not as physically large as Walmsley, McMeeken is still a very strongly built forward while maintaining strong mobility as a preferred edge backrower.

IMO: 8. Oledski 10. Thompson 11. Whitehead 12. Bateman 13. Knowles 15. Burgess 16. Radley 17. McMeeken

Starting/Bench props are interchangeable based on preference and gameplan but I would ideally keep Burgess on the bench as it's what he's used to. I had Whitehead out of the side and would be happy with other backrow suggestions (Batchelor/Watkins/Farrell in unlikely event he's fit) but recent form for the Raiders has granted him a revisit. 

Agree with all of that. McMeeken on the bench gives flexibility because he can cover the prop rotation or, if there's an injury, move out to the edge. It means they can have a dummy half, or maybe a utility back like Welsby, at 14. 

[MattSantos]

5 hours ago, Mojo said:

The forward pack england might face against samoa

8 Junior Paulo

10 Josh Aloiai

11 Luciano Leilua

12 Jayd'n Sua

13 Raymond Faitala-Mariner

Bench

Spencer Leniu

Josh Papali'i

Martin Taupau

Nanai might get picked for samoa. I don't think he'll make the aussie team only because he's still young and aussie are so stacked with second rowers who are proven on the big stage.

Nothing scary in there.

We should be beating Samoa relatively comfy

[SalfordSlim]

6 hours ago, ghost crayfish said:

Massive loss for England, this. It also reduces the big advantage St Helens have over Salford, which is in the middle.

But for England, what are the alternatives? What was Chris Hill's late season form like?

Walmsley is a huge loss but Saints didn't hammer Salford down the middle in the game in the game in July.

Saints pack that day...

Walmsley

Lussick

Lees

Sironen

Batchelor

Knowles

Bench: Paasi, Bell, LMS

This myth that Salford have got a sh*t pack is exactly that, a myth. Yes the backline gets all the credit but I can probably only think of 2/3 occasions this year where the forwards have been dominated. They're not big names in the RL world but they ain't the type of lads who'll take a backward step against anyone.

 

 

 

[Mojo]

1 hour ago, MattSantos said:

Nothing scary in there.

We should be beating Samoa relatively comfy

Are you talking about the kangaroos? Because you're definitely not talking about the English team lol that samoan forward pack on their day would walk over england easy. What's your English forward pack?

[MattSantos]

1 hour ago, Mojo said:

Are you talking about the kangaroos? Because you're definitely not talking about the English team lol that samoan forward pack on their day would walk over england easy. What's your English forward pack?

Sigh. Lets have a chat November time. I'm incredibly bored of this Aussie centric arrogance.

 

[dkw]

32 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

Sigh. Lets have a chat November time. I'm incredibly bored of this Aussie centric arrogance.

 

Sorry mate, they play in the NRL so are instantly the bestest, dems de rules....

[RP London]

34 minutes ago, dkw said:

Sorry mate, they play in the NRL so are instantly the bestest, dems de rules....

evidenced by "they'll walk over you" followed quickly by "whos your forward pack?" so they'll definitely beat you but I dont actually know who is in your side or how good they are.. 

well played! 

Edited September 14, 2022 by RP London

[ghost crayfish]

Given most of you seem to think you're no chance, you can't blame Aussies for thinking likewise...

That said, I DO think you're a good chance, actually. But as always, depends on selections, fitness, form, luck etc. 

[JohnM]

Don't like to see anyone injured. Saints will miss him, but more importantly as far as I am concerned, so will the World Cup. 

[Mojo]

11 hours ago, RP London said:

evidenced by "they'll walk over you" followed quickly by "whos your forward pack?" so they'll definitely beat you but I dont actually know who is in your side or how good they are.. 

well played! 

Geez can you blame me for doubting it? Your English forward pack didn't really do much for GB against PNG and Tonga. I wouldn't be so confident if I am a English fan, and losing Walmsley is a massive loss.

[Mojo]

GB forward pack that played tonga and PNG

8 Tom Burgess

10 Chris Hill

11 Eliiot Whitehead

12 John Bateman (dally m second rower that year)

13 James Graham

14 Luke Thompson

15 Alex Walmsley 

16 Joe Philbin

That's one of the strongest forward packs in the world and lost convincingly to png and Tonga. So saying you would beat Samoa convincingly is laughable. I'm not saying you'll get beaten by samoa but don't expect a easy win at all

[RP London]

7 hours ago, Mojo said:

Geez can you blame me for doubting it? Your English forward pack didn't really do much for GB against PNG and Tonga. I wouldn't be so confident if I am a English fan, and losing Walmsley is a massive loss.

How can you have an opinion people would respect without having the basic knowledge to form the opinion.. The GB tour was 3 years ago, was an utter shambles and those players wouldn't play the same under Wane anyway... 

Your post said it all... you're forwards are rubbish, Who's in your forwards?

 

Edited September 15, 2022 by RP London

[Mojo]

4 minutes ago, RP London said:

 

Your post said it all... you're forwards are rubbish,

 

Now your just twisting what I said to something negative it was a simple question he said "nothing scary there we should beat Samoa comfortably. So I presented the facts and y'all don't like it? You love to bring up the 2017 game against samoa as evidence that england are better but you get all defensive when I bring up the GB tour "3 years ago" geez it was a simple question what's your forward pack now compared to the one 3 years ago? Was the question that bad?

[RP London]

2 minutes ago, Mojo said:

Now your just twisting what I said to something negative it was a simple question he said "nothing scary there we should beat Samoa comfortably. So I presented the facts and y'all don't like it? You love to bring up the 2017 game against samoa as evidence that england are better but you get all defensive when I bring up the GB tour "3 years ago" geez it was a simple question what's your forward pack now compared to the one 3 years ago? Was the question that bad?

You didnt present any facts because you dont have them.. "That Samoan pack would walk over England easy" but you dont know who the England forward pack is going to be so you cannot possibly come to that conclusion if you have no clue.. You obviously pay so little attention to the English game that if anyone gave you 6 names and a bench you still wouldnt be able to make an intelligent conclusion on that so what is the point... There is even a thread on this forum that is talking about the England team and you are still asking that question!?! go and find the information yourself its really not that hard!

Typical really, cant be bothered to research but I want my opinion heard and its going to be controversial as I dont actually know what I am talking about.. what an age we live in!

[Mojo]

4 minutes ago, RP London said:

You didnt present any facts because you dont have them.. "That Samoan pack would walk over England easy" but you dont know who the England forward pack is going to be so you cannot possibly come to that conclusion if you have no clue.. You obviously pay so little attention to the English game that if anyone gave you 6 names and a bench you still wouldnt be able to make an intelligent conclusion on that so what is the point... There is even a thread on this forum that is talking about the England team and you are still asking that question!?! go and find the information yourself its really not that hard!

Typical really, cant be bothered to research but I want my opinion heard and its going to be controversial as I dont actually know what I am talking about.. what an age we live in!

Go have a nap because you're turning into a karen over a simple question. If you don't like debating and have a talk about rugby league your on the wrong forum you idiot